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Would you suggest flex for fixed wiring on an EICR is a C3? The client has basically run flex from one socket to a surface socket (i.e. a glorified extension lead). However I would say this is fixed wiring.

What does 521.9.1 mean where it states "only where the the relevant provisions of the regulations are met"? Does this mean CCC, installation method, overload protection etc.
 
Would you suggest flex for fixed wiring on an EICR is a C3? The client has basically run flex from one socket to a surface socket (i.e. a glorified extension lead). However I would say this is fixed wiring.

What does 521.9.1 mean where it states "only where the the relevant provisions of the regulations are met"? Does this mean CCC, installation method, overload protection etc.
Got any pictures?
 
The client has basically run flex from one socket to a surface socket (i.e. a glorified extension lead). However I would say this is fixed wiring.

Is the flex hard wired in or on a plug?
 
Sorry no pics. They have 2 like this, one is on a plug and then run around the skirting board to the surface socket outlet. Its a 1.5mm flex on a 13A fused plug. The other is out the back of a plug to a surface socket on the dressing table (wardrobe fitter install)
 
Is the flex hard wired in or on a plug?
At the end of the flex, how many outlets are there? at the other end of the flex is it plugged in or hard wired? is the flex clipped direct, in trunking or left swinging in the wind? Not meant for you Spoon just an addition to your question, sorry disn't mean to hijack.
 
At the end of the flex, how many outlets are there? at the other end of the flex is it plugged in or hard wired? is the flex clipped direct, in trunking or left swinging in the wind? Not meant for you Spoon just an addition to your question, sorry disn't mean to hijack.

You can hijack me any day... :tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy:
 
Sorry no pics. They have 2 like this, one is on a plug and then run around the skirting board to the surface socket outlet. Its a 1.5mm flex on a 13A fused plug. The other is out the back of a plug to a surface socket on the dressing table (wardrobe fitter install)

If they are on plugs I wouldn't class them as 'fixed wiring'.
 
Both have a single outlet on the other end. The wardrobe one will be getting a C2 as the ring main is broken somewhere anyway on its a 32A MCB 1.5mm flex to the socket.

The one on the plug top is neatly clipped to the top of the skirting board and goes to a single gang socket outlet. I was going to say this was a C3

(To be honest, this is all a bit of an exercise in paperwork as the ring is broken, the IR readings are crap, the wiring is 40+ years old and there are about 5 sockets in the whole house. A new install is required but I was asked to do this for a house purchase so no doubt there will be some money haggling based on my report so it needs to say it as it is)
 
If they are on plugs I wouldn't class them as 'fixed wiring'.
Well I kind of agree but the fact that its a surface socket plugged and screwed to the building and all the cable is clipped where do you draw the line? Would you unplug it and omit that socket from the EICR then?
 
Well I kind of agree but the fact that its a surface socket plugged and screwed to the building and all the cable is clipped where do you draw the line? Would you unplug it and omit that socket from the EICR then?

In my opinion, yes. They are just extension leads.. Nicely installed extension leads rather than the lazy ones that are just thrown on the floor.
Example mate: I have an extension lead for my comp table.. I have been lazy and just bunged it on the floor behind the table. (Not fixed wiring)
If I were to be good and fix the sockets to the back of the table, so there are not wires everywhere then it's still an extension lead that is not fixed wiring.
 
Well I kind of agree but the fact that its a surface socket plugged and screwed to the building and all the cable is clipped where do you draw the line? Would you unplug it and omit that socket from the EICR then?
No I would class it as an extension lead and conduct testing as per The Code of Practice ISTIEE
 
What so any extension lead a customer has plugged in when you go to do an EICR you test?
No because an EICR is a report on the fixed wiring installation, what I meant and I''m sorry for any confusion, is that extension leads are subject to a different testing regime, and have no connection to an EICR. Should you be doing this sort of work??
 
No because an EICR is a report on the fixed wiring installation, what I meant and I''m sorry for any confusion, is that extension leads are subject to a different testing regime, and have no connection to an EICR. Should you be doing this sort of work??
Oh here we go... Pete, the question arose because (if you read back) there are 2 such sockets, one on a plug top one wired into the back of a plug, both wired in flex. The original question was actually about flex not about whether or not this should be 1) defined as an extension lead and 2) should extension leads be part of an EICR.

I am quite aware that the EICR report is for the fixed wiring only which is why I questioned your response. You wrote a poorly worded and confusing answer (by your own admission) and then proceeded to question should I be doing this type of work because I responded to your post.

Its people like you that really make we want to quit this forum. I'm sure you may offer some modicum of advice on threads here and there and you may be respected by some of your fellow old school electricians forum buddies who also offer the same old type of condescending, non-constructive, off topic comment such as "should you be doing this sort of work".

I question whether you should be commenting in forums but this country is all about freedom of speech so I suspect even those who struggle to convey themselves in a civilised and educated manner must be allowed to provail. I ask that since you don't know me, my knowledge, my experience or anything else about me, you don't question my motive, you simply either respond to the original post, or don't comment.

@Spoon thanks for your discussion and input into this thread.
 
In my opinion, yes. They are just extension leads
Technically, there's no doubt that they are. But I wonder how a non-technical householder would view a regular double-socket mounted on the wall, especially if the plug feeding it is hidden away somewhere. To them, perhaps it's just a wall socket. In a domestic environment there won't be an ISITEE program, so if you omit it from the EICR, it might be unsafe but the householder won't know this. If you point it out as a limitation, perhaps it would look a bit odd: "All your points are safe, although this one might not be; I haven't tested it because although the wiring is fixed to the wall, it's not part of the fixed wiring. If you want to know whether it's safe, you'll have to pay me to test it separately." We understand the logic but would they?

As for flex, are the socket terminals suitable for fine stranded / are the ends ferruled? Flex and T+E in the same terminal would be a no-no for me.
 
Oh here we go... Pete, the question arose because (if you read back) there are 2 such sockets, one on a plug top one wired into the back of a plug, both wired in flex. The original question was actually about flex not about whether or not this should be 1) defined as an extension lead and 2) should extension leads be part of an EICR.

I am quite aware that the EICR report is for the fixed wiring only which is why I questioned your response. You wrote a poorly worded and confusing answer (by your own admission) and then proceeded to question should I be doing this type of work because I responded to your post.

Its people like you that really make we want to quit this forum. I'm sure you may offer some modicum of advice on threads here and there and you may be respected by some of your fellow old school electricians forum buddies who also offer the same old type of condescending, non-constructive, off topic comment such as "should you be doing this sort of work".

I question whether you should be commenting in forums but this country is all about freedom of speech so I suspect even those who struggle to convey themselves in a civilised and educated manner must be allowed to provail. I ask that since you don't know me, my knowledge, my experience or anything else about me, you don't question my motive, you simply either respond to the original post, or don't comment.

@Spoon thanks for your discussion and input into this thread.

I believe a bit of confusion may be arising from your use of the word plug when you presumably mean socket.

If you are bothered about the one that is on a plugtop it might be worth noting it in the relevant section but it wouldn't necessarily warrant anything else in my opinion. (Edit: Lucien Nunes has made some valid points on this, difficult to gauge without seeing this particular example).

The one that's spurred:
Is the spur feeding a 1g or 2g socket?
Roughly how long is the spur?
 
Technically, there's no doubt that they are. But I wonder how a non-technical householder would view a regular double-socket mounted on the wall, especially if the plug feeding it is hidden away somewhere. To them, perhaps it's just a wall socket. In a domestic environment there won't be an ISITEE program, so if you omit it from the EICR, it might be unsafe but the householder won't know this. If you point it out as a limitation, perhaps it would look a bit odd: "All your points are safe, although this one might not be; I haven't tested it because although the wiring is fixed to the wall, it's not part of the fixed wiring. If you want to know whether it's safe, you'll have to pay me to test it separately." We understand the logic but would they?

As for flex, are the socket terminals suitable for fine stranded / are the ends ferruled? Flex and T+E in the same terminal would be a no-no for me.

Very good points mate.
I'm industrial and was giving the OP my opinion about if it was fixed wiring or not. Others might disagree with my opinion.
Whats the norm for doing testing on domestics? Do you include extension leads all in the same test.
Again I can understand it from the customers point of view, if you don't. They will think they are getting ripped off. Whats the solution? Better explanation of the test beforehand?
There are sooooo many programs on TV about bad tradesmen that you guys are on your back foot from the off.

OP:
one on a plug top one wired into the back of a plug

I'm unsure about the full explanation mate. Do you mean that one is wired into a plug and the other is hardwired into the back of a socket?
If so then for the one hardwired into the back of the socket I would class as 'fixed wiring'
 
As for you post #14:
Thanks for the thanks mate.
Now don't get me wrong but I consider @Pete999 to be a nice guy 99% of the time and he has earned my respect on here.. and it's bloody hard to get my respect.. As there are limited people I respect... I'm just a grumps sod..
Texts can always be taken out of context. That's the crud things about texts. I just imagine everyone wearing a mankini while running through a field of flowers.... Texts always look better that way...
 
I would personally not include plugged appliances or plugged additions however I may comment on the lack of socket outlets and the means by which additional outlets have been enabled. I see no problem with flexible cords connected direct to the fixed wiring provided it it suitably installed, terminated and restrained at points of entry.
If any of the "extension leads" were seen to be visibly dangerous there is every chance I would make a comment in the Report.
 
Oh here we go... Pete, the question arose because (if you read back) there are 2 such sockets, one on a plug top one wired into the back of a plug, both wired in flex. The original question was actually about flex not about whether or not this should be 1) defined as an extension lead and 2) should extension leads be part of an EICR.

I am quite aware that the EICR report is for the fixed wiring only which is why I questioned your response. You wrote a poorly worded and confusing answer (by your own admission) and then proceeded to question should I be doing this type of work because I responded to your post.

Its people like you that really make we want to quit this forum. I'm sure you may offer some modicum of advice on threads here and there and you may be respected by some of your fellow old school electricians forum buddies who also offer the same old type of condescending, non-constructive, off topic comment such as "should you be doing this sort of work".

I question whether you should be commenting in forums but this country is all about freedom of speech so I suspect even those who struggle to convey themselves in a civilised and educated manner must be allowed to provail. I ask that since you don't know me, my knowledge, my experience or anything else about me, you don't question my motive, you simply either respond to the original post, or don't comment.

@Spoon thanks for your discussion and input into this thread.
I would personally not include plugged appliances or plugged additions however I may comment on the lack of socket outlets and the means by which additional outlets have been enabled. I see no problem with flexible cords connected direct to the fixed wiring provided it it suitably installed, terminated and restrained at points of entry.
If any of the "extension leads" were seen to be visibly dangerous there is every chance I would make a comment in the Report.
If they are just that Extension leads, then they should be ignored / omitted from the EICR, however if they are hard wired then they must be include
 

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