PIR problems

[lockhes]

evening all

i fitted 2 lights with a pir sensor controlling each light both working fine when i left and for about a week, until 1 became faulty it comes on around just getting dark all fine but soon as it gets dark completley it wont pick anybody up.

so i replaced sensor last week customer rang up today saying same things happening again but other lights been fine all along seems odd having 2 faulty sensors bought few weeks apart

lights are a 2d fitting

any sugestions

 

[Marvo]

Was the light fitting and sensor made as one unit or were they separate items that you've wired together?

 

[captainkev]

sounds like you got a light source nearby working off a photocell, making your new sensor light think its daylight

 

[lockhes]

seperate units i have wired together

there was an old light there which was switched so i blanked off switch and linked perm and switch together then to the PIR then to the light

 

[lockhes]

sounds like you got a light source nearby working off a photocell, making your new sensor light think its daylight

ifnthis was the problem i would of thought the other 1 would have this problem as theres more surounding light in that area

 

[captainkev]

do both lights work off same pir or seperate

 

[lockhes]

​seperate

 

[Marvo]

Are the PIR's relay output or solid state (triac/Diac)?

 

[Engineer54]

I have no trust in those room occupancy PIR's, never found one that's been reliable enough to fit and forget yet....
Most last longer than a week or so though!! lol!! They are at their worst when switching CFL lamps, they just don't like em!!

 

[tazz]

GLD had this market sown up years ago with good quality external pirs and equipment. But now there seems to be real bad quality gear out there sold buy the local wholesallers.

 

[Darkwood]

Switching CFL lamps with a PIR is poor design option IMO if you sort your issue out youll be back in a few months time replacing the burnt out lamps.....

Ill agree with above your PIR may be saturated by another heat source and can't then see the passing source or its been set up incorrectly so you are not crossing the PIR but actually walking into it which can blind it to a persons presence... Id be fitting relay triggered PIRs with Led floods ... done loads of these and never been back to one.

I refused to fit PIR's in the past just to their reliability been poor.

 

[MDJ]

Switching CFL lamps with a PIR is poor design option IMO if you sort your issue out youll be back in a few months time replacing the burnt out lamps.....

Quite Right, you will find the manufacturers recommend the lights are run for long periods with a sensor, short bursts just ruin lamp life and infact the control gear as well.

 

[Engineer54]

Quite Right, you will find the manufacturers recommend the lights are run for long periods with a sensor, short bursts just ruin lamp life and infact the control gear as well.

Just looking at a Hager PIR sensor (EE804/EE805) information /data sheet now, (the next manufacturers unit we are going to try) ....Nothing about recommending long on periods and short bursts ruining lamp life (but that would go without saying for any lamp type!!) etc just the sensors max Wattage for given types of lamps!!

 

[Engineer54]

Switching CFL lamps with a PIR is poor design option IMO if you sort your issue out youll be back in a few months time replacing the burnt out lamps.....

Ill agree with above your PIR may be saturated by another heat source and can't then see the passing source or its been set up incorrectly so you are not crossing the PIR but actually walking into it which can blind it to a persons presence... Id be fitting relay triggered PIRs with Led floods ... done loads of these and never been back to one.

I refused to fit PIR's in the past just to their reliability been poor.

These PIR sensors are for internal areas not exterior, normally in toilets and other infrequently used areas such as large/small storage rooms etc. Most internal type fittings, either being surface or recessed, are still generally based around fluorescent and CFL lamps of one description or another, unless were talking about small LED downlights, so it's hardly bad design, no-one is going to fit incandescent lamps these days are they... lol!!

 

[lockhes]

well i went tonight to look at them and worked fine

i advised her on timers or photcell instead of PIRs as there always causing problems

cheers for help

 

[Darkwood]

These PIR sensors are for internal areas not exterior, normally in toilets and other infrequently used areas such as large/small storage rooms etc. Most internal type fittings, either being surface or recessed, are still generally based around fluorescent and CFL lamps of one description or another, unless were talking about small LED downlights, so it's hardly bad design, no-one is going to fit incandescent lamps these days are they... lol!!

My bad i was explaining for external PIR units ... if its in a cupboard that's rarely accessed then fine its no worse than using a light switch it becomes as you know problematic when traffic in the area is higher and it end up switch on/off all day Ive seen many systems ripped out of through-fares in schools as lamp-life plummeted and got costly but yes agree PIR are fine if you would generally be switching the lights on and off at the same count.

PS Whos said these are indoor kits... I can't see where the OP has said what they are only mention of indoor was brought up by yourself?

 

[Engineer54]

My bad i was explaining for external PIR units ... if its in a cupboard that's rarely accessed then fine its no worse than using a light switch it becomes as you know problematic when traffic in the area is higher and it end up switch on/off all day Ive seen many systems ripped out of through-fares in schools as lamp-life plummeted and got costly but yes agree PIR are fine if you would generally be switching the lights on and off at the same count.

PS Whos said these are indoor kits... I can't see where the OP has said what they are only mention of indoor was brought up by yourself?

Oh well that must have been my bad then!! ..lol!!

 

[MDJ]

Just looking at a Hager PIR sensor (EE804/EE805) information /data sheet now, (the next manufacturers unit we are going to try) ....Nothing about recommending long on periods and short bursts ruining lamp life (but that would go without saying for any lamp type!!) etc just the sensors max Wattage for given types of lamps!!

Certainly wasn't hager fella, however that said I cannot remember which make it was when I was informed about problems with lamps and gear blowing when they switch off and on again and are on for short periods regarding that type of fitting. I will ask when I go for a coffee at the wholesalers next time and let you know.

 

[Darkwood]

Oh well that must have been my bad then!! ..lol!!

No worries im not one to rub it in :ciappa::ciappa::ciappa:

 

[Engineer54]

Certainly wasn't hager fella, however that said I cannot remember which make it was when I was informed about problems with lamps and gear blowing when they switch off and on again and are on for short periods regarding that type of fitting. I will ask when I go for a coffee at the wholesalers next time and let you know.

What do you mean, i have the sensor sitting in it's box on my desk at the moment!! No idea if this sensor is going to be any better than those tried in the past, but we'll soon be in a position to say one way or the other... lol!!