Phone extension

[Capn Ahab]

Have been asked to connect a phone extension where cable with 3 twisted pairs has already been pulled in.

First of all I thought phone line only had four wires? A phone jack only has 4 connections AFAIK anyway.

The main question though is whether fitting a slave socket at each end with a jack to jack connector at the origin will work?

Cheers.

 

[ashrow]

you only need 3 cores for the phone extension
Terminal 2, 3 and 5
Terminal 3 is the ringer core, a master phone point only needs 2 and 5

Correct colour code if i remember rightly
2 blue white
3 orange white
5 White blue

Hope this helps

 

[Capn Ahab]

So I'd better just tuck the other three cores out the way then.

 

[ashrow]

yep

 

[Capn Ahab]

The phone isn't working. Connected as above, but also terminated white/orange in 4. Phone dead. I have no idea how to test, but I suspect the phone cable that has been there "since forever" may be damaged somewhere along the 20M run.

Anyone got any suggestions? It is in a local supermarket, so there are several phones dotted about.

 

[ayjay]

did you use the correct tool to attach the wires into the blade connectors in the plate?

 

[Geordie Spark]

The phone isn't working. Connected as above, but also terminated white/orange in 4. Phone dead. I have no idea how to test, but I suspect the phone cable that has been there "since forever" may be damaged somewhere along the 20M run.

Anyone got any suggestions? It is in a local supermarket, so there are several phones dotted about.

Are you saying you don't know how to test for continuity??

If your answer is "yes", then this once fine forum really has gone to the dogs !!!

You say: "there are several phones dotted about" This may mean they are part of a system whereby one phone can call another in the supermarket i.e. till operator to manager's office.

If this is the case you'll probably need ALL the cores connected at all the sockets.

It makes no difference to the working which colours you use - so long as 2 goes to 2, 3 goes to 3 etc. but the normal convention is:

2 Blue with white stripe
3 Orange with white stripe
4 White with orange stripe
5 White with blue stripe

The greens will go to terminals 1 & 6.

 

[Rappid]

Measure the voltage, you should have 50v dc, will give you a idea where the break is if you measure at every connection point.

 

[Adam W]

I was thinking along the same lines as Geordie - chances are it's not simply a case of master and slave, but each extension goes back to a switch, so staff can call between extensions.
The supermarket and their head office probably don't want customers, suppliers etc calling up and having their call answered by some naughty customer who has heard the phone ringing on the shop floor.

 

[SYKRAPS]

Find the other end Capn Ahab and ensure that the the terminal numbers and colour codes match, you say that the cable was already pulled in so are you sure it is connected at the other end?

Also if it is part of a cabinate installation you may need to fit a patch lead at the cabinate end to make your outlet live.

 

[Geordie Spark]

It looks like Capn Ahab has been caught up in Hurricane Sandy ....... we haven't seen him for a while !!! :sailor:

 

[Tidy Max]

There's only one solution with phone line problems, the easiest fix is to make sure the problematic cable is pulled quite tight, get two paper cups, put holes in the bottom of them and feed each end of the phone line through the base of the cups, tie a knot.

Hey presto phones fixed.

Be warned this fix does cause some issues with internal calls to different/multiple phone lines, general recommendation in that case is a loud hailer/mega phone.

Alternatively find the other end of the cable as mentioned, and check the cores aren't damaged and the colour code used is correct, you do get some cowboys that terminate any old colour code.

And apologies for the sarcastic reply (and for starting a sentence with 'And') i am just loosing the will to live today.

 

[Capn Ahab]

Heh, not caught in any storms just try not to get too addicted to these yer tinternet forums, so I'm not on it more than once every few days.

Are you saying you don't know how to test for continuity??

It makes no difference to the working which colours you use - so long as 2 goes to 2, 3 goes to 3 etc. but the normal convention is:

2 Blue with white stripe
3 Orange with white stripe
4 White with orange stripe
5 White with blue stripe

The greens will go to terminals 1 & 6.

Cheers for that mate. I do know a bit about inspection and testing as it goes... I just don't have a clue about phones, but since I was asked to connect up an already installed cable at the same time as doing some lighting, I thought how hard can it be. I connected it up exactly as you said funnily enough, but nothing. I never considered using the fluke to do a continuity test, but I suppose there's no reason why not other than it will be fiddly.

Measure the voltage, you should have 50v dc, will give you a idea where the break is if you measure at every connection point.

Between which two cores should I get 50v?

Find the other end Capn Ahab and ensure that the the terminal numbers and colour codes match, you say that the cable was already pulled in so are you sure it is connected at the other end?

Also if it is part of a cabinate installation you may need to fit a patch lead at the cabinate end to make your outlet live.

It's definitely connected as I did both ends. It might be wrong in the cabinet I guess.

You say: "there are several phones dotted about" This may mean they are part of a system whereby one phone can call another in the supermarket i.e. till operator to manager's office.

If this is the case you'll probably need ALL the cores connected at all the sockets.

This is the bit where I get out of my depth, as I would not know how to test/design/figure out this kind of system. I have a couple of ideas as to what it might be thanks to the advice on here so I'll have another crack when I next get back there, but if none of it works, I'll admit defeat and advise the customer to call in someone who knows more about telephony than me.

Cheers for all your responses chaps. Very helpful as ever!!

One final thing - if I wanted to read up on data cabling and phones, where would you point me? Book, web, short course??

Thx :rockstar:

 

[deltacabling]

Have a look at an existing working phone point and copy that?
Are the phones digital or analogue ? if there digital then the normal connection should be 3/4 on the phone outlet or for a analog phone 5/2.
What did you connect to in the cabinet? was it a RJ-45 type patch panel or was it a Krone strip? If it was a RJ45 Panel then for a analog phone system you should connect to 5&4 or digital system normally 1&2.
Also if a RJ45 Panel you would of course still need to patch a lead from the port to the phone distribution panel.
HTH