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Discuss Are you based in Frimley???????? in the Electrical Forum area at ElectrciansForums.co.uk.

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  1. Murdoch
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    Murdoch Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Woking
    So I got a call from a customer asking me about something I did in Feb 16 - so I duely paid a visit. Knowing they had had some work done I asked if I could see the certificate..... as I didn't take mine with me!

    Now bearing in mind a new fuseboard had been fitted, the kitchen had been hacked around, downlights had been fitted and a wall removed I was expecting an detailed EIC........

    Er no, the EIC simply said replacement fuseboard..... which had all 10 "slots" used.

    This is a photo of the test results sheet.........

    Test results.jpg

    Sorry its side ways

    Anybody want to play "spot the mistake / ommision / unusual entry" with me?
     
  2. Strima
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    Strima Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    St Neots
    R1 is a tad high...
     
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  3. westward10
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    westward10 In echoed steps I walk across an empty dream. Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    Ring final 9 appears to be rather long and open circuit on the lines. Seems they didn't loop it either or several of the others.
    They also have 4.0 cpcs on the 6.0 cables, assuming T&E.
    No IR readings.
     
  4. spinlondon
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    spinlondon Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Harlow Essex
    How many DBs are there if this is #1?
    How is measured Zs N/A for RCDs?
     
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  5. streamer
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    streamer Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    And it seems to be wired in 6mm!
     
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  6. Wilko
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    Wilko Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Berkshire
    Business Name:
    Wilko Electrics
    I have done a couple of jobs in Frimley, so my heart skipped a beat ...
     
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  7. Murdoch
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    Murdoch Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Woking
    I was wondering what Nt meant?
    Why only 9 circuits are listed, yet there are 10!
     
  8. westward10
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    westward10 In echoed steps I walk across an empty dream. Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Northamptonshire
  9. Murdoch
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    Murdoch Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Woking
    Is that an acceptable entry for an EIC, especially as it was a new circuit.
     
  10. westward10
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    westward10 In echoed steps I walk across an empty dream. Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    From what I can see there are no tests whatsoever for those two circuits.
     
  11. KEV 1 N
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    KEV 1 N Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Durham
    Dear me, I could have fabricated a better test sheet sitting at home with a cuppa!
    Not supposed to put LIM on an EIC.
    There's and old saying "If it looks right, then it is right"
    This clearly isn't right.
     
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  12. WillWX
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    WillWX Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Northants
    Is it just me or why even bother filling one out?!
     
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  13. Wilko
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    Wilko Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Berkshire
    Business Name:
    Wilko Electrics
    It's not just you ... I'd be suggesting to Client the last lot should return and provide one done to standard. If they hesitate, perhaps offer to email original to their CPS for review :rolleyes:
     
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  14. Murdoch
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    Murdoch Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Woking
    I was wondering about forwarding a copy to Elecsa .. I do have his details and number!
     
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  15. westward10
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    westward10 In echoed steps I walk across an empty dream. Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    You probably need to pose any queries you have to him first.
     
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  16. ipf
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    ipf Trusted Advisor

    How is it applicable?
     
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  17. Sparkingmad
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    Sparkingmad Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Dorset
    How can they tick polarity on the circuits they haven’t tested or entered results for R1+R2 or Max ZS reading? Ring Circuit 9 20000 so near enough useless continuity on R1, the list of errors and inconsistency just keeps getting worse. So what was the IPf at that board left blank too.
     
  18. spinlondon
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    spinlondon Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Harlow Essex
    To start with, the form asks for the maximum allowed by BS7671.
    I guess technically none of it is applicable as the certificate is for a board change.
    I wonder why it’s applicable for one RCD, but not for the other two?
    It’s also odd that they conducted no IR tests.
     
  19. Sparkingmad
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    Sparkingmad Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Dorset
    Maybe get the customer to get in touch with elecsa and send a copy of that cert complete with installer name and number and ask them to confirm if that certificate is genuine.
     
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  20. Ian1981
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    Ian1981 Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    North east
    I think he means you don’t measure a zs for the rcd hence the box is marked N/A on the certificate for both.
    Also why would you write 1667 ohms for a 30mA rcd for maximum zs when that referes to the touch voltages not rising above 50 volts it’s not really applicable to the certificate in my opinion, at least that is I’ve never wrote it in unless the rcd is proving fault protection as the sole means such as a TT system.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 6:31 AM
  21. spinlondon
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    spinlondon Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Harlow Essex
    Is someone suggesting here, that when you install RCDs, you don’t measure the Zs?
     
  22. Ian1981
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    Ian1981 Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    North east
    Zs of the circuits are measured
    Rcd tests are carried out
    Ze etc etc.
    If the rcd is external to the main consumer unit then the distribution circuit supplying and connecting to the rcd is measured but no not the physical rcd no.
    That’s what rcd tests are for is it not?
     
  23. streamer
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    streamer Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    The first one is an RCBO (61009), the other two are two RCDs (61008) covering a group of MCBs each. So the RCDs themselves don't require a Zs test, rather the MCBs they cover do. I think the way he has used a circuit to write down the RCDs is confusing.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 7:59 AM
  24. ipf
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    ipf Trusted Advisor

    Yep. I think someone's getting mixed up.
    He's given the RCD's a circuit number. I usually replace the cct no with RCD 1 and RCD2 and leave a blank line, except for the RCD times and rating.
     
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  25. ipf
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    ipf Trusted Advisor

    Sure am.....not for the RCD's themselves, anyway.
     
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  26. spinlondon
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    spinlondon Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Harlow Essex
    You have to know the Zs to ensure the RCDs will work.
    <1667 Ohms for 30mA
    <500 Ohms for 100mA
    <167 Ohms for 300mA
    <100 Ohms for 500mA.
    You cannot say it’s not applicable.
    You can leave it blank because you’ve tested all the circuits protected by the RCD, or you can record the highest measured value for the circuits the RCD protects.
     
  27. streamer
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    streamer Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    Post deleted
     
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    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 10:27 PM
  28. ipf
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    ipf Trusted Advisor

    In this case, it's not applicable. There's at least one Zs reading for each RCD protected group.
     
  29. streamer
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    streamer Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    Have you ever done this? If you have then I suspect you are the only one!
     
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  30. Ian1981
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    Ian1981 Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    North east
    By taking a zs of the protected rcd circuits and even the ze then we know that 50v/0.03 is satisfied anyway however the zs is measured to ensure ADS of the over current protective device.
    Nowhere does any literature on testing say that the rcd requires a separate zs test and why would it?
    Any specific rcd testing can be found in GN3
    It is the rcd tests that ensures the rcd will disconnect in the required times.
     
  31. Ian1981
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    Ian1981 Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    North east
    I’m guessing your talking about rcd testing half times 1x and 5x tests and not a zs of the rcd as they are not the same.
     
  32. streamer
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    streamer Regular EF Member

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    These values are for if you need the RCD to provide fault protection as well as additional protection. So in most situations they are not applicable.
     
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