Worcester, Greenstar Ri problems

[Scornio]

Hi all,

I've been asked to wire up this new boiler which is on an existing y-plan system. It should be a simple case of giving it a permanent live...apparently. However on the existing y- plan the over run pump ( in airing cupboard) live comes off the oranges, which I believe to be the s/l... So I've taken a perm live to 230v term at boiler easy bit, then separated live to pump at wiring centre away from oranges and gave a perm live(refer to 3rd paragraph)

I know end result should be LP is live to pump... Np is neutral to pump then lr is S/l from oranges.

The existing cores being used at old boiler was s/l and N with a spare core so used this temporarily to attach on to separated pump live to give perm live and at boiler term LP believing that LP is automatically linked as a perm live within boiler this should give the pump its perm L and use the neutral within wiring centre.
The problem I have is that the pump is not cutting out after 5 mins why? Is it a case of wiring as I know the end result to be?
New to y- plan any help would be great.

 

[chris murphy]

Hi all,

I've been asked to wire up this new boiler which is on an existing y-plan system. It should be a simple case of giving it a permanent live...apparently. However on the existing y- plan the over run pump ( in airing cupboard) live comes off the oranges, which I believe to be the s/l... So I've taken a perm live to 230v term at boiler easy bit, then separated live to pump at wiring centre away from oranges and gave a perm live(refer to 3rd paragraph)

I know end result should be LP is live to pump... Np is neutral to pump then lr is S/l from oranges.

The existing cores being used at old boiler was s/l and N with a spare core so used this temporarily to attach on to separated pump live to give perm live and at boiler term LP believing that LP is automatically linked as a perm live within boiler this should give the pump its perm L and use the neutral within wiring centre.
The problem I have is that the pump is not cutting out after 5 mins why? Is it a case of wiring as I know the end result to be?
New to y- plan any help would be great.

"Hello Scornio",

I cannot comment about the Wiring details above - BUT - I can tell You that a Boiler that requires a Pump Over-run has the Pump wired directly to dedicated Terminals within the Boiler Electrical connection compartment.

The Pump Over-run is controlled by the Boiler - when the Heat is dissipated from the Boiler Heat Exchanger the Pump over-run is stopped.

Because of this the Pump cannot be just wired to the Wiring Centre as in the various `S Plans` and `Y Plan` etc.

I hope that other Members can explain this in more detail / Electrically.


I hope that this is helpful.


Regards,

Chris - Heating Engineer / Heating, Plumbing & Gas Contractor

 

[electric will]

Agree with chris, you need to take a cable from the boiler straight to the pump. Then the pump is only controlled by the boiler, I see your on a y plan so my next question doesn't effect you.
chris, on boilers with pump over run but on a s plan, when the boiler has shut down, the valves are closed, while on pump over run where does the water circulate to?

 

[chris murphy]

Agree with chris, you need to take a cable from the boiler straight to the pump. Then the pump is only controlled by the boiler, I see your on a y plan so my next question doesn't effect you.
chris, on boilers with pump over run but on a s plan, when the boiler has shut down, the valves are closed, while on pump over run where does the water circulate to?

"Hello electric will",

Boilers that have a Pump Over-run MUST have Bypass Pipework for that purpose.

On most Boilers this has to be Installed with the rest of the Boiler Pipework - it has to be of a specified length [Manufacturers Specify] in order to be able to Dissipate the Heat that the Pump Over-run pumps around the Bypass and therefor normally needs to be NOT Insulated - this can sometimes complicate Boiler Installations in `Out Bulidings`.

Some Boilers have a Built in Bypass - this means that the Pump Over-run is operating for much longer to Dissipate the Heat from the Heat Exchanger.


I hope that this is helpful.

Regards,

Chris

 

[Tiny_Lec]

Hi Chris can a roomstat used in Y plan be connected to a newly installed combi. Old stats got three core and earth. If yes which wires need be used. Thanks

 

[chris murphy]

Hi Chris can a roomstat used in Y plan be connected to a newly installed combi. Old stats got three core and earth. If yes which wires need be used. Thanks

"Hello Tiny_Lec",

Because I am a Heating Engineer - Heating, Plumbing and Gas Contractor I ONLY give answers and Advice on the Mechanical / Technical / Regulations aspects of those Trades - NOT any Electrical advice / details.

I have made a point of stating this on the Forum - so I must leave all Electrical questions to the Electricians / Electrical Engineer Members.


I am active on here to `Pay Back` for some very helpful advice that I received in October 2011.


I am fairly sure that You will get an answer fairly quickly later Today - please don`t be offended - You might need to reword your question with a bit more information to get an answer.

Sorry thast I cannot help You with your question.

Regards,

Chris

 

[Geordie Spark]

Hi Chris can a roomstat used in Y plan be connected to a newly installed combi. Old stats got three core and earth. If yes which wires need be used. Thanks

Just fit one of these Drayton Room Thermostat RTS8 - Boiler Controls - Heating -Tools, Electrical & Plumbing - Wickes

I think Screwfix sell them too for about the same price.

and wire it as a 2 wire ..... not expensive at all and saves any hassle getting a neutral to the stat.

 

[chris murphy]

"Hello Geordie Spark",

Up Late Tonight [02:43 Hrs] !

Good Advice to Tiny_Lec.

Regards,

Chris

 

[Geordie Spark]

"Hello Geordie Spark",

Up Late Tonight [02:43 Hrs] !

Good Advice to Tiny_Lec.

Regards,

Chris

Hi Chris

Hope you're well.

I'm off to my pit shortly - getting tired now - and hoping for a good nights sleep. Not sleeping well just now because of back pains and an eye infection that painful & driving me mad.

I was going to jump onto your thread about the wire for your outside lights, but you were getting enough good advice anyway so anything I offered would have been superfluous.

 

[Geordie Spark]

Those Drayton Combi Stats are what I've used a few times and they're fine for most applications so I can confidently recommend them.

 

[chris murphy]

Hi Chris

Hope you're well.

I'm off to my pit shortly - getting tired now - and hoping for a good nights sleep. Not sleeping well just now because of back pains and an eye infection that painful & driving me mad.

I was going to jump onto your thread about the wire for your outside lights, but you were getting enough good advice anyway so anything I offered would have been superfluous.

"Hello again Geordie Spark",

I am also not Sleeping because of Back Pain and Pain from both Knees - So I know what You are going through.

I am an Insomniac BEFORE the Pain kicks in - So I often don`t Sleep at all !

"Goodnight" I hope You get some Sleep.

Regards,

Chris

 

[Geordie Spark]

"Hello again Geordie Spark",

I am also not Sleeping because of Back Pain and Pain from both Knees - So I know what You are going through.

I am an Insomniac BEFORE the Pain kicks in - So I often don`t Sleep at all some Nights !

"Goodnight" I hope You get some Sleep.

Regards,

Chris

Thanks Chris.

Goodnight to you.

 

[sedgy34]

just to add my 2 penny,, the boiler will have a pump overrun connection this should go from the boiler to the pump so the boiler can run the pump so to pump the hot heating water away from the boiler.

 

[Tiny_Lec]

Never mind Chris, Its sorted now

 

[Tiny_Lec]

Just fit one of these Drayton Room Thermostat RTS8 - Boiler Controls - Heating -Tools, Electrical & Plumbing - Wickes

I think Screwfix sell them too for about the same price.

and wire it as a 2 wire ..... not expensive at all and saves any hassle getting a neutral to the stat.

Thanks Geordie Spark, didn't have to at the end L and S/L worked just fine with the old one.

 

[Scornio]

Thanks for all advice...

Turns out both ways worked... Although wired it the correct way with regards to taking feed to pump via boiler rather than before boiler.

thanks again.

 

[chris murphy]

Thanks for all advice...

Turns out both ways worked... Although wired it the correct way with regards to taking feed to pump via boiler rather than before boiler.

thanks again.

"Hello again Scornio",

This message is only to try and prevent other Readers from getting misled / confused about the Pump Over-run:

The Pump Over-run is ONLY Controlled by the Boiler - when the Heat is dissipated from the Heat Exchanger the Pump Over-run is turned Off.

That is the ONLY way that the Pump Over-run can be Operated - I think that this process is controlled by Thermistors within the Boiler.

I am NOT any kind of Expert in Electrical Wiring / Installation - BUT - I know that the Pump MUST be wired to dedicated Terminals within the Boiler - identified in the Installation Instructions.

I do NOT know whether a Different / incorrect configuration of Wiring can cause the Pump Over-run to operate `Correctly` - but I very much doubt it.

I am glad to read that You got it sorted out.

Regards,

Chris - Heating Engineer

 

[Geordie Spark]

Thanks for all advice...

Turns out both ways worked... Although wired it the correct way with regards to taking feed to pump via boiler rather than before boiler.

thanks again.

Good lad!

Pleased you got it sorted and yes - connecting to the boiler IS the way to go for the reasons given by Chris.