Level of qualification needed to obtain licence?

[Guest55]

We just need one baseline set up then everyone knows the level that an electrician is at. Would the unions of the 70's allowed all this demarcation within one industry field

Yay !! Unions to the rescue !! lol
Lets bring back all the 70's socialist propaganda , high unemployment & high taxation while were at it.
Bins overflowing & no rubbish collection cos were on strike ?
yep another union epic fail.
you need to fast forward a few decades pal cos no-ones buying into that crap anymore.

 

[D Skelton]

Yay !! Unions to the rescue !! lol
Lets bring back all the 70's socialist propaganda , high unemployment & high taxation while were at it.
Bins overflowing & no rubbish collection cos were on strike ?
yep another union epic fail.
you need to fast forward a few decades pal cos no-ones buying into that crap anymore.

Yay !! Big business to the rescue !! lol
Lets carry on allowing companies to pay their staff less than they actually need to live on, high unemployment & high taxation of the poor while we're at it.
Bins overflowing & no rubbish collection cos privatistion of state supplied services means that cuts get made to frontline staff and we suffer as a result.
yep another capatilist government epic fail.
you need to look at other moderate socialist countries to see how it does work, and how this false idea of a free market does nothing but push wages down and the cost of living up!

Now then, lets all look up the meaning of the word 'digression' in the dictionary

 

[Guest55]

Yay !! Big business to the rescue !! lol
Lets carry on allowing companies to pay their staff less than they actually need to live on, high unemployment & high taxation of the poor while we're at it.
Bins overflowing & no rubbish collection cos privatistion of state supplied services means that cuts get made to frontline staff and we suffer as a result.
yep another capatilist government epic fail.
you need to look at other moderate socialist countries to see how it does work, and how this false idea of a free market does nothing but push wages down and the cost of living up!

Now then, lets all look up the meaning of the word 'digression' in the dictionary

with such strong views it sounds to me you'd be more suited to a state controlled administration desk job than operating a business in an open market.

epic career choice fail for mr skelton................. ;-)

if you want to talk about the economic ins and outs of it all be my guest
but all this political jibber jabber is boring the crap out of me , its been done to death.

 

[ipf]

Yay !! Big business to the rescue !! lol
Lets carry on allowing companies to pay their staff less than they actually need to live on, high unemployment & high taxation of the poor while we're at it.
Bins overflowing & no rubbish collection cos privatistion of state supplied services means that cuts get made to frontline staff and we suffer as a result.
yep another capatilist government epic fail.
you need to look at other moderate socialist countries to see how it does work, and how this false idea of a free market does nothing but push wages down and the cost of living up!

Now then, lets all look up the meaning of the word 'digression' in the dictionary

....and note where the bed of industry lies.

 

[D Skelton]

with such strong views it sounds to me you'd be more suited to a state controlled administration desk job than operating a business in an open market.

epic career choice fail for mr skelton................. ;-)

You don't have to have an open market to allow business' to thrive! Moderate socialism doesn't have to be the death of business! I am in no way anti-business, just anti corporation!

True socialism doesn't work, as you say, moderately controlled socialism makes for a very healthy economy however!

Do you know what, if I ever got to the stage of being some millionaire businessman with 50 staff I would be more than happy to do two things; 1. Pay my staff at the very least a living wage, and 2. Pay more into the pot through a higher tax bracket for those less fortunate than I.

That's all moderate socialism is really

 

[m top]

Elecsa are putting up there scheme membership to a min of nvq3 this year to join is this not a step in the right direction peps!

 

[Guest55]

you need to ask yourself ...........

what would rommel and the hitler youth do in this situation ?

:tank:


:smilielol5:

 

[overskilled]

Part of the issue is at the moment, that training opportunities aren't decided by merit...more who do you know...
Look at the constant moaning about the attitude of school leaver apprentices........many of whom struggle to write their own name and were pushed out of school towards a trade before they burnt the place down.....
While at the same time, those who frequently have the brain power to become sparks are turned down for apprenticeships with a lot of employers for not being "one of the lads" or not willing to cut corners....can't have it both ways......

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Agreed above...as in, "we're all equal, but some are more equal than others" - pure socialism just doesn't work. But something 'moderately controlled might.... Like it.

just to be positive fora s econd, and yes I am drinking beer, (part time sparky I am a house dad mondays I wear a pinny) , this is still one of, if not THE, BEST country to live in in the world.

its easy to forget.

even with our dwindling wages and increasing state pension age, its all....well, relative.

alot of,countries don't have a state pension, drinking water from a tap, roads, electricity, jobs, food, an NHS, A fire service, life past 40 for the vast populous..... You get the gist.

the country is still covered is fat people getting fatter, wide screen teles and brand new 4x4's and every man and his dog wants to hide in a truck to get here.

even skint, we live like kings,

 

[southsea1201]

There has to be a base line, some good guys will inevitably fall short of this, but a vast majority of bad guys will be unable to operate as a result. Politics my friend, it's about doing the greatest amound of good for the greatest amount of people, and in this case, the needs of the unsuspecting general public trump those of a few unqualified 'electricians'.

Indeed, so let's let the sh*te sparkies continue to wreak their havoc ( after all they are qualified). Sorry I disagree with your thesis, but qualifications are not enough. The inspection of your work by an independent body has to be the benchmark to raise standards.

 

[overskilled]

Thoroughly agree Southsea, bad sparks have always been around, licensing without regular "unannounced" spot checks just gives them legitimacy and turns a blind eye the endemic issues....
Another point are those time served who sit basic stuff like the 2382 over and over and over and over, yet are allowed to keep working on homes and businesses despite their knowledge being well below par...

 

[Jibapproved]

JIB have already set a standard

 

[GLENNSPARK]

I think a lot of the problems lie with the NICEIC since it came up with defined scope approval to run along side the approved contractor scheme this to me has mushroomed into the competent persons schemes we have now. I would like to think that no self respecting electricians came up with the make a quick buck training system and schemes we have now.

We only need one line in the sand that is a base level qualification that enables everybody to work on any basic electrical system in any sector with further specialised courses or modularised training specific to the industry sectors you are working in if required quite simple really no money spinning assessment scheme complication an electrician is an electrician end of

so what about all them that work in these short course Electrical Trainee training centres then?

dont try telling me they dont know, are actively involved in and contribute to the out n out shambles we have at the mo..

they are contributing (knowingly) to it as a lot of these characters will have vested interests themselves...maybe even own a slice of the training centre they slither about in...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Indeed, so let's let the sh*te sparkies continue to wreak their havoc ( after all they are qualified). Sorry I disagree with your thesis, but qualifications are not enough. The inspection of your work by an independent body has to be the benchmark to raise standards.

yeah...
and not one thats olive branching it to the government...

or oily brown envolope backhander stuff as well...

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Gosh you're, well, just such a cynic Glenn.....

 

[overskilled]

JIB have already set a standard

Aye and its resulted in a shambles, companies that drop in and out of paying JIB rates with no sanctions, no interest in getting the best candidates into the industry.....as usual serve the interest of their corporate members rather than the people on the tools or the industry at large....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Spoken like a truly unqualified spark.

Qualified drivers are not necessarily good drivers. Does that mean that as of tomorrow we should allow all unlicensed people to drive?

There has to be a base line, some good guys will inevitably fall short of this, but a vast majority of bad guys will be unable to operate as a result. Politics my friend, it's about doing the greatest amound of good for the greatest amount of people, and in this case, the needs of the unsuspecting general public trump those of a few unqualified 'electricians'.

and that base line is far, far too low at the moment...

stooping to new depths...

disgraceful..it really is...that someone can just flippently come off a few days course and then go out installing whatever...

 

[Badged01]

JIB have already set a standard

mmmmmm ..... and I think we can all say we've come across (or had working for us) JIB "electricians" who we wouldn't let work unsupervised!

Or maybe Ive just had some bad experiences .......

 

[Badged01]

that someone can just flippently come off a few days course and then go out installing whatever...

There lies the problem. A course is a course and is meaningless in its own right. I could do an underwater, night-time, assasins course part-time at college but still couldnt kill jack sh*t.

The issues lies with someone has deamed then "competent" to 'install' based on not just the course but other attributes/experiences they have!!

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Gosh you're, well, just such a cynic Glenn.....

well you know me...i says what i sees...