Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in CU?

[HappyHippyDad]

I shall be changing a CU soon (same thread as just started!) and it is a TT.

I'll be using a wiska sprint gland to hold the tails (25mm) and main earth in place as they enter the CU (from the bottom) but I dont really see how this is going to help with respect to the possibility (however remote) of the tails coming loose in the CU and making contact with the CU.

I can just feel Lee's fingers hovering above the key board ready to shout 'hagar!!' , however, I have a wylex board to install without pre-equipped tail holders.

Any ideas for holding the tails in place as they enter the main switch, just like the clips in the hagar board? I expect something could be used, cable cleats etc, but I'm also wondering if there is an actual product for this specifically?

Perhaps this is a little over the top, but It is a bit odd that it is all of a sudden ok to fit a metal board for a TT so I would like to do as much as possible to (within budget - customer doesn't want extra expense of a seperate s type RCD as isolator) keep safe.

 

[Andy78]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

completely unfounded worries. As long as you form the tails right, crop them correctly, set them and tighten them correctly you will have no worries with loose tails at all.
As for them leaping from their terminals and touching the board casing, I'm not sure how that would happen short of an earthquake, building collapse, or perhaps powerful telekinetic interference.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

completely unfounded worries. As long as you form the tails right, crop them correctly, set them and tighten them correctly you will have no worries with loose tails at all.
As for them leaping from their terminals and touching the board casing, I'm not sure how that would happen short of an earthquake, building collapse, or perhaps powerful telekinetic interference.

So let me get this right Andy, you're basically saying a good idea in prinicipal but perhaps a tad unnecessary :biggrin:

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Perhaps I should start a poll for how many times the tails have come loose and made the board live.

Has anyone ever experienced a live board due to this?

I'm still going to think of something clever as I think the hagar clips look pretty! :smiley2:

 

[Andy78]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

So let me get this right Andy, you're basically saying a good idea in prinicipal but perhaps a tad unnecessary :biggrin:

Nope, I'm saying totally unnecessary.

 

[Darkwood]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Any cable termination should be sound and secure, if movement of the tails external to the CU would act direct on the terminals (IE .. If they are not clamped/clipped in anyway) then this isn't considered as conforming to the reg's.

Personally I just put them through a nylon stuffing gland, 32mm for 16mm tails or 40mm for 25mm tails, any external movement of the tails would then act on the gland and not transfer to the terminals thus the termination should remain tight and secure.

 

[mechelec]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

completely unfounded worries. As long as you form the tails right, crop them correctly, set them and tighten them correctly you will have no worries with loose tails at all.
As for them leaping from their terminals and touching the board casing, I'm not sure how that would happen short of an earthquake, building collapse, or perhaps powerful telekinetic interference.

Or a particularly rough meter fitter.

i have seen on several occasions when a meter has been fitted the tails have settled and become loose in the CU main switch.
i thought the tails had to be rcd protected before they entered a metal enclosure ( class 2 construction) ? Hence the plastic enclosure or an upfront rcd in plastic enclosure.
regs book at work so I can't check.

 

[telectrix]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

fit tails.tighten properly. apply gorilla glue. they's going nowhere then. :24:

 

[NDG Elecs]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

I sometimes put a cable tie round the tails around 50mm from where they go into the main switch. The likelihood of the tails coming out are negligible to nil in my view. As long as they are not trying to spring out when you put them in then any bends formed will keep them right there. And as mentioned the glanding will reduce possible future stresses on them. If you feel so inclined you could arrange to pop back in a year to nip up any loosening that may occur. That could either comfort or worry the customer though!!

 

[rich.250]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

I shall be changing a CU soon (same thread as just started!) and it is a TT.

I'll be using a wiska sprint gland to hold the tails (25mm) and main earth in place as they enter the CU (from the bottom) but I dont really see how this is going to help with respect to the possibility (however remote) of the tails coming loose in the CU and making contact with the CU.

I can just feel Lee's fingers hovering above the key board ready to shout 'hagar!!' , however, I have a wylex board to install without pre-equipped tail holders.

Any ideas for holding the tails in place as they enter the main switch, just like the clips in the hagar board? I expect something could be used, cable cleats etc, but I'm also wondering if there is an actual product for this specifically?

Perhaps this is a little over the top, but It is a bit odd that it is all of a sudden ok to fit a metal board for a TT so I would like to do as much as possible to (within budget - customer doesn't want extra expense of a seperate s type RCD as isolator) keep safe.

If it's a dual RCD board you will need a s type rcd in knee installed due to the increased risk of flexible conductors making the casing of the board live if one should come loose.
As they have no fault protection.
I have seen this on a couple of occasions in the past on TT systems.
(But we do have a lot of rough installs where I am lol)

We to use Hager and you can pick up a time delay RCD for £55+vat.
I believe Wylex ones can be found cheaper.

 

[Midwest]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

If it's a dual RCD board you will need a s type rcd in knee installed due to the increased risk of flexible conductors making the casing of the board live if one should come loose.
As they have no fault protection.
I have seen this on a couple of occasions in the past on TT systems.
(But we do have a lot of rough installs where I am lol)

We to use Hager and you can pick up a time delay RCD for £55+vat.
I believe Wylex ones can be found cheaper.

In lieu of the isolator.

 

[rich.250]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

In lieu of the isolator.

Yes in a domestic board it's the only choice.

Like this DB change one of my guys done recently.

 

[Midwest]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Or a particularly rough meter fitter.

i have seen on several occasions when a meter has been fitted the tails have settled and become loose in the CU main switch.
i thought the tails had to be rcd protected before they entered a metal enclosure ( class 2 construction) ? Hence the plastic enclosure or an upfront rcd in plastic enclosure.
regs book at work so I can't check.

Nought in the regs book, as this I think was not thought about with inception of reg 421.1.201. There are some suggested installs in the yellow OSG, and the Harrogate Elex vid, discusses the subject. Suffice to say, the recommendations from the 'grown ups', is as long as the tails enter metal CU with bespoke gland (aka Wiska Sprint, there are others), 6181y cable is used, good workmanship is applied, there is little likelihood of tails shorting with metal enclosure. What is rather as prior to this, you would get time in the tower for using metal CU without aforementioned standalone s type. Talking of which, if you do use upfront s type, this is seen as 'similar switchgear' and has to be metal. Although Wylex has other views.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Yes in a domestic board it's the only choice.

Like this DB change one of my guys done recently.

Nice neat job. No tail gland though to stop abrasion? Cant see properly on my phone but has a knockout been removed for the tails to enter?

 

[rich.250]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Yes they come through a grommeted 25mm KO.
They are clipped outside the DB so I see no issue there.

 

[telectrix]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

how can that RCD as main switch protect the incoming tails? a fault on those tails is going to be before the RCD.

 

[Midwest]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Might be wrong, but I think the idea is to protect the single insulate cables between S type and 30ma RCD shorting inside CU, that being the 'grown ups' idea. Damaged to tails, is negated by suitable gland.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Love the visible copper in the manufacturer's conductors.

 

[mattg4321]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Love the visible copper in the manufacturer's conductors.

That annoys me with the Hager boards. I normally cut it back slightly so no visible copper.

 

[Clive P]

Re: Any good ideas for holding the tails (clips etc) as they enter the main switch in

Hi,

You can buy the tails clamp ( Hager ) for a tenner, don't know if it will fit your board though. Looks like they just screw to the backplate, but I've never used one so I am only guessing

Regards.