EC Evolution+10 Panels

[Berneray]

Evening guys...

Anyone come up against a company called Project Solar.

They are selling this Evolution+10 panel which the salesman is saying will earn £5000 more than any "german panel"

Apparently they are able to install them as 250 watt panels but do a pv estimate on 262 watt panels because they are guaranteeing an extra 10 watts.

This is a copy and paste what he emailed to a potential customer of mine to explain why his pv estimate was greater than mine. Excuse the english. Its not mine.

"We have power sorted on flash tests reports on each and very module with a Guaranteed 10 watts on each panel..
This has no effect on MCS as the panel is badged as a 250 W Module..
As per the SEM Calculations if you know the exact calculation on each module we can use it according to REC if you can prove it you can use it. If we know the power output on each module we can do a SEM calculations on this bases which we do.

So on the basics of this we have a record of each and very module we install if we or yourself used solardge for instance we can use the maxium power out put so no reason we we can’t on our SEM calculations..
The only reason companies don’t use this is because the panel wattage is unknown unless you have a flash test report on each module which we do. we can as we know the exact wattage of each panel we know each panel is Guaranteed over 10 Watt . So if we can prove it we can use it ..This is what RECC says ..Sorry to say but as the other company cant prove the wattage of each Module they con't use it like we do.
But rest assured all our SEM are correct calculations and are above board what we are doing.."

Any comments guys.....

 

[dansk]

So i guess this person is going into the warehouse and selecting his 10 modules, noting the serial number and going into the office to dig out the flash report and then quoting based on the actual panels.... i think not.

 

[Gavin A]

so, they're registering it as a 4kWp system, but selling it and producing estimates for the MCS cert as if it were a 4.16 kWp system?

Without going into detail, this sort of issue is under discussion at MCS, and I'd view what they're doing as being a bit over the line of what's acceptable, and if someone were to apply the rules rigidly then this would fall foul of them as the figures aren't independently verified via their MCS certification etc.

ie if someone were to check the MCS cert for the panels, they'll find them listed as 250Wp panels, and that's what should be used for the performance estimates etc. If they want to sell them as plus rated 260Wp panels, which is what they're doing, then they should sell them as exactly that, not 250Wp +10Wp, as that's pretty obviously attempted to scam the system.

However, personally I don't agree with how the legislation has been interpreted at all, so would welcome any type of test case on it.......... but to cut a long story short, there would be a risk that this could end up being subject to enforcement actions and reclassified in the 4-10kWp bracket, might be a low risk, but is a risk.

 

[JTPR]

Exactly my thoughts Dansk...

 

[Gavin A]

So i guess this person is going into the warehouse and selecting his 10 modules, noting the serial number and going into the office to dig out the flash report and then quoting based on the actual panels.... i think not.

what they're actually saying is that they're sure that every single panel is at least 10Wp above the rating, and they're going to sell them as such... ie they're selling them as 260Wp, but registering them as 250Wp.

 

[SibertSolar]

Pure and simple - it's a 4.16kWp system from TIC point of view, the manufacturer is intentionally mis-rating the panels at STC. The installer is being conned (£/Wp) and is being handed the dubious "benefit" of being able to quote a supposed better yield for a pseudo 4kWp system.

All cells are graded, all panels are flash tested (I've not come across any that aren't and always receive flash test results from manufacturers, although there are, no doubt, exceptions...)

Btw - that copied/pasted statement has probably come straight from the manufacturer, right?

 

[sjpeat]

I can probably answer this in simple terms, Solar panels have long since had positive tolerance, Since Sanyo Panasonic years ago had a panel tolerance +10 percent and -5% that MCS found acceptable.

If the Evolution+10 is a module that delivers what it says on the tin as so to speak, then there is nothing in the rules that state that the exact panel wattage could be used from the flash test.

It would be also true that the panel identification ECS250 would be the rating stated at MCS 250w, so the customer does not run the risk of being over 4kw and in fact the flash test could show the whole container as 260w, then the customer can see the upside to the system performance against a standard module.

The delivery is important in this respect so the customer is aware of what he is receiving, a guaranteed 250w +10w.

The reference was awfully put, however most modules do start at 97 percent output, then really the figures to the customer should relay this.

This is the reverse of this, however a good example that the customer should analyse the data sheets to compare in full and final acceptance of warranty output.