Bringing ring to regs standard, and other things

[cbear92]

Hi all, new to forum but excited to get in the thick of it. I've done some domestic electrical work in the past as my dad was a HV sparky when he was younger, and I have done a fair bit of LV microelectronics in my line of work.

I have just bought my first house and done some things already with the electrics, but I had a few questions on what to do in a place that doesn't meet the regs.

In my living room, the ring main had been extended over a set of sliding doors, and then it comes to about 10cm before a socket. However presumably they didn't have enough T+E so they had to cut both cables and put them to a terminal block to get that last bit to the new socket. The block is just loose in the wall with no accessible junction box. Due to this terminal block it is my understanding that the socket is now a spur.

Near the socket is an empty single blanking box that I want to replace with a switch for the electric fire (currently plugged in). I bought a 13 A switch box for it, but don't want to be extending the spur without the terminal block being replaced by a FCU (or use 4 mm^2 T+E?). So my plan was to put in the FCU, which then would connect to the socket and then the fused fire switch.

So my questions are:
1. Do this make sense and fulfill the regs?

2. Is the fused fire switch necessary at this point or could I just use a non fused switch?

3. Would I be better extending the ring properly with a junction box and two sets of line connectors rather than extending spur?

Thanks for any help guys.

Callum

 

[Pete999]

Callum, Hi and welcome, as it's against forum rules and regulations to give step by step advice, and judging from your description of the state of the wiring to your Ring Final Circuit (RFC), it would be better if you got an Electrician to take a look and rectify any mistakes, bodges in your wiring.
People may say that it is a stock answer (get an Electrician in ) but in this case I believe that this is the best advice, post your location, there could be someone on the Forum today who is near your area and willing to help you out, all the best anyway.

 

[Spoon]

Due to this terminal block it is my understanding that the socket is now a spur

I'd agree with you on that.

Near the socket is an empty single blanking box that I want to replace with a switch for the electric fire (currently plugged in). I bought a 13 A switch box for it, but don't want to be extending the spur without the terminal block being replaced by a FCU (or use 4 mm^2 T+E?). So my plan was to put in the FCU, which then would connect to the socket and then the fused fire switch.

What's wrong with using a plug/socket for the electric fire?

1. Do this make sense

I think so.... Not quite getting the switch for the fire.. See my question above.

You can stick a fused spur on the ring and then wire your sockets from this, or you can extend the ring. The choice is yours.

This is just general info... As above, no step-by-step info can be given out.

 

[telectrix]

also depends on the rating of the fire. if it's a 3kW. it should be on it'sown dedicated circuit. tin hat ready.

 

[cbear92]

Thanks for the replies. Pete, I will certainly be considering getting in an electrician to see to the work. As to checking all of the circuits in general, we are still looking into that option via th sellers of the house who were dishonest about a number of things.

You make a good point telectrix, I had not considered the load of the fire as it has not been an issue as it is, but then of course the only current limit is the plug itself. If the spur is extended then the limit is fire+2gang socket <13 A. The fire is 2kW, so would expect no more than 11A to be pulled worst case. There is very little else on the sitting room ring, so there is no way the total will exceed the 32A MCB, I'd be surprised if the total reached 15A including the fire. I need to bring my multimeter home from work to check total draw in ring at max load.

But that certainly does point me towards a ring extension over the spur extension so as to be sure of no tripping if sockets pull > 2A while the fire is pulling 11A(max).

It would be very difficult to run a dedicated line for the fire due to layout of the house, and I would obviously need to get a sparky in to check it/connect it regardless.

As for your question Spoon, the cable trails from the fire and takes up one of the two plugs in the 2 gang socket that serves the entertainment portion of the living room. I have other designs for that socket so was wanting to use up the existing blanking box already there nearby.

 

[Pete999]

Thanks for the replies. Pete, I will certainly be considering getting in an electrician to see to the work. As to checking all of the circuits in general, we are still looking into that option via th sellers of the house who were dishonest about a number of things.

You make a good point telectrix, I had not considered the load of the fire as it has not been an issue as it is, but then of course the only current limit is the plug itself. If the spur is extended then the limit is fire+2gang socket <13 A. The fire is 2kW, so would expect no more than 11A to be pulled worst case. There is very little else on the sitting room ring, so there is no way the total will exceed the 32A MCB, I'd be surprised if the total reached 15A including the fire. I need to bring my multimeter home from work to check total draw in ring at max load.

But that certainly does point me towards a ring extension over the spur extension so as to be sure of no tripping if sockets pull > 2A while the fire is pulling 11A(max).

It would be very difficult to run a dedicated line for the fire due to layout of the house, and I would obviously need to get a sparky in to check it/connect it regardless.

As for your question Spoon, the cable trails from the fire and takes up one of the two plugs in the 2 gang socket that serves the entertainment portion of the living room. I have other designs for that socket so was wanting to use up the existing blanking box already there nearby.

Unless your multi meter has a clamp facility I don't hold out much hope of you finding out the total current draw of the circuit you are describing.

 

[cbear92]

Unless your multi meter has a clamp facility I don't hold out much hope of you finding out the total current draw of the circuit you are describing.

I have a clamp plug in for the multimeter.

 

[Pete999]

I have a clamp plug in for the multimeter.

OK that's OK then just checking.

 

[littlespark]

What region are you in, Callum? There's a couple of us in the Borders and a few in the Glasgow area. (we wont hold that against them though)

Extending the ring is always the best option IMHO

 

[cbear92]

What region are you in, Callum? There's a couple of us in the Borders and a few in the Glasgow area. (we wont hold that against them though)

Extending the ring is always the best option IMHO

Hi littlespark, I'm afraid that as an island boy myself I actually live in Edinburgh! Feel free to hold that against me

 

[Pete999]

Hi littlespark, I'm afraid that as an island boy myself I actually live in Edinburgh! Feel free to hold that against me

 

[littlespark]

I was in Edinburgh on Sunday actually, mixing looking at a job for my brother and shopping for a MATCHING set of sofas and chairs from DFS. (look at me, I'm posh... "matching" set.... first time in 20 years of owning a house)