Help and advice needed on new switch

[Adamuk]

Hello,

I’m a DIYer and am adding some fire rated spot lights to my kitchen ceiling amongst some other alterations to the various electrical sockets and switches. I’m also installing the kitchen myself to keep costs down.

Before I carry on I know that the kitchen is a safe zone and so building control will be out to inspect the work, notifiable, under part P. £340 later ... in hindsight it would probably would have been easier to get a spark out but that is by-the-by now. I’m enjoyjng the process none the less.

I’m in a spot of bother though (and need your help).

I needed to move the switch from the right hand side of the door, to the left, as my new double oven housing will be placed right where the original switch was located. Fairly straight forward it would seem! Or not ...

I started to cut a hole in the ceiling to reveal 4 enormous joists preventing me from getting the cable into the void where the existing ‘common’ loop is.

I think that one possible option would be to repair the ceiling, create a channel and tack the switch cable to the bottom of the 4 beams (by creating a small channel in the plaster directly above the switch and then plaster the cable in). I would really rather not use this option - dispite seeing it done before (by a spark) and from what I can gather is ‘technically OK’ based on various searches and discussions.

Would I be able to run the cable horizontally in the 150mm ‘safe zone’ and out along the left hand side of the wall (surface mounted) and then up into the ceiling void where I can run the cable to the common?

The wall on the left hand side I’m happy to have the cable on the surface as all of this section of the wall won’t be visible anyway as I’m installing floor to ceiling cupboards.

Thanks in advance


Adam

 

[DC-backfrom the past]

Just a suggestion have you thought of going down the way from the original switch?
ie lift floorboards or maybe you have a void below the floor?
that would allow you to go along and back up into your plasterboard wall to your new position.
Going by the ceiling joists, it Looks as thought the joists are running in the correct direction to be kind to you for below.

The heavy joists look as though they may be supporting a stair case, going by the limited view in the pictures. I wouldn't be cutting into them

you have already mentioned Part P
I would have to say you would have to ensure that any wiring etc ,is installed correctly as per the regs and tested prior to it being connected and live. Obviously I would suggest that you get a qualified spark in to do this for you​

 

[Taylortwocities]

Before I carry on I know that the kitchen is a safe zone and so building control will be out to inspect the work, notifiable,

Why? Kitchens used to be, but are no longer special locations. If you are extending/altering existing circuits then this work is NOT notifiable. So that's saved you £340.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Yes, you can run the cable in the 150mm safe zone at the top of the wall, then vertically down to the switch.

 

[Adamuk]

Just a suggestion have you thought of going down the way from the original switch?
ie lift floorboards or maybe you have a void below the floor?
that would allow you to go along and back up into your plasterboard wall to your new position.
Going by the ceiling joists, it Looks as thought the joists are running in the correct direction to be kind to you for below.

The heavy joists look as though they may be supporting a stair case, going by the limited view in the pictures. I wouldn't be cutting into them

you have already mentioned Part P
I would have to say you would have to ensure that any wiring etc ,is installed correctly as per the regs and tested prior to it being connected and live. Obviously I would suggest that you get a qualified spark in to do this for you​

I have and I can see that the orgional installers drilled through these beams and braced appropriately to get the cable to the void on the other side.

The problem here is the void on the right side of the door doesn’t have a staircase in it!

Also, annoying, it’s a modern-ish build so all the floor boards are chipboard and glued so access from above is limited.

Perhaps what I should do here is do the first fix and get a sparky to commission in - hopefully you’re less like plumbers when it comes to touching other people’s work!

 

[Adamuk]

Why? Kitchens used to be, but are no longer special locations. If you are extending/altering existing circuits then this work is NOT notifiable. So that's saved you £340.

That is brilliant news. I originally thought that but then assumed it was notifiable. I expect I was looking at the rules for Wales which appear to be stricter.

 

[Adamuk]

Yes, you can run the cable in the 150mm safe zone at the top of the wall, then vertically down to the switch.

I think I will choose this option. I could go belt and braces and mechanically secure the cable in metal conduit on the vertical run. I’m always conscious of other people buying my house one day however it will be very obvious a cable runs into this space as part of it will be surface mounted.

 

[Andy78]

I have and I can see that the orgional installers drilled through these beams and braced appropriately to get the cable to the void on the other side.

The problem here is the void on the right side of the door doesn’t have a staircase in it!

Also, annoying, it’s a modern-ish build so all the floor boards are chipboard and glued so access from above is limited.

Perhaps what I should do here is do the first fix and get a sparky to commission in - hopefully you’re less like plumbers when it comes to touching other people’s work!

Yes all electrical alteration work should be properly tested and a certificate produced. This is to ensure compliance with the wiring regulations and hence the safety of the altered circuit. Helps keeps your home insurance valid too if anything went wrong and questions were asked.
If you are going to get an electrician in to do this you must get them in now as they will want to know the scope of alterations and possibly inspect the work at first fix stage.
Personally I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole but that's just me.

 

[Adamuk]

Yes all electrical alteration work should be properly tested and a certificate produced. This is to ensure compliance with the wiring regulations and hence the safety of the altered circuit. Helps keeps your home insurance valid too if anything went wrong and questions were asked.
If you are going to get an electrician in to do this you must get them in now as they will want to know the scope of alterations and possibly inspect the work at first fix stage.
Personally I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole but that's just me.

If I leave all the walls exposed with the wiring runs visible and left you to make the connections and commission you still wouldn’t carry out the work?

 

[Andy78]

If I leave all the walls exposed with the wiring runs visible and left you to make the connections and commission you still wouldn’t carry out the work?

I personally wouldn't. I don't certificate anybody else's work at all. Diyer, other trade, or other electrician.
If I was going to though I would want to inspect the first fix wiring, yes.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Ditto. Me no touch DIY jobs.

An electrician will need to certify that he designed, installed and tested the work.
Your plan is to for some dodgy blokes on an internet forum to do the design, you install it and for some sparky to put his todge on the block and sign it off?

Adam, mate, I just saved you £340. A sparky could do a job like in a couple of hours.

 

[Adamuk]

Ditto. Me no touch DIY jobs.

An electrician will need to certify that he designed, installed and tested the work.
Your plan is to for some dodgy blokes on an internet forum to do the design, you install it and for some sparky to put his todge on the block and sign it off?

Adam, mate, I just saved you £340. A sparky could do a job like in a couple of hours.

Appreciated and going to get a spark out.

 

[telectrix]

Appreciated and going to get a spark out.

good boy. now you can come out of the naughty corner. .

 

[DPG]

All's well that ends well.