Pulling fuses

[Darkwood]

Any links to confirm that statement, where an electrician has pulled the fuse in order to undertake a CU change?? I just find that highly unlikely!! lol!!

Yep realised i should have had it to hand before posting that... i read it in an article re' smart meters and their intrusiveness and the legality of them and their emmisions (RF) ...it brought up a couple of similar cases where a utility customer was quoted for them to come out and power down for a DB change and then reconnect after, the quote was never accepted then the utility company set the meter to alert on any power downs which didnt coincide with DNO issues which to cut a long story short led to two companies been issued with fines for tampering with the meters....
Prior to this it was like headbutting a brick wall trying to successfully convict anyone as they could just say it was already cut when you were onsite and you didnt tamper with it.... now you can put a power down or a interference with the terminal cover on the meter down to a time and date against an invoice for work done.... no house holder would willingly cover for a company at the thought of a fine themselves (scare tactic)..... i see this as an attempt to reel in extra cash and the more test cases that are won the more resources will be put to catching those illegally pulling fuses ...it can only escalate with the mass install of these devices, ive swapped utility companies a few times and always refuse a smart been fitted and if they insist i go elsewhere... i dont like the idea the meter software can be upgraded live as they could get up to all sorts of revenue generating schemes...

 

[applemac]

just before xmas i was putting a new board in, hight level next to front door of unoccupied house, did a cut and tug jobbie when i looked round to the glass pained front door to see a nose against the glass, meter reader!
didnt seem to bothered to what i was doing but got chatting to him about the new smart meter systems coming into place.
he said they have a phone line link for broadcasting information.

- - - Updated - - -

just before xmas i was putting a new board in, hight level next to front door of unoccupied house, did a cut and tug jobbie when i looked round to the glass pained front door to see a nose against the glass, meter reader!
didnt seem to bothered to what i was doing but got chatting to him about the new smart meter systems coming into place.
he said they have a phone line link for broadcasting information.

 

[sparkless]

strong wind in Birmingham, usually blows the seals off before I get there

 

[Steve_P]

he said they have a phone line link for broadcasting information.

That'll only work if the customer allows them to connect to their phone line surely, maybe it's ok for this lot to steal phone calls but not for anyone to do anything to the seals. Or do they rely on a built in O2 sim? It'll stop working if it doesn't dial every 3 months anyway.

 

[Darkwood]

No steve they have radio frequency units they transmit on air and receive from central hub if they are out of reach they transmit data from meter to meter until within range .... a big concern is the strength of the RF signals which is massive compared to say your phone so health concerns are rife but im concerned about the ability to manipulate the KWhr ratio's how do we ever know they aint putting the apparent usage up for a few days at a time ...enough to hide the fact but done over a large customer base its a big money earner and very hard to proof, they can also track your daily habits what your using when and how often.... user info is a multi million business and can be sold to anyone ..... it the biggest problem with modern society how you do you daily business is worth alot of money to many people.

Personally ive nothing to hide but still respect a certain amount of my privacy and dont like the fact that my personal habits and lifestyle is been spied and sold to whoever requests it.

If you own a phone, computer use a cash card you name it your habits and movements are been logged and profited on.

 

[Des 56]

Pulling the cut out fuse is illegal
Getting them to do it for you is a nightmare
Common sense tells you to work safely.fuse gets pulled


I love these threads,both by the persons posing the question and the terrible consequences warned of by fellow electricians
Anti pull the fuse posters come on here with dire warnings about the dangers of doing so and warnings to wear the appropriate gear etc

Remember what your trade is supposed to be,I will remind you,its an Electrician

Electricians are supposed to be skilled at working safely with electrics,whether that be pulling fuses or working live
The dire warnings do not wash with me one little bit, warning electricians about pulling fuses is akin to warning plasterers of the danger of spreading cement

If you need to ask on a forum about pulling fuses and thereby stirring up the dire warnings about what can happen to you,then it may be time to look at other trades to earn your crust

If you have doubt don't do it. also be aware that working with electricity is dangerous,but it is your occupation and there are tasks that come with the job

 

[Darkwood]

Des your spoiling my conspiracy theory post ..... Its a public forum we cant be seen to be promoting an illegal act although we can suggest what happens in reality, i tread carefully around this type of question ..you never know who snooping in on such a thread! .... :wink5:

Im just glad ive never pulled the DNO fuse myself!!! cough....cough!!

 

[Des 56]

I think the best that advise for them to be given is "don't do it,its illegal"

I can be an awkward sole sometimes with what us sparks are suupposed to do or leave alone

I am never happy that electricians are given hints during a thread how it does happen and to be told to be carefull doing so.


If they have to ask about seals,they need to leave them alone

 

[shanky887614]

I think the best that advise for them to be given is "don't do it,its illegal"

I can be an awkward sole sometimes with what us sparks are suupposed to do or leave alone

I am never happy that electricians are given hints during a thread how it does happen and to be told to be carefull doing so.


If they have to ask about seals,they need to leave them alone

personally i was always taught to work live to move the tails if the fuse is after the meter.

if its before the meter it doesnt matter.

thats about the only use i have for long nose.

surely a forum for electricians wouldnt flinch an eye lid about working live as long as its safe to do so

 

[Fin170]

Not sure how the smart meter argument will work with replacing tails. They're customers property and can't see how they will fine you because they didn't bother to put seperate covers on the terminals.

Will have to drop them out live (unloaded) if they want to steal money for allowing me to do my job safely, or invest in a lead bucket to place over the meter while I go Dick Darstadly with the fuse....

 

[Guest55]

pulling a dno fuse is illegal eh ?
well i've probably done it at least 30-40 times over 20 years and never recieved so much as a warning letter.
so i'll continue doing it lol.
case closed imo.
;-)

 

[Engineer54]

​

it brought up a couple of similar cases where a utility customer was quoted for them to come out and power down for a DB change and then reconnect after,

​

A DNO wanted to charge for pulling a fuse and to re-insert it?? They're taking the pee arn't they!!! So what are you all paying the standing charge every quater for??

 

[richy3333]

Is it illegal to pull the fuse or is it the fact that cutting the seal is criminal damage? If so, add 2p on to each job to cover the cost of a new DNO seal if they ask for the money.

I don't have an issue with people pulling a fuse, but I bet most don't bother wearing appropriate PPE, just to be safe?

 

[bigbaddave]

No life threating faults on d/b, client who own several properties wants d/b replaced with dual RCD, I was thinking if the power company came out to check meter- seen fuse has been removed- seen new d/b- puts 2 + 2 together and traces with client who fitted new d/bs etc.... And it will lead them to the company I work for

They can add whatever numbers they want together.. However for them to prove you removed said fuses would be an intersting experiance. I changed a DB few months ago for a family member few month ago and there main fuse termanal was broken. Rang DNO whilst changing the board and there response team came whilst i was there. No seals to be seen and did work required and resealed.

Personally i think you will find it very hard these days to find an install with seals on.

Untimitly if anything was said then id be taking a copy of the EAWR into court as im sure that over rules any DNO procedure in conection with removing fuse.

If you try to do it by the book and have them out then dont waste your time.. It a long hard and horrible process and impossible to plan a daily business

 

[Edd]

Dont hold me to this, But Im sure this is like a question that comes up once a week.... Im sure everyone of us have answered it before many times..

But to go along with the others, 20+ years and Ive never seen a sealed fuse. call me lucky!!!

And if someone with a smart meter was being prosecuted , then well I would say who ever installed that smart meter had left a loose connection and to save them the trouble and embarrassment I had striped back the melting Tails and reconected them... but if they want to take it further I would be happy to say they had caused a potential fire risk and put people health in danger... I think the DNO would quietly sneek away...

 

[daiplayer]

if DNO's dont provide siutable isolation points, and are not willing to be at site when i need them.

im pulling the fuse end of

 

[Guest55]

lets not forget the power companies were given the oppourtunity to integrate isolators into meter units in last years Goverment electrical consultations which would have solved most of these issues.
they rejected it , probably on the grounds of it costing another £1.67 or something stupid.
so i'm all out of sympathy on the whole fuse pulling crap. ;-)

 

[Guest111]

The propblem with smart meters as I have been fairly reliably informed is that they have a real time clock memory,now a supplier is obliged by law to physically turn up at a premise once every 12 months,this is not only to read the meter but also to check the safety of it,now these meters not only record amount used but also any power downs that have occurred during that period,this data is transferred to the data terminal when the meter is read.bearing this in mind one way or another they are going to find out,wether they accept it as a legitimate reason for a power down or push for a prosecution is down to them.On a slightly different note I heard of a man who was prosecuted for fiddling his gas meter,It was long suspected that he was fiddling the gas and one day they fitted a new meter,this meter was a lot smaller than the original and not the colour that they normally were.Going completely against advice given he reversed his meter with quote "no problems the gas still goes through" and so it did for several weeks,the meter reader was due so he turned it back round.So far so good right? Wrong! upon reading the digital meter not only did it provide details of the amount of gas used but also the time and date it was reversed,the time and date it was put back the right way,and the amount of gas he had "stolen",that was one very expensive lesson by the time they had finished with him.

 

[Guest55]

The propblem with smart meters as I have been fairly reliably informed is that they have a real time clock memory,now a supplier is obliged by law to physically turn up at a premise once every 12 months,this is not only to read the meter but also to check the safety of it,now these meters not only record amount used but also any power downs that have occurred during that period,this data is transferred to the data terminal when the meter is read.bearing this in mind one way or another they are going to find out,wether they accept it as a legitimate reason for a power down or push for a prosecution is down to them.On a slightly different note I heard of a man who was prosecuted for fiddling his gas meter,It was long suspected that he was fiddling the gas and one day they fitted a new meter,this meter was a lot smaller than the original and not the colour that they normally were.Going completely against advice given he reversed his meter with quote "no problems the gas still goes through" and so it did for several weeks,the meter reader was due so he turned it back round.So far so good right? Wrong! upon reading the digital meter not only did it provide details of the amount of gas used but also the time and date it was reversed,the time and date it was put back the right way,and the amount of gas he had "stolen",that was one very expensive lesson by the time they had finished with him.

the whole point of that story is its for the conviction of energy theft , its not going to get to court when its just a spark pulling a fuse to do a cu swop.

 

[Guest111]

My point was all things considered then if people have all the facts then they can make up their own mind what to do,a punter may not want to pay to have an isolator fitted and if so he ain't gonna want to carry the can if the supplier turns hostile is he?