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AntiguaCasa

Hi, I recently purchased an espresso machine that the previous owner said he couldnt remember how to wire after taking it apart for cleaning. So after a few days of not finding much relevant information on the machine or the control board, I spent the next few looking at datasheets and visual and electrical inspection of the copper paths on the PCBs half dozen times to make my own diagram of circuit board and espresso machine.

So my confusion is that it looks like the only way to wire the machine is so that the control board is switching neutral.

And I'm just not used to seeing this. I did read on a few other posts that some French and Italian manufacturers do wire appliances this way. So maybe this is how its supposed to be?

I thought about just swapping the hot and neutral wires around but the wiring to the components is asymmetrical and so it doesn't appear to work this way.

To get hot switching at the circuit I can swap the outbound wires at the DPST power switch, where i have the hot black going in and then powering the previous neutral network of white wires and vice versa. But the obvious way the colored wires go together says this really isn't the manufacturers intent.

Im hoping someone can take a look at the diagram I've made and explain why it would or should be neutral switching machine.

I'm guessing that it has something to do with an espresso machine being left on for a few hours and if it was hot switching this would mean that there is live voltage at the circuit and would mean that components might stay energized even when there is no power draw. Would this be bad for the circuit board?

Thanks.

View attachment 36029
 
Hi,your wiring diagram,which i presume,is a manufacturer drawing,seems correct.
I would very strongly advise,not to deviate from that,regardless of how switching arrangements are on alternative machines.

...Or,just go to Starbucks :)
 
@Taylortwocities yah I've done that as well.
Im just looking for some good friendly advice from someone more familiar with neutral switching appliances. There were a few posts here on the subject, which I've read through, and which gives me hope I might chance upon someone who's dealt with this before.

Thanks for the response.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Hi,your wiring diagram,which i presume,is a manufacturer drawing,seems correct.
I would very strongly advise,not to deviate from that,regardless of how switching arrangements are on alternative machines.

...Or,just go to Starbucks :)

Actually I made the schematic after spending a few days staring at the thing. Just hoping someone can explain why it would be neutral switching as it seems like this is the only way to wire the thing.

Spent so much money at starbucks, figured it was about time to invest in a home machine,especially since I was able to get this thing dirt cheap.
 
It is quite common for internal functional switching in appliances to take place in either pole of the circuit. There is no need for it all to be in the hot side as it does not provide safety isolation, and there may be incidental benefits for the designer in terms of PCB layout, creepage between tracks and ground etc. You will also find examples where both sides are switched independently, for example a washing machine fill valve might have a control relay or triac in the hot and the pressure switch contact in the neutral. I don't recommend changing things arbitrarily, reassemble as per the original manufacturers' design.
 
My own mother,must have been aware of the issues surrounding Expresso machine earthing arrangements,as quite often,as i was drinking one she had made,she remarked "Watch out for the coffee grounds..."

(Just sending that across the Atlantic,and seeing how it pans out...);)
 
ifyou'll drink that starbucks swill, you'll drink anything,no matter how it's prepared/switched/perked/marinated/curried/boiled/roast/fried/.
 
It is quite common for internal functional switching in appliances to take place in either pole of the circuit. There is no need for it all to be in the hot side as it does not provide safety isolation, and there may be incidental benefits for the designer in terms of PCB layout, creepage between tracks and ground etc. You will also find examples where both sides are switched independently, for example a washing machine fill valve might have a control relay or triac in the hot and the pressure switch contact in the neutral. I don't recommend changing things arbitrarily, reassemble as per the original manufacturers' design.

I wish I could find the manufacturer's instructions on how to wire this thing. It is about 18 years old and the manufacturers site nor third party sources seem to have any relevant or useful information to the wiring.
Thanks for the info, its affirming my belief that the control circuit expects neutral at pin 10 and hot at pin 8 and is therefore neutral switching. Just seems less safe that the secondary rocker switches would keep live voltage and expect the neutral from the control circuit.

Thanks,.
 
I think the basic EPU diagram on page 45 would be your machine.
 
I recently wired 6 curtain heaters that have fans running off central heating fed units on wiring them up i noticed they had a pipe stat wired so thdy do not operate unless CH pipes are hot.. this pipe stat was also wired through the incoming neutral
 
Page 40 onwards has wiring diagrams.
THanks for the manual. This is for the newer machines I think. My machine i think is pre 2002. The controller in the attached manual is different. Mine is a MFC2SN and the closest one in there is the RL30. But this definitely helps, its more than I was able to find online, it will make a great reference.

Thanks again.
 

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