I'm back on the tools. What the hell is wrong with these testing companies?

[Sparky Ninja]

Well I'm am out of the training game for a bit..

I've got a couple of work offers but I am basically whoring myself out to whatever is paying for the foreseeable..

So I've done a full test of a primary school this week, I was handed Amtech Fastest loaded on a laptop which had all the cert data pre-loaded from someone else and I was asked to just test and fill in the blanks.


So a couple of things (bearing in mind the extent claimed 100%):

1 - Since when was it ok to 'tick' the R1&R2 having just carried out a Zs?
2 - Oh and regarding that Zs, don't look for the highest, or work out the furthest. Take it from the lowest ceiling.
3 - Since when was it acceptable to not even attempt to do IR?
4 - "Pump room? we don't go in here we just LIM it"


I've just completed a school for this company and have data they don't want because they have never had so much and don't need it.. or maybe know what it is?
I've measured current imbalances, taken thermal images and done power quality analysis on their BMS main control panels.

Oh and all the 'electrically competent person' observations I have made - that granted are not non-compliance's with BS 7671 but are non compliance's with BS 5266, The IET PAT CoP and BS 7909 to name a couple. They don't want to pass them to the customer either - probably because they don't understand them..



Basically I was given a week in the building so did everything I could in the time given. It was all tested by Thursday which left me with a day to go round double checking and carrying out inspections - but the 'QS' has chosen to change my IR readings back to LIM and my measured values of R1&R2 to 'ticks'..

What a douche!

Oh and Amtech Fastest software? What a restricting auto adjusting load of crap.




If testing companies are going to treat the testing work this way it's going to end up like PAT.



Oh, and one of the observations I made.. see if you can spot it.

 

[Richard Burns]

Sounds like the usual rubbish testing being reported even when the inspection and testing has been done correctly!
They cannot up their game or it would make the other bodgers look bad!
No idea about Amtech, surely it is easier to use , no more of this writing down figures, icons and symbols are much easier.:stuart:

Observations on the panel, random loose white cable taped over?
Change of phase sequence from isolator?

 

[Darkwood]

I would guess but hard to tell from a photo.. are those data cables thus where they are bared back they are not rated to the cables they share in the same trunking?
Also insulating stabs on the empty outputs seem to be for decoration as there are isolating switches for the busbar stabs.
Last be not least, the whole MCB section is upside down, now that might cause the electic to flow the wrong way :mellow:...unless your photo is inverted?

 

[rapparee]

I see two orphans that are not connected to anything at the top of the board.

 

[davesparks]

I'm curious as to what you've found in a primary school that comes under BS7909?

 

[netblindpaul]

Well I'm am out of the training game for a bit..

I've got a couple of work offers but I am basically whoring myself out to whatever is paying for the foreseeable..

So I've done a full test of a primary school this week, I was handed Amtech Fastest loaded on a laptop which had all the cert data pre-loaded from someone else and I was asked to just test and fill in the blanks.


So a couple of things (bearing in mind the extent claimed 100%):

1 - Since when was it ok to 'tick' the R1&R2 having just carried out a Zs?
2 - Oh and regarding that Zs, don't look for the highest, or work out the furthest. Take it from the lowest ceiling.
3 - Since when was it acceptable to not even attempt to do IR?
4 - "Pump room? we don't go in here we just LIM it"


I've just completed a school for this company and have data they don't want because they have never had so much and don't need it.. or maybe know what it is?
I've measured current imbalances, taken thermal images and done power quality analysis on their BMS main control panels.

Oh and all the 'electrically competent person' observations I have made - that granted are not non-compliance's with BS 7671 but are non compliance's with BS 5266, The IET PAT CoP and BS 7909 to name a couple. They don't want to pass them to the customer either - probably because they don't understand them..



Basically I was given a week in the building so did everything I could in the time given. It was all tested by Thursday which left me with a day to go round double checking and carrying out inspections - but the 'QS' has chosen to change my IR readings back to LIM and my measured values of R1&R2 to 'ticks'..

What a douche!

Oh and Amtech Fastest software? What a restricting auto adjusting load of crap.




If testing companies are going to treat the testing work this way it's going to end up like PAT.



Oh, and one of the observations I made.. see if you can spot it.

View attachment 32365

Is that panel CE marked?

 

[Marvo]

Not sure what that SP+N is doing at the top right. There's no main MCB and it looks like a t/pole isolator toward the bottom right.

 

[ipf]

Triple pole breaker in wrong position involving 2ways.....G, Br, Bl ?....and Merlin

 

[TJ Anderson]

Is that a Merlin MCB on Neutral?

 

[westward10]

I work for a testing company and are constantly out priced by companies who promise the world and fail to deliver, the client is generally none the wiser. Is it that the distribution board is full of non compatible protective devices.

 

[Wilko]

An "oh dear" moment just now when looking at the pic. I am seeing data cables in here - these go out to the PCs the kids touch - please someone tell me I'm wrong? Not to mention the IT tech who bumbles about with these cables from time to time. I bet they've no idea about live working or how to make safe. I hope I am wrong

 

[oracle]

I'm back on the tools for summer. Was taken on by a large contractor and given to someone who would "show me the ropes"

He happened to be someone who I trained and assessed his 2391 practical. I was stringent about meeting all the criteria and completing results accurately.

He measures the Ze, a Zs on one socket per ring and the RCD. That's it. 10 minutes of testing then 30 minutes of fudging the rest on a tablet. Up to eight installations a day.

All the time teaching and training the guy about the importance of the job and a few years later he's a sticker jockey.

 

[westward10]

I'm back on the tools for summer. Was taken on by a large contractor and given to someone who would "show me the ropes"

He happened to be someone who I trained and assessed his 2391 practical. I was stringent about meeting all the criteria and completing results accurately.

He measures the Ze, a Zs on one socket per ring and the RCD. That's it. 10 minutes of testing then 30 minutes of fudging the rest on a tablet. Up to eight installations a day.

All the time teaching and training the guy about the importance of the job and a few years later he's a sticker jockey.

Is this actually serious.

 

[Leesparkykent]

From what I've seen most of these testing firms are a complete joke....Pittance per circuit, no real inspection and made up test results. Most customers don't care as long as they get a satisfactory report for a cheap price.

 

[westward10]

From what I've seen most of these testing firms are a complete joke....Pittance per circuit, no real inspection and made up test results. Most customers don't care as long as they get a satisfactory report for a cheap price.

I agree but this post doesn't read correct, he says he trained this bloke, did he say nothing.

 

[oracle]

Yes it is serious, no I didn't explain fully about what happened, yes I asked what the hell he was doing so he told me that he wasn't my student any longer so back off. I saw how it was going to be and walked away. I now am working on my own and doing a proper job.

I just can't believe that a truly professional career like this can go to the dogs so easily. We are working with peoples lives at stake and our certificates and reports are intended to determine whether a new installation is safe to put into service, or whether an existing installation is safe to remain in service for a given period.

I long for the day when the Regs become statutory and any failure to comply in full a criminal offence.

 

[Risteard]

From what I've seen most of these testing firms are a complete joke....Pittance per circuit, no real inspection and made up test results. Most customers don't care as long as they get a satisfactory report for a cheap price.

Having done a brief stint with one of the major testing firms here a number of years back they expected between 30 and 40 circuits per day to be tested. As you say the inspection element (which is the most important part) is neglected/ignored. Testing should only ever supplement inspection which, after all, is where most problems will be identified.

I have to say that it is very rare indeed for me to inspect an installation and give it a "Satisfactory" assessment. It is extremely rare to have no C1 or C2 defects or FI Observations.

 

[westward10]

Yes it is serious, no I didn't explain fully about what happened, yes I asked what the hell he was doing so he told me that he wasn't my student any longer so back off. I saw how it was going to be and walked away. I now am working on my own and doing a proper job.

I just can't believe that a truly professional career like this can go to the dogs so easily. We are working with peoples lives at stake and our certificates and reports are intended to determine whether a new installation is safe to put into service, or whether an existing installation is safe to remain in service for a given period.

I long for the day when the Regs become statutory and any failure to comply in full a criminal offence.

Fair enough, apologies if I offended. I think the reason these people go to the dogs so quickly is due to pressure of attaining a certain quota per day and that means banging out the circuits. I agree with Risteard and yourself it is the visual aspect which generally gives the final Report content.

 

[oracle]

Hi Westward

No offence taken, what discouraged me was I believed that I was training responsible professionals. Before teaching I have tested hundreds of Installations domestic commercial and industrial and made a good living doing it.

I have always been scrupulous about the inspection, testing and documentation and walked away when asked or required to compromise the requirements.

From this and other posts I know that there are many others who feel the same.

 

[westward10]

Hi Westward

No offence taken, what discouraged me was I believed that I was training responsible professionals. Before teaching I have tested hundreds of Installations domestic commercial and industrial and made a good living doing it.

I have always been scrupulous about the inspection, testing and documentation and walked away when asked or required to compromise the requirements.

From this and other posts I know that there are many others who feel the same.

It is a joke, I have to assess new so called "testers" as part of my job. They can generally use test equipment but it isn't difficult I could probably teach my mother, but when it comes to visually inspecting an installation they walk about like they are blind, the most obvious stuff they cannot see. I honestly believe they see nothing wrong because they know no different.