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I've been trying to understand exactly what the details of the dispute is about. I've read and heard is about extending doctors hours but also altering contract for enhanced payments for unsocial hours?
 
I must confess I'm confused by all this. Neither side have telling a coherent message if you ask me - and I doubt either side has been totally honest either...
 
To be honest I can't understand why they are negotiating a Monday to Friday contract and arguing over weekend working enhancements to create a fully 7 days a week NHS surely they need a contract that makes the weekend part of a normal working rota
 
From what I've read, and heard, a lot of it seems to come down to money. They don't care about working evenings and weekends, as they do anyway, but they want to be paid more for those shifts (most currently get overtime rates). I'm fairly sure that firemen, police and paramedics don't get extra so I don't see why they should in all honesty. It seems to be aimed at saving money for the NHS.

You'll never see a balanced report though so it's next to impossible to form an objective opinion. But money seems to be a big issue.
 
From what I've read, and heard, a lot of it seems to come down to money. They don't care about working evenings and weekends, as they do anyway, but they want to be paid more for those shifts (most currently get overtime rates). I'm fairly sure that firemen, police and paramedics don't get extra so I don't see why they should in all honesty. It seems to be aimed at saving money for the NHS.

You'll never see a balanced report though so it's next to impossible to form an objective opinion. But money seems to be a big issue.

My misses gets enhanced payments for weekends and night shifts so some NHS workers do......
 
Would anyone here be happy to have a new contract (which they strongly disagree with) imposed on them ?

no but it happened to me many years ago. Accept it or find a new job was the situation. So I accepted it and left 6 months later
 
seeing as the nasty party want to distroy the NHS that's probably the outcome they are hoping for

What a balanced argument you provide. This is the problem with you, you're so left wing, and so anti Tory, that you can't provide a sensible argument, and your comment of "the nasty party want to destroy the NHS" exemplifies this. I would like to see your reasons for thinking this, all I've really seen on the subject is that they're pumping more money into it than ever, and trying to cut waste and make the service more efficient, while also providing a 7 day service. I think to only have a standard 9-5, Monday to Friday full service from the NHS, in 2016, is a complete disgrace. It also explains why urgent referrals take 4 months. So surely a 24/7 service would cut waiting lists and see patients seen far quicker? It interests me why it's ok for doctors to demand higher wages for working after 5pm, or on a weekend, but it's not ok for the Health Secretary to negotiate with that and try to minimise the times that premium wages are paid, therefore saving the NHS millions per year, which could then be spent on patients or more doctors/nurses...
 
My misses gets enhanced payments for weekends and night shifts so some NHS workers do......

I know full well that they do. Some NHS workers also refuse to accept a full time contract, and instead choose to work part time on contract, and then fill in the other few days of the week as an agency worker so that they earn more money. Unfortunately, because the NHS budget goes up every year, there are a lot of people who want to jump on the gravy train.
 
I know full well that they do. Some NHS workers also refuse to accept a full time contract, and instead choose to work part time on contract, and then fill in the other few days of the week as an agency worker so that they earn more money. Unfortunately, because the NHS budget goes up every year, there are a lot of people who want to jump on the gravy train.

Where my misses works they are NOT allowed to work as agency in the same hospital. If people choose to do this they can BUT they won't be topping up their more than generous NHS pensions when doing agency work....

Now if you are a copper, and you need to fill out reports, you automatically get overtime. Not so in midwifery!
 
from what I've seen what a lot are complaining about is that it is just junior doctors that will be 7 days a week at the moment. what good is having doctors and nurses 7 days a week when essential services like surgeons and xray staff are not.

if they brought staff onto a standard shift pattern for example 4 on 4 off nights followed by days i dont think people would mind so much rather than working 7 days a week.

or even having some staff work. mon-fri others wed-sun and others on night shift with some on call etc.
 
I'm rather right wing actually .....

I've got plenty of complaints about how the NHS is run, not just by the nasty party, but its only them who clearly want the concept of free at the point of use destroyed.


Let's start with how its run as a marketplace, do your own research if you don't understand what that means - it effectively costs an extra 10-20 billion - that's a lot of Doctors wages.


How about the 6,000 ex NHS workers given overly generous redundancy payments, who have since been reemployed by the NHS (often on higher rates) - that's cost around 2 billion - that's again a lot of Doctors wages


The introduction of the health and social care act, yet another "top down" reorganisation, only advocated by politicians, hated by care givers - costing approx 5 billion, saving ?


How about the way that many patients private medical records have been released to private health firms, yet have decided that their awarding billions worth of NHS contracts should be protected by the freedom of information act ?


I could go on, and on and on, theres tens and tens of billions of pounds being wasted.


Yet the nasty party have (despite having 3 years to solve the issue) decided that the only way to make progress was imposition - thus alienating en mass the backbone of the entire NHS. - they've even managed to turn the dispute into another of their much loved anti union missions.


And they want us to beleive they are the party of the NHS


BS
 
I'm rather right wing actually .....

I've got plenty of complaints about how the NHS is run, not just by the nasty party, but its only them who clearly want the concept of free at the point of use destroyed.


Let's start with how its run as a marketplace, do your own research if you don't understand what that means - it effectively costs an extra 10-20 billion - that's a lot of Doctors wages.


How about the 6,000 ex NHS workers given overly generous redundancy payments, who have since been reemployed by the NHS (often on higher rates) - that's cost around 2 billion - that's again a lot of Doctors wages


The introduction of the health and social care act, yet another "top down" reorganisation, only advocated by politicians, hated by care givers - costing approx 5 billion, saving ?


How about the way that many patients private medical records have been released to private health firms, yet have decided that their awarding billions worth of NHS contracts should be protected by the freedom of information act ?


I could go on, and on and on, theres tens and tens of billions of pounds being wasted.


Yet the nasty party have (despite having 3 years to solve the issue) decided that the only way to make progress was imposition - thus alienating en mass the backbone of the entire NHS. - they've even managed to turn the dispute into another of their much loved anti union missions.


And they want us to beleive they are the party of the NHS


BS

Really? Like to see that quantified.

What I don't understand is that both Germany and France spend more than us on healthcare - yet they don't have the NHS - so how do they deliver it.

As far as I'm concerned the NHS is like British Leyland in the 1970's - trying to be al things to all people AND failing badly. If the private sector can do knee ops (for example) cheaper and more effectively, then let the NHS pay them to do it.
 

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