Spurs.... Not the football type!

[Thomas Connolly]

Hi Guys
Need the experts advice again please .

Recently added a new double socket in a kitchen off of the existing ring final.

At last minutes notice I was asked to see if I can add an outside light by the back door. (Which is right next to the new socket that's just ben added)

The question being, if I were to add a 3A FCU from the spur I've just added to then feed the outside light, this would be classed as spurring a spur right?
So would a better option be to add a 13A FCU before the new spur and then have the outside light feed off of the double socket?
Realistically I can't take the feed for the light from anywhere else but don't want to disappoint and turn down the request.

As always, your help is very much appreciated .

 

[buzzlightyear]

read regs no appendix 15.

 

[Pete999]

read regs no appendix 15.

Good call Buzz, but what chance? don't know if the OP is an Electrician

 

[westward10]

A spur needs adding prior to the new socket to protect the multiple outlet spur.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

Thanks Guys .
Very informative as always. I've read the Regs and as above have seen that u u need the FCU to be prior to the new socket if I'm to add the outside light as well.

My second question is, purely out of curiosity is, can I wire both the new socket AND the outside light coming from the FCU or will the load blow the fuse (13A) or only the double socket from the FCU and then have the outside light coming from the socket?

Thanks .

 

[westward10]

It doesn't matter where you connect the external light from providing the spur protects both. What is currently connected from the socket and I assume rcd protection is provided.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

Ok. It would be easier for to run the light straight from the FCU. I just wasn't sure if I could have the wiring for the light and the socket in the FCU.
That's ok to do is it?

RCD wise. It's a very old build so no RCD on the ring at the CU. Would making the FCU an RCD protected FCU be sufficient?

 

[westward10]

Are you electrically qualified because the socket you added would have required additional rcd protection.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

Via the FCU or at the Board?
Long story short, qualified as a domestic installer last year, was working as an apprentice with an electrician, he left unduly so I've been asked to do two small jobs in his absence.
This being one of them.

So because I've added a spur to an existing ring, I need to upgrade the whole board so it's RCD protected?

 

[westward10]

So at present are you working with no guidance because it is a bit worrying you have installed a socket without additional rcd protection. Assuming this is a domestic site the new light fitting also requires additional rcd protection.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

At present yes until the new spark arrives. I was under the impression that an additional socket was something the home owner could do?
So an FCU prior to the new socket wouldn't be enough?
I'd have to upgrade the entire board?

 

[DPG]

Who will be testing and filling in the certificate?

 

[Pete999]

At present yes until the new spark arrives. I was under the impression that an additional socket was something the home owner could do?
So an FCU prior to the new socket wouldn't be enough?
I'd have to upgrade the entire board?

Not necessarily.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

@DPG I can test and inspect but the likelihood is we will get someone in to do so.

@Pete999 I thought an addition to an existing installation wouldn't require a new board. Would it be necessary to do so in this instance!?

 

[DPG]

Thanks for confirming.
The work you do will need to be RCD protected but not necessarily the whole consumer unit. Obviously depending on the circumstances then different methods of achieving this may be considered, including RCD protection of the whole circuit.

 

[Pete999]

@DPG I can test and inspect but the likelihood is we will get someone in to do so.

@Pete999 I thought an addition to an existing installation wouldn't require a new board. Would it be necessary to do so in this instance!?

You could fit a RCD Fused spur unit before you install the new socket

 

[Pete999]

@DPG I can test and inspect but the likelihood is we will get someone in to do so.

@Pete999 I thought an addition to an existing installation wouldn't require a new board. Would it be necessary to do so in this instance!?

No

 

[johnduffell]

home owner can do anything up to new circuits or wiring in locations containing a bath or shower without notifying the local authority. And even those if they agree with the local authority about getting it certified. However regardless of all that the whole electrical installation is a controlled service under building regs so th ehomeowner still must comply with part P which in practice means BS7671 (for all the design, testing, installation and certification but good luck finding a DIY who did all that)
Otherwise you're saying that work done by the homeowner can be less safe, which makes no sense.
So if BS7671 requires RCD protection for all new socket outlets (and concealed cables) then that must be complied with to comply with building regulation. The only things that need updating on an existing consumer unit would the fundamentals e.g. bonding and disconnection times. The RCD protection can go elsewhere.

 

[Thomas Connolly]

@Pete999 Thank you. I'll fit the RCD Fused Spur prior to the new socket outlet.

@DPG Helpful as always mate. Thanks.

@johnduffell Very clear and concise and exactly what I needed. Thanks for taking the time to help me.

@everyone Thanks for helping you absolute stars.