EAL Course in Inspection and Testing

[rmc86uk]

My mistake! That's even worse!

 

[AdsUk]

Just to echo other people really, but really come on, comparing a closed book exam to an open book one.

If i was an employer i would also not accept this course as anywhere near as good as the 2394/2395, simple.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

My mistake! That's even worse!

I also passed my 2394 and 95 closed book exam not a fart arsed dumbed down version

 

[robbalaar86]

I didn't compare the two I am just stating fact.

If you can do the same exam for half the price then why not? Yes I know one is closed book. Do you think the Electrical Trainee are doing anything near full quals?

To be honest the fact they have split the 91 into two stinks!!!

By your logic you wouldn't join the jib if you don't agree with their standing?

 

[markc123]

No, and that's why the Electrical Trainee have the reputation they do.

Completley agree about the 2391 though.

And as regards to the JIB thats slightly different, because the JIB are a one off really don't have a competitor. If someone similar came around to the JIB then i'd look at both and go from there.

As it stands....Mr X comes to me seeking a job and has C+G quals and Mr Y comes to me seeking a job and has the EAL equivalent. Mr X gets employed.

 

[NJG28]

Im not OfQual so I can't answer that! Not my rules!
To be honest I would suspect you'd run out of exam time if you had to look everything up.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

The 2391 used to be looked at as the golden egg. It still is for many employers. I missed out and have the 2394 and 95 which after doing a lot of 2391 past paper to prep for probably are not as hard but Are not far off. A open book makes a mockery of it and maybe the JIB could do with a rival although I am not taking anything away from them they are a good orginisation but they need to give there heads a wobble on this one. I'm not surprised scans recognise them. They would recognise a chocolate biscuit as a certificate if the cheque clears!

 

[NJG28]

No, and that's why the Electrical Trainee have the reputation they do.

Completley agree about the 2391 though.

And as regards to the JIB thats slightly different, because the JIB are a one off really don't have a competitor. If someone similar came around to the JIB then i'd look at both and go from there.

As it stands....Mr X comes to me seeking a job and has C+G quals and Mr Y comes to me seeking a job and has the EAL equivalent. Mr X gets employed.

Your choice of course as you're the boss of your own set up. You may be missing best candidate though if only choose on that criteria.

Perhaps EAL chap couldn't afford DOUBLE the EAL fee for a C&G quals. How DO C&G justify their price ?

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Next the EAL will be pumping our a knock off design course.

 

[UNG]

EAL - Excellence, Achievement & Learning Limited are they actually doing what their name says because there is no doubt standards are dropping. A quick look at their website gives plenty of information as to why this industry is in the mess it is in. They are just money chasers, X billion pounds to be spent on railways we need a cut of the training so let's get into that industry says it all.

I don't see how you can have equal parallel qualifications C&G V's EAL each has to stand on it's own merit. It is interesting how industries are on their knees yet these training companies seem to be getting bigger and bigger and there are new ones popping up all the time to deliver these courses of hope and promise.

We need to get back to proper training without all the acronyms do we need QCF, NVQ etc etc after all it is job creation without any tangible product. Does any employer actually know what the NVQ levels 2,3 & 4 are and what you could expect from someone presenting these qualifications for employment as a quick search of the web doesn't give you any reference to work with

Nobody has tried to get the more experienced tradesmen onboard with these training changes probably because it is a non understanding management driven change that is watering down qualifications while still trying to give them some kudos

 

[trevki]

I'm an employer, and I wouldn't accept it as an equivalent to C&G so that's your the tort out of the window.

An unfair, unbalanced and ill judged comment. Nothing wrong with EAL. Again people frightened of modern learning practices and practical applications. Who would want a job with someone who does not recognise industry accredited qualifications?

 

[cotty]

EAL seem to be hand in glove with the training companies! ( Short Course). Offering their EAL Domestic Installers Qualification! I don't recall hearing City and Guilds offering the same qualification!

 

[UNG]

An unfair, unbalanced and ill judged comment. Nothing wrong with EAL.

There might be nothing wrong with EAL from your point of view but a lot of people can't see what is right with it

Again people frightened of modern learning practices and practical applications.

You're right a lot of people are frightened by the modern minimalist learning practices and the fact that these are accepted as an acceptable level of competence to become a self employed domestic installer and recognised by one of the schemes. It will be a few years before the long term damage this learning method and what it will do to the industry can be assessed and then it will be too late to change it back

Who would want a job with someone who does not recognise industry accredited qualifications?

Don't you mean who would get a job with second rate qualifications the prospective employer doesn't accept because they fall below the previous qualification levels needed to be an electrician. The industry accreditation is agreed by managers who have little or no knowledge of the industry IMO hence the falling qualification standards

 

[markc123]

Was just about to respond to trevki's post...then got to the last comment, well said UNG. Along the lines of what i was planning to say.

C+G are about the only organisastion left, bar the JIB, in this trade that have a bit of dignity left.

 

[cotty]

Was just about to respond to trevki's post...then got to the last comment, well said UNG. Along the lines of what i was planning to say.

C+G are about the only organisastion left, bar the JIB, in this trade that have a bit of dignity left.

Although the JIB are responsible for the low standard of applicants, we uphold the standard of old farts!

 

[Badged01]

.... C+G are about the only organisastion left ...... in this trade that have a bit of dignity left .....

mmmmmmm, will leave judgement on that! They are in the game to make money too, cleverly disguised by "new" courses and splitting "old" courses!

 

[UNG]

Was just about to respond to trevki's post...then got to the last comment, well said UNG. Along the lines of what i was planning to say.

C+G are about the only organisastion left, bar the JIB, in this trade that have a bit of dignity left.

The C&G's credibility is falling fast and it's not to far off hitting the bottom a thread on here a little while back was questioning what a particular C&G qualification was and it turned out to be a course one of the fast track training companies had set up and the C&G had give it accreditation and a course number so the C&G are all part of the race to the bottom

The balance sheet mentality of training plus the I want it all and I want it now not tomorrow entrants into the industry are combining to drive standards down and every organisation involved is frightened of missing out on making money from the cash cow that has been created instead of standing by their principles

 

[trevki]

I have taken a fair bit of stick here, however as an IEng MIET member who has held principal positions with companies you would all know, and having served a full apprenticeship some 35 years ago I feel I have a bit of experience. The trade has suffered through a drop in the overall quality of work produced, more from a practical point than a technical one. An open book exam shows you are able to use the regs in the correct manor rather than learn parts off by heart parrot fashion. To me there is nothing wrong with either, but I like the EAL model as it makes people refer to regs as needed and learn how to use the book, but this does not solve the practical quality problem. To get to the core of the problem there is only one driving force, a force driven by the client...MONEY. No matter what you think if people want to save money then quality will go out the window. I would still support EAL as an equal but alternative teaching method.

 

[Badged01]

I have taken a fair bit of stick here .......

Read some of the other threads, to find out what a real shoeing feels like (or should I say is written like!)

But Im sure you're old enough, big enough and ugly enough to take it on the chin and carry-on ....... as we all do :cry_smile:

 

[markc123]

The C&G's credibility is falling fast and it's not to far off hitting the bottom a thread on here a little while back was questioning what a particular C&G qualification was and it turned out to be a course one of the fast track training companies had set up and the C&G had give it accreditation and a course number so the C&G are all part of the race to the bottom

The balance sheet mentality of training plus the I want it all and I want it now not tomorrow entrants into the industry are combining to drive standards down and every organisation involved is frightened of missing out on making money from the cash cow that has been created instead of standing by their principles

I appologise - didn't know that. Times have changed, and i keep my self away from the educational system - only time im back at college now is for the updates every now and again...and thank god for that.

shame too see C+G going down the pan aswell.