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:cool4: Does anyone have any experiences (or know of any websites - I've drawn a blank) - about using the bluetooth data available from some inverters (mine is a Sunny Boy 4000TL with a 3.9kw system) to make semi intelligent decisions to control x 10 modules and turn on home appliances, such as washing machines, tumble dryers, dishwashers etc according to the level of power being generated.

I realise that there are problems about knowing if the power is going to continue at a particular rate for a washing machine / dishwasher - so that would have to be best guess. But for tumble dryers & water heating a more direct on/ off approach could be taken.
 
The 4000TL comes with a relay which you can configure to switch at a certain load. This should be good enough for turning on something like a tumble dryer.

More than that, I know there is a device coming from SMA soon which will do exactly what you're asking. I don't think it's going to be cheap though and the name of it escapes me right now.
 
The 4000TL comes with a relay which you can configure to switch at a certain load. This should be good enough for turning on something like a tumble dryer.

More than that, I know there is a device coming from SMA soon which will do exactly what you're asking. I don't think it's going to be cheap though and the name of it escapes me right now.

Sunny Home Manager which is coming out early next year.

SUNNY HOME MANAGER. SMA Solar Technology AG
 
:cool4: Does anyone have any experiences (or know of any websites - I've drawn a blank) - about using the bluetooth data available from some inverters (mine is a Sunny Boy 4000TL with a 3.9kw system) to make semi intelligent decisions to control x 10 modules and turn on home appliances, such as washing machines, tumble dryers, dishwashers etc according to the level of power being generated.

I realise that there are problems about knowing if the power is going to continue at a particular rate for a washing machine / dishwasher - so that would have to be best guess. But for tumble dryers & water heating a more direct on/ off approach could be taken.

I'm just working on such as system now! I've got a Sunny 3000HF and using Bluetooth and a Current Cost power meter to record energy usage and just about to setup a on/off control for my immersion hot water coil.

I'm doing this using a program I've written myself.

PM me if you want more info.
 
I'm just working on such as system now! I've got a Sunny 3000HF and using Bluetooth and a Current Cost power meter to record energy usage and just about to setup a on/off control for my immersion hot water coil.

I'm doing this using a program I've written myself.

PM me if you want more info.

That's interesting, I would certainly be interested in some more details, does your program interface directly with the inverter via bluetooth?
I've been working on various ideas for monitoring PV and utilising any excess power to heat the hot water but using a power controller rather than a simple on/off. So far my circuits are only theoretical and one of the problems I have is how best to measure the available export power. It's easy enough to measure the current in the main supply but does anybody know of a way to tell direction of current i.e. import or export. So far my circuit ideas rely on calculating excess power based on current flow from the inverter and subtracting current used in the house but there must be a simpler solution. Any Ideas?

John
 
Has anyone here looked at the 'Wattson' power monitor? It detects power use via a wireless transducer that simply clips on to the power cables and sends this info to the main unit. This unit appears to be a fairly basic device, but it does have one big plus: you can attach a second transducer on to your PV 'export' cable as it feeds in to your CU. The Wattson will then provide a real time reading of your 'balance' - consumption versus generation. It has a USB port for downloading something like a month's readings, but I'd be surprised if it didn't also deliver this info in 'real time'. A few lines of programming should then be able to use this info to send switching outputs to whichever appliances you wish?

And the unit only costs around £100-ish, with a second 'clip' for - I dunno - a further £20?




(Of course, running a computer uses the best part of 200W in itself... :bucktooth:)
 
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I have supplied a coupled of Wattsons to customers. The ones I supply come with the second transducer in the box. The software to interrogate them is called Holmes and available for download. It would be relatively straightforward to monitor the messages between Wattson and Holmes on a network to work out the protocols if you want to programme something yourself.
Regards
Bruce
 
Thanks Scooby & BruceB, I already looked at the wattsons but if I remember correctly it was really only designed to monitor cumulative power usage so assumed any current flow was being used in the house whereas of course with PV installed it could be could be measuring export current. I believe the two sensors were there for dual meters (i.e economy 7).

Sorry, just had another look and your right the second sensor can be used to measure generated power but the main sensor will just measure the current flow regardless of direction so won't know if its import or export?

It is described in their renewable energy installation guide,
http://www.diykyoto.com/store/assets/0000/0619/WATTSON_RENEWABLES_Eng_v0.5_low_res.pdf:-
" So if more renewable energy is being producing than energy is being used and power is being exported back to the grid (denoted by some meters spinning backwards); then the Net Power and Used power displayed on the wattson will not be measured correctly. This is due to the inability of wattson to determine the direction of current "
 
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Depends where you put the sensors. Wire it as per page 11 in the manual you cited and:
- one sensor measures power generated
- one sensor measures power consumed in house
- the Watson works out the net power correctly.

Regards
Bruce
 
Cheers BruceB, Thanks for pointing that out, I should have read further.
That 2 sensor method is OK but does rely on combining PV and main supply before the CU, I was hoping to come up with something that could also be used in the more common situation where PV is added simply as a new circuit i.e.via an MCB in the CU. Its looking looks like my initial thoughts were correct and that there probably isn't a practical way of monitoring export current using a single sensor on the main supply cable.

Unless anybody has any other ideas.

Thanks
John
 
I'm still trying to work out why the clip for the PV system can't be clamped around the phase conductor at the fuseboard. Anyone tried this?
 
It can if I understand you correctly. Measuring the PV generation is easy; it is measuring house consumption rather than net consumption which is more tricky. You do not want to measure net as that can be plus or minus, but the sensor cannot tell which. Measuring pv generation and actual consumption are both positive values which the logic in the Wattson can deal with.
Regards
Bruce
 
I've bought one to try this out as the instructions seems to suggest that what I'm trying to do is not possible. However, the one I bought was faulty and I'm still waiting for a replacement.
 
Hmm, yes, a tad more tricky than I'd first assumed!

Page 11 - as Bruce pints out - would do the trick, and should be fairly straight-forward. As a somewhat crude alternative for those reluctant to have that small mod, I wonder if the Wattson's 3 separate 'consumption' inputs (normally used for 3-phase supplies) could be used to target the 3 main circuits in your house - say a clip each on the two main socket 'rings' and the third on the kitchen circuit (assuming your electrical system is that basic!). Ok, I did say 'crude', but 3 clips should cover the bulk of your consumption, and I'm mentioning it just as a 'thinking aloud' suggestion.

Of course, the Page 11 setup is by far the most accurate, and I bet most houses already have that 'provision' - have a look; any Henley blocks near your CU betwixt meter and the CU?! (Wouldn't work that easily in my house, alas, even tho' I do have the said Henleys; the PV system is on my detached garage and this needs the protection of the MCB in the CU, so I'd also need a separate li'l CU to supply the garage.)

BiggsSolar, I did ask Kyoto about clipping the PV sensor on my garage's phase inside the house's CU and they said it should be ok (Ok course, in my case it would also record any consumption by the garage.)

j2d, where to buy? Hmm, that's a funny one... Amazon used to have them for just under £100, but no longer do... The cheapest on-line price I can find is £103 - but they are out of stock. The next cheapest is £130 (electricity-monitor.com). DIY Kyoto themselves do it for around £189, I think. I wonder why Amazon has stopped selling at the cheaper rate? Am I being cynical about Kyoto...?
 
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Hmm, yes, a tad more tricky than I'd first assumed!

I wonder if the Wattson's 3 separate 'consumption' inputs (normally used for 3-phase supplies) could be used to target the 3 main circuits in your house - say a clip each of the two main socket 'rings' and the third on the kitchen circuit (assuming your electrical system is that basic!). Ok, I did say 'crude', but 3 clips should cover the bulk of your consumption, and I'm mentioning it just as a 'thinking aloud' suggestion.

I would assume using multiple sensors on the major circuits would work as long as the wattson can be programmed accordingly. In fact multiple sensors monitoring individual rings is the method I am using in my concept for H/W power controller.
 
That's interesting, I would certainly be interested in some more details, does your program interface directly with the inverter via bluetooth?
I've been working on various ideas for monitoring PV and utilising any excess power to heat the hot water but using a power controller rather than a simple on/off. So far my circuits are only theoretical and one of the problems I have is how best to measure the available export power. It's easy enough to measure the current in the main supply but does anybody know of a way to tell direction of current i.e. import or export. So far my circuit ideas rely on calculating excess power based on current flow from the inverter and subtracting current used in the house but there must be a simpler solution. Any Ideas?

John

Yes directly to the inverter over Bluetooth, its taken me weeks to workout and understand what the SMA protocols are (they haven't published the specification unlike older protocols), but I can get the history data, current 5 minute average and instant spot values for watts, ac frequency, ac voltage, ac current etc.
 

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