Regs on UG cable depth and marking

[Tafia]

You appear to be worried about rocking the boat. Is that likely to have some bad consequences for you?
and don't you want to drop the spark in it? If he has done the job properly he will be easily able to prove it, if he hasn't then he deserves what he gets.

Personally I would forget being nice and start rattling a few cages- I would put your concerns in writing to the council, including the fact you have evidence (lifting the turf) that this has not been done properly. In that letter I would point out you are concerned that this could cause a danger to anyone doing further work and whoever ordered the work could become liable if an accident or fatality occurs. I'd also copy the church authorities.

Mention of accidents and death and liability might just be enough for someone to realise they can't just ignore it. You might upset a few people but better than some contractor getting killed!

Re digging up the turf; could that be seen as interference with an electrical installation given that it was just soil that was moved by me to expose the cable?

Would this spark be in bother with the NIC if they found out what he had done? He is registered with them.

Thanks again.

T

 

[garrywatters]

Re digging up the turf; could that be seen as interference with an electrical installation given that it was just soil that was moved by me to expose the cable?

Would this spark be in bother with the NIC if they found out what he had done? He is registered with them.

Thanks again.

T

You could state that when someone else tried to dig a hole for their dearly departeds ashes it was noted that they could only dig down 6". On further investigation it was noted that the obstruction to further excavation was in fact a cable that had been laid in a trench without any protection or markings!
The NIC will inform the individual that they have had a complaint. If the complaint is found to be valid they will either inform the original spark that it has been found in your favour and that the works are to be rectified at cost to him. He will either have to carry out the remedial repair work himself or the NIC will get another spark in to carry out the remedial work. It will be noted on the original sparks record as a complaint, if he recieves any further complaints or this is one of many then he will more than likely be requested to rescind his membership.

 

[sedgy34]

just jumping on the back of this, I am considering putting some lights in my garden just GU10 spike lights, but when it comes to running the armoured i was going to clip it along the toeboards as i dont want to bury it, which wouldve been fine until a couple of weeks ago when the high winds blew some fence panels over so i had second thoughts about clipping it to fence, it would be a right pain in the arse to bury cos the beds are choca bolc full of shrubs and tress etc, Does anyone know of hand if it is acceptable to just have an SWA lying on top of the ground, running along the bottom of the fence but not attatched to it? would eliminate the need for warning tape too as you could physically see it

its your garden and to the book its going to be supervised by you

 

[Octopus]

just jumping on the back of this, I am considering putting some lights in my garden just GU10 spike lights, but when it comes to running the armoured i was going to clip it along the toeboards as i dont want to bury it, which wouldve been fine until a couple of weeks ago when the high winds blew some fence panels over so i had second thoughts about clipping it to fence, it would be a right pain in the arse to bury cos the beds are choca bolc full of shrubs and tress etc, Does anyone know of hand if it is acceptable to just have an SWA lying on top of the ground, running along the bottom of the fence but not attatched to it? would eliminate the need for warning tape too as you could physically see it

IMHO no problem having the SWA on the surface. In fact probably better than being 6" off the ground attached to a fence or 6" under ground and not marked!

 

[Engineer54]

You could state that when someone else tried to dig a hole for their dearly departed's ashes it was noted that they could only dig down 6". On further investigation it was noted that the obstruction to further excavation was in fact a cable that had been laid in a trench without any protection or markings!
The NIC will inform the individual that they have had a complaint. If the complaint is found to be valid they will either inform the original spark that it has been found in your favour and that the works are to be rectified at cost to him. He will either have to carry out the remedial repair work himself or the NIC will get another spark in to carry out the remedial work. It will be noted on the original sparks record as a complaint, if he received any further complaints or this is one of many then he will more than likely be requested to rescind his membership.

Who are you kidding here?? The NIC wouldn't be interested (unless he's using there logo illegally of course) You try getting them involved in any dispute, you'll probably hear/get every disclaimer you can imagine.

Has anyone on this forum, have any provable/documented instances where the NIC have become involved in any dispute between a member and the general public and played an active role?? Remember the NIC have deemed an electrician, through there membership as being ''competent'' electricians.... lol!!!!

 

[garrywatters]

Who are you kidding here?? The NIC wouldn't be interested (unless he's using there logo illegally of course) You try getting them involved in any dispute, you'll probably hear/get every disclaimer you can imagine.

Has anyone on this forum, have any provable/documented instances where the NIC have become involved in any dispute between a member and the general public and played an active role?? Remember the NIC have deemed an electrician, through there membership as being ''competent'' electricians.... lol!!!!

Yeah I know, lets just say that's how it's supposed to work in an ideal world..........! Still we can live in hope eh! lol.

 

[Tafia]

Who are you kidding here?? The NIC wouldn't be interested (unless he's using there logo illegally of course) You try getting them involved in any dispute, you'll probably hear/get every disclaimer you can imagine.

Has anyone on this forum, have any provable/documented instances where the NIC have become involved in any dispute between a member and the general public and played an active role?? Remember the NIC have deemed an electrician, through there membership as being ''competent'' electricians.... lol!!!!

Oh dear. That's a blow. What is the point of employing an NIC member if there is no come back if work does not comply? What of the NIC guarantee?

We hear of other organisations which advertise that unless, say, a building contractor is a member of their club then they are untrustworthy and should not be used. Seems to me that those organisations are set up to provide a cushy living for the organisers and when checked, in one instance some years ago, it was found that virtually anyone could join that particular federation on payment of the fees. I hope the NIC are not in that league.

 

[Engineer54]

Oh dear. That's a blow. What is the point of employing an NIC member if there is no come back if work does not comply? What of the NIC guarantee?

That doesn't just go for the NIC, but all of these Scam Providers!! They will NOT get actively involved in disputes unless they are literary forced into doing so. And then it will be compromise after compromise to save there face. There loyalty does not cover there members or the members customers, it covers themselves!! Anything else i'm afraid, is just wishful thinking by all parties!! lol!!!

 

[Rockingit]

Tafia - just out of curiosity - you say NICEIC registered..... is that Domestic Installer or Approved Contractor?

 

[Tafia]

Tafia - just out of curiosity - you say NICEIC registered..... is that Domestic Installer or Approved Contractor?

Just checked on the NIC site. The firm is listed as Domestic Installer and Approved Contractor.

 

[Tafia]

Tafia - just out of curiosity - you say NICEIC registered..... is that Domestic Installer or Approved Contractor?

Does that make a difference? See reply above.

Cheers

T.

 

[Tafia]

Me again folks,

At our July meeting, the council clerk finally produced the installation certificates for the church lighting. As you all know, they should have been handed over within 30 days of job completion. It took eighteen months after the first light was installed, several verbal requests and two letters!

Believe it or not, the issue of the underground cabling is still going on. The spark has friends on our council who, whilst being generally good people, simply refuse to accept that he would do anything outside the Regs. One councillor said it didn’t matter that the cables were not deep: “they will be found with a metal detector right away” Another said: “He is a good sparks; if he is happy, I am happy”

When a third letter was sent to him from the council, he did finally admit in writing that he hadn’t buried the cables very deep: “because it is a church yard and I didn’t know what was underneath”, even though two of the cable runs are across established paths along which the trench for the sewage pipe is to be dug.

He said he hadn’t installed the yellow warning tape as required by the Regs: “because the cables weren’t deep enough” He said he would provide a plan of the cable routes and place it at the mains position in the church. That was in July. Beginning of September, he still hadn’t provided the plan.

Another letter was sent. At the last meeting a plan of the cable routes was produced and I saw right away it was not correct as it failed to show one cable crossing the path where he had been told the trench for the sewage pipe was to be dug. He said he would place stainless steel labels in the ground above the cables to warn diggers! Long labels indeed.

Sparky also said in a letter that he has had an inspection done by a NICEIC inspector as part of their regular checks. He says he took the inspector to the church yard where he was shown the lighting job and cable runs. He claims the inspector said all was fine! I find that astonishing and almost unbelievable.


Is that likely to happen given that he has admitted the cable installation does not comply with the Regs? It may also be illegal under the ESQCR Regulations 2002, Section 14.

The alterations to the church start Monday.

Thanks to all.

T.

 

[garrywatters]

Me again folks,

At our July meeting, the council clerk finally produced the installation certificates for the church lighting. As you all know, they should have been handed over within 30 days of job completion. It took eighteen months after the first light was installed, several verbal requests and two letters!

Believe it or not, the issue of the underground cabling is still going on. The spark has friends on our council who, whilst being generally good people, simply refuse to accept that he would do anything outside the Regs. One councillor said it didn’t matter that the cables were not deep: “they will be found with a metal detector right away” Another said: “He is a good sparks; if he is happy, I am happy”

When a third letter was sent to him from the council, he did finally admit in writing that he hadn’t buried the cables very deep: “because it is a church yard and I didn’t know what was underneath”, even though two of the cable runs are across established paths along which the trench for the sewage pipe is to be dug.

He said he hadn’t installed the yellow warning tape as required by the Regs: “because the cables weren’t deep enough” He said he would provide a plan of the cable routes and place it at the mains position in the church. That was in July. Beginning of September, he still hadn’t provided the plan.

Another letter was sent. At the last meeting a plan of the cable routes was produced and I saw right away it was not correct as it failed to show one cable crossing the path where he had been told the trench for the sewage pipe was to be dug. He said he would place stainless steel labels in the ground above the cables to warn diggers! Long labels indeed.

Sparky also said in a letter that he has had an inspection done by a NICEIC inspector as part of their regular checks. He says he took the inspector to the church yard where he was shown the lighting job and cable runs. He claims the inspector said all was fine! I find that astonishing and almost unbelievable.


Is that likely to happen given that he has admitted the cable installation does not comply with the Regs? It may also be illegal under the ESQCR Regulations 2002, Section 14.

The alterations to the church start Monday.

Thanks to all.

T.

My bold and underline section rings warning bells that somewhere some people have a conflict of interest here! How was the bidding process monitored? Were there other quotes that were cast aside? Why were they cast aside? Did the quote state that cables were to be buried at a certain depth? If so why weren't they?
Just a miriad of questions I would be asking to open this can of worms further.

 

[Tafia]

My bold and underline section rings warning bells that somewhere some people have a conflict of interest here! How was the bidding process monitored? Were there other quotes that were cast aside? Why were they cast aside? Did the quote state that cables were to be buried at a certain depth? If so why weren't they?
Just a miriad of questions I would be asking to open this can of worms further.

Hi,

I missed the council meeting where the decision was made to award the second contract. ( death of brother-in -law).

As far as I am aware, the job was given to the sparky on the grounds that he was well known locally as a reliable chap and, as a member of the NICEIC, would install in accordance with the Regs. As there were two phases to this, the first one for around £300 and the second around £900, we were told we did not need to offer it out to tender as the jobs were less than £1000.

 

[trev]

As there were two phases to this, the first one for around £300 and the second around £900, we were told we did not need to offer it out to tender as the jobs were less than £1000.

That smells a little to me, split into two separate phases to keep the job out of the tender process. Or is it just my nasty suspicious mind working overtime?

 

[Engineer54]

The fix is in then!! lol!!! Still haven't learnt a thing from your questions and observations. Or rather they weren't interested, and took full advantage of your absence!! lol!!

 

[ruston]

A saving grace here now is that all concerned know where the cable is and how deep it is. A prohibition on disturbing the ground will stop any damage to the cable, and information given to the future contractors will allow them to deal with it in a manner that they will be familiar with. Any damage now to the cable in view of your revelations will not be just down to the installer.

 

[Tafia]

A saving grace here now is that all concerned know where the cable is and how deep it is. A prohibition on disturbing the ground will stop any damage to the cable, and information given to the future contractors will allow them to deal with it in a manner that they will be familiar with. Any damage now to the cable in view of your revelations will not be just down to the installer.

Problem is that neither the builders doing the work nor the architect are yet aware of a problem. That will be for me to warn them before they start digging. Sparky wanted to leave the notice at the mains position but to me, that is not sufficient and they will need to have their attention drawn to it. If just left by the meter position, it could well be missed by a chap instructed to dig a trench

Any thoughts on sparky's claim that the NICEIC inspector OK'd the job if the inspector actually knew the cables were just a few inches down with no warning tape above them and was aware that a trench was to be dug across the path of two of them?

 

[ruston]

Yes they will need all plans of underground services BEFORE they START . If anyone is injured because of damage to this cable and it is known that concerns have been raised as to it's safety will give lawyers a field day to all concerned.

No lol because as "they say" That is hearsay.

 

[Guitarist]

Always nice to get an update tho