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Discuss Take it or leave it in the Electrical Wiring, Theories and Regulations area at ElectrciansForums.co.uk.

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  1. Bubblecraft
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    Bubblecraft Electrician's Arms

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    Erskine
    Within the past month I've had 2 customers who were wanting a shower swap, like for like. Both have been 9.5kw but have 6mm2 cable instead of 10mm2. Both customers were advised of the dangers & consequences of having 6mm2 on a 9.5kw such as volt drop, ambient temp's, grouping, and thermal insulation factors, and more so, probably the reason why there old one is defunct.

    Both did not want to upgrade their cable so I've said that I would not carry out the work. If I take on the swap, it's me that's got to answer why their new shower is knackered in no time or worse, chance of fire.

    What would you guys have done?
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  2. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    check cable run . if it's installed method c then swap shower. leave on 6mm with 32A MCB.
     
  3. Bubblecraft
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    Bubblecraft Electrician's Arms

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    Both houses were 15+m from CU though
     
  4. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    around 4.8V volt drop off top of head. acceptable.
     
  5. Bubblecraft
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    Forgot to say, it's method A also which if I'm right is 32a, I could be wrong though
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  6. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    method A as in thermally insulated wall? or is it in masonry?
     
  7. Bubblecraft
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    Masonry mate, sorry
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  8. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    not insulated so i would say method C, or possibly method B , 38A
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  9. spinlondon
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    By rights, if the load is 45A/50A, the CCC of the cable is 38A and you protect the circuit with a 32A MCB, then whilst not complying with the Regulations, it should be safe.
    I would imagine that there will be a lot of nuisance tripping, but that would not be your problem.
    Note it as a departure on the Certificate.
     
  10. Bubblecraft
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    Bubblecraft Electrician's Arms

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    I'm confused. Please correct me if I'm wrong but isn't method c clipped direct & these are in sold brick walls behind the tiles?
     
  11. Bubblecraft
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    Bubblecraft Electrician's Arms

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    But I know what'll happen, after a few trips, they'll be on the blower saying "You couldn't have fitted it correctly. Our old one didn't do it"

    I know this would be the way to do it safely but would you do it & put up with the grief from the customer about a tripping shower?
     
  12. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    agreed. i estimate the load as 39.5A max. assuming manufacturers claim of 9.5kW is not eggagerated ( as is usual). have seen 9.5kW happily running on a BS3871 30A with no problems.
     
  13. tony mc
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    tony mc Electrician's Arms

    If you look up ref method c it makes mention of masonary brickwork concrete & plaster!
     
  14. Bubblecraft
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    Bubblecraft Electrician's Arms

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    Either way, I've not took both on so I know I can sleep at night. For the cost of changing it over, I personally don't think it's worth the grief!
     
  15. telectrix
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    telectrix Scouser and Proud of It Trusted Advisor

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    BS7671 does not have a reference method for T/E in masonry walls. a boffin at the IET told me last year that ref.B would be the closest
     
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