City & Guilds 9848-51 Certificate in High Voltage Operational Safety

[Rfw]

Hi, has any one done the

City & Guilds 9848-51 Certificate in High Voltage Operational Safety

my boss wants me to be the site SAP, is this the course for it?

 

[Pete999]

Are you an Authourised person HV already? If not then you would in my opinion take the HV/AP course, get your AP/HV ticket, whilst you are on this course enquire how you would get to be SAP/HV.
Whe I was SAP/HV it was down to the AE/HV Authorising Engineer/HV to cerify you as SAP/HV remember APs have to keep up with the training.

I think it was 3 years and you had to do a refresher course, otherwise you started all over again.

I also recall that you need to know the system you are AP for either a Ring or a Radial, like the back of your hand.

I did my training in house with the PSA at RAF Cardington which is closed and has been for some tim.

Check on Google for training establishments, it's not something that has gone, more likely evolving, you must remember to renew every 3 years.

I personally don't see how gaining a C&Gs cert will certify you, it is an everlasting retraining role, which, as I mentioned needs upkeeping every so many years.

IT was a while ago when I was active, but I'm sure the rules and Regulations haven't changed that much.

Try Burn Hall training thats where I did my last update, good luck, oh and the course was 4 weeks with a written test where you where given a scenario, and you needed to write a switching program, the second was a practical where you acted as an AP on a LIVE HV ring main, if you failed you never got your ticket, there was no messing and no 100% pass rate either, it was a hard slog believe me.

 

[Pete999]

Are you an Authourised person HV already? If not then you would in my opinion take the HV/AP course, get your AP/HV ticket, whilst you are on this course enquire how you would get to be SAP/HV.
Whe I was SAP/HV it was down to the AE/HV Authorising Engineer/HV to cerify you as SAP/HV remember APs have to keep up with the training.

I think it was 3 years and you had to do a refresher course, otherwise you started all over again.

I also recall that you need to know the system you are AP for either a Ring or a Radial, like the back of your hand.

I did my training in house with the PSA at RAF Cardington which is closed and has been for some tim.

Check on Google for training establishments, it's not something that has gone, more likely evolving, you must remember to renew every 3 years.

I personally don't see how gaining a C&Gs cert will certify you, it is an everlasting retraining role, which, as I mentioned needs upkeeping every so many years.

IT was a while ago when I was active, but I'm sure the rules and Regulations haven't changed that much.

Try Burn Hall training thats where I did my last update, good luck, oh and the course was 4 weeks with a written test where you where given a scenario, and you needed to write a switching program, the second was a practical where you acted as an AP on a LIVE HV ring main, if you failed you never got your ticket, there was no messing and no 100% pass rate either, it was a hard slog believe me.

OP done a runner??? or gone for his tea.

 

[Bobster]

Yes, I've done it.

Not a walk in the park like most C&G, but that alone wouldn't make you an AP in my mind.

It isn't a qualification as such. Much like being a foreman. Just more responsibility within a company.

 

[Pete999]

I agree Rob AP duties require initial and ongoing training, AP / HV duties are a serious / dangerous occupation, you need your wits about you to do this job, not something you can play at, if you have ever seen what for example 11KV work is like, you will appreciate how serious it is, I know from experience the mistakes you can make, believe me it's not something to triffle with. Where is the OP?

 

[Rfw]

Hi guys. We currently don't have any person who is AP or SAP or OP, I've been an electrician for about 20 years. I've worked on voltages up to 440VAC (and a bit of DC) The company that I work for contracts out all the HV switching out, mainly its all just TX isolation. I've been in attendance nearly all of the time that it has been done. It sounded like a new challenge. Thanks for the information regarding refresher training, obviously it's going to be all pretty new, I'd still even after the course have someone else with me who's been doing it for a while and got the experience whilst I learned the skills.
Do you guys have any other course in mind that may be more appropriate? If so could you please give me the training centre that holds it web link or contact details? Additionally, I have been researching the Schneider courses, however a friend of mine says all I will learn is schneider equipment. You agree?
Thank you all for your time
R

 

[Bobster]

People aren't on here as much as we are Pete, they probably don't expect fast replies.

I was an AP then became SAP for a large quarry, I did for a breif period look after one of the HV systems Tony worked on.

The C&G course is over 5 full days practical training, 5 full days theory and then has 2 x 4 hour exams. The first is a theory that for 50% of the mark you need to put together a switching plan. The other 50% was knowledge on the subject. If you lost any marks on the switching plan it was a fail. Do not pass go, do not collect £200. Less than 90% overall and the same result.

The practical was following out your switching plan. (Hence why it needed to be correct). It's on a simulated live system and any mistake ends the exam. Including hesitating to switch. Or worse, throwing a switch half way and backing out.

 

[Pete999]

Hi guys. We currently don't have any person who is AP or SAP or OP, I've been an electrician for about 20 years. I've worked on voltages up to 440VAC (and a bit of DC) The company that I work for contracts out all the HV switching out, mainly its all just TX isolation. I've been in attendance nearly all of the time that it has been done. It sounded like a new challenge. Thanks for the information regarding refresher training, obviously it's going to be all pretty new, I'd still even after the course have someone else with me who's been doing it for a while and got the experience whilst I learned the skills.
Do you guys have any other course in mind that may be more appropriate? If so could you please give me the training centre that holds it web link or contact details? Additionally, I have been researching the Schneider courses, however a friend of mine says all I will learn is schneider equipment. You agree?
Thank you all for your time
R

When you are the AP Mate, you are it the buck stops with you, by all means work with someone until you are AP but when you are appointed, it's you mon ami, if I recall correctly you can't have more than 1 AP active on a system, you sign a log when you are active, and the next AP signs to say He / She has taken over control, it's a very dangerous and stupid to have 2 people active on a single system at any one time, remember some companies pay a premium for AP duties, I was AP HV / LV, confined spaces, HP steam Boilers, and 1 other but I can't remember what it was, was worth a bit.
I found the AP/LV far more involed than the HV side, alternative supplies to think off, standby, UPs etc stuff that you wouldn't find on aHV distribution Ring or Radial. Think I could still write a switching program for an HV ring if pushed, might need checking over.

 

[Bobster]

Do you guys have any other course in mind that may be more appropriate? If so could you please give me the training centre that holds it web link or contact details? Additionally, I have been researching the Schneider courses, however a friend of mine says all I will learn is schneider equipment. You agree?
Thank you all for your time
R

The City and guilds course would be good for that application.

I did my last refresher 4 years ago and the C&G 6 years ago at a pace called Hoylake

https://training.scottishpower.com/Public/SearchII.aspx?p=104511

They knew what they were doing, had a lot of good equipment. Best of all they had a range of old and new circuit protection and switches. So can inform you of pitfalls of older devices should you see them. Ones before the days of anti reflex handles, and mechanical assists.

I once a long time ago very nearly came a cropper switching a 3.3kv manual connector. There was a fault, and the fault current tried reopening the device before I had fully closed it. Thankfully I'm a decent sized guy and was strong enough to close it and let the breaker deal with the fault current. Rather than the switch blowing open with an arc.

 

[Pete999]

The City and guilds course would be good for that application.

I did my last refresher 4 years ago and the C&G 6 years ago at a pace called Hoylake

https://training.scottishpower.com/Public/SearchII.aspx?p=104511

They knew what they were doing, had a lot of good equipment. Best of all they had a range of old and new circuit protection and switches. So can inform you of pitfalls of older devices should you see them. Ones before the days of anti reflex handles, and mechanical assists.

I once a long time ago very nearly came a cropper switching a 3.3kv manual connector. There was a fault, and the fault current tried reopening the device before I had fully closed it. Thankfully I'm a decent sized guy and was strong enough to close it and let the breaker deal with the fault current. Rather than the switch blowing open with an arc.

Scary when things like that happen isn't it?

 

[Bobster]

Scary when things like that happen isn't it?

Only ever had 2, that switch, an old Reyroll manual dependant job. (Thankfully now are illegal to install in the UK, and any found still in service the duty holder of the equipment has to organise it being replaced. There are still some out there though so be aware).

The other was a 2MVA 33Kv to 11Kv tx, tested out fine, switched on and it ruptured the secondary winding to a dead short. The substation shook and it it made a hell of a roar. Took about 6 seconds for the primary protection to operate. Felt like an eternity.

Aside from that, it was monotonous with a hell of lot of paperwork. Aside from using phasing sticks (remember the hiss they give off) the majority of my HV work was boring. Exactly how it should be.

 

[Pete999]

a

Only ever had 2, that switch, an old Reyroll manual dependant job. (Thankfully now are illegal to install in the UK, and any found still in service the duty holder of the equipment has to organise it being replaced. There are still some out there though so be aware).

The other was a 2MVA 33Kv to 11Kv tx, tested out fine, switched on and it ruptured the secondary winding to a dead short. The substation shook and it it made a hell of a roar. Took about 6 seconds for the primary protection to operate. Felt like an eternity.

Aside from that, it was monotonous with a hell of lot of paperwork. Aside from using phasing sticks (remember the hiss they give off) the majority of my HV work was boring. Exactly how it should be.

Have you ever had the opportunity to spike an HV cable? Some thing I found out during my time, if you are the AP and the AE Aauthorising Engineer is on site, then they can interven with the proviso that the sign the log etc to say they have taken control of the system, I was tasked with isolating a leg between 2 Sub Stations, so they could instll an extra Sub on the Ring. Contactors had exposed the cables entering the Sub, and I had even gon as for as poking a piece of plastic trunking up the earthenware duct to ensure I had located the righ cable, swithed the Ring to provide a supply every where. isolated the cable I was going to spike, at this time spotty AE stoped me and said he wasn't happy that I had fitted the spike to the right cable, so I got snotty with him called him a few uncouth names and we decided that he would take over the system, signed all the paperwork etc, and he confidently swapped the spiking gun over to the other cable, by this time I had told my mate who was learning the ropes, that it would be best to get behind the heap of spoil that was left over from the trench, watch and learn was the watch word, spotty AE asked me to to load the gun and pull the landyard, on yer bike Son, your in charge put yer money where yer mouth is and do iy your self, or words to that effect, result bang, the spike tripped the OCB at the intake Sub, big discussion as to what went wrong, it was an Army camp so you can guess what happened, brown jobs fly about, but yours truly was in the clear, I had the paperwork to prove it, I think the AE got posted to somewhere that he couldn't do any damage.

 

[Bobster]

Have you ever had the opportunity to spike an HV cable?

Doezns of times.

I made a thread on here about it in the black museum. Got taken down or lost the photos when we had that big upheaval of members a couple of years ago. It's on the other forum if you want to look. Only a few photos with it. Used it as a job for my apprentice at the time, very rarely took photos of my work otherwise.

I'd post a link but I think Dan has blocked all links to that site.

 

[Pete999]

Doezns of times.

I made a thread on here about it in the black museum. Got taken down or lost the photos when we had that big upheaval of members a couple of years ago. It's on the other forum if you want to look. Only a few photos with it. Used it as a job for my apprentice at the time, very rarely took photos of my work otherwise.

I'd post a link but I think Dan has blocked all links to that site.

Would be interested to see Rob

 

[Bobster]

Would be interested to see Rob

I'll send you a link via pm. Be in the morning before I get back online though. Remind me if I forget!