Ring Continuity fault on RFC

[Midwest]

I came across a fault on a RFC, no continuity on r1 and rn. I had continuity on r2. The work was part of a bathroom refurbishment, where a socket was in part of the extended room. I had to move the socket to and adjacent wall to make it accessible. Discovered the fault before moving it. OCPD is 32amp mcb.

I had a similar fault once before, informed the customer and made a note on the cert. As I don't do EICR's, I just wonder what terminology you guys use. I have said that 'this fault is potentially dangerous and warrants further investigation'. Is that correct terminology, or would you describe it differently?

 

[buzzlightyear]

I have said that 'this fault is potentially dangerous and warrants further investigation'

nothing wrong with that .

 

[westward10]

There is no continuity of the line and neutral conductors at ring final circuit......, DB.......
That is what I enter on an EICR but you could add the consequence of this being conductors are prone to excessive overcurrent which in extreme circumstances could lead to overheating and as you say it is potentially dangerous and warrants urgent attention.
I would Code 2 this.

 

[buzzlightyear]

have you informed the customer about it.

 

[Pete999]

Could it be that you in fact have 2 radials on the same OCPD and are picking up cpc continuity via parallel earth paths, just a thought maybe.

 

[westward10]

Have you done a Zs through the whole circuit because if there is no rcd it may be excessive.

 

[telectrix]

Could it be that you in fact have 2 radials on the same OCPD and are picking up cpc continuity via parallel earth paths, just a thought maybe.

if he has, it's still a problem if on a 32A OCPD.

 

[Pete999]

if he has, it's still a problem if on a 32A OCPD.

I agree Tel, but it's not an impossibility.

 

[Octopus]

I would have discussed it with the client and NOT completed the job - the client needs to understand that its a potentially dangerous fault and needs fixing!

So fault finding to locate and fix faults and / or change MCB to 20A

Either way additional costs on agreed job.....

I see more faults on rings ........ than any other circuits

 

[Midwest]

Client is away on hols. Property has had a recent CU change (A3 but not inspection label). Going back today, to reinstate socket face, so I'll Zs & RCD test.

The CU is a bit of a bodge IMO. Think the old existing cables were too short, and connectors used to extend some cables, but its too tight to tell if the suspect cables are in the connectors. I don't think this is a case of two radials in one 32a ocpd, more likely faulty RFC, but take on board what your saying.

In previous experience, clients don't seem to care, so just covering my bum. Seems my terminology is correct.

 

[sam400]

I ve had this a few times that's why I hate RFCs

Builder says can you just move that quickly - they don't care if it's dangerous or not.

I think you have inherited the fault now unfortunately, as you have modified it.

 

[Des 56]

You don't inherit a fault just because you happened to move a socket
Inform and recommend action,its a problem not of your creation
(installing a extra socket may be a different kettle of fish)

By all means adapt or investigate the circuit to make the installation safe, but done only as part of an engagement by the client after they are informed of their existing problem

 

[sam400]

I ve got a class 1 light fitting in my bathroom it has no CPC can you pop round and move it over a couple of feet?

 

[Midwest]

Just to clarify, the original socket was now in the confines of the extended bathroom. I could have left it in situe, but that would have left in an inaccessible void. So existing cables were moved 90' to new stud wall, now facing into adjoining bathroom. I checked continuity before moving (learnt to do this every time I touch a skt on RFC) and found fault. Could of left it as is, and ignored fault, but that clearly would have been unacceptable. At least cables are now accessible where they are located now

Moving on; installed cables into dry lining box, re-terminated into socket.
Zs = 0.74, RCD test within acceptable readings. My r2 reading was 1.22, so that doesn't compute with a RFC, I guess of approx. 50m max. The new CU was installed in Dec 15, be interested to see what the results were then.

So I'll inform client, and they can decide how to proceed.

 

[mattg4321]

Good luck finding the results from the CU change.

Barry from down the pub probably did that one

 

[Midwest]

Good luck finding the results from the CU change.

Barry from down the pub probably did that one

Yep, strip connectors, tails buried in wall, swa to car charger wid no gland, were just a few things I spotted.

 

[Ian1981]

Where the tails existing or have they been installed when the new cu was fitted?

 

[Midwest]

Where the tails existing or have they been installed when the new cu was fitted?

Well, looks like the property had an extension. So previously the meter box was on the outside wall, and I suspect the old CU was in the garage. This has now been converted into playroom and a kitchen diner. So the plastic meter box has gone, wooden meter box (I carp you not), tails horizontal across wall in plastic trunking at waist height, then disappear to be revealed at CU at ceiling height.

Edit; I suspect some builders involvement

 

[Toneyz]

Could it be that you in fact have 2 radials on the same OCPD and are picking up cpc continuity via parallel earth paths, just a thought maybe.

good point possibility Pete.