Taking over unfinished job

[aaelectric]

Been asked to quote for a job where the builders have gone bankrupt. All first fix electrics are done so the company who has taken over wants second fix done and testing. All walls are plastered and is in finishing stages. Would you issue an eic or a EICR

 

[Rockingit]

If it was me, I'd issue a 3 part EIC but with an accompanying document stating why the first two boxes are blank, and have BCO countersign both the cert and the reason.

 

[GT1]

It's age old question of signing off someone else's work !!
It's your name on the cert at the end of the day, regardless of any clauses you've added/omitted..!
And it's your name going forward if anythings wrong with it.
What advise does your scheme provider give ?

 

[Octopus]

If its anew build I'd be inclined to see what LABC say - its them ultimately you will need to placate.

 

[acvc]

Approach it not as a newbuild but as an already existing installation perhaps? So the EIC will have additions and alterations ticked, but not new installation. That should cover you. Full testing before you start etc.

 

[mackers]

I'd make sure you have it in writing that any faults found on wiring when tested will be rectifyed on a day work rate and not included in your estimate.
if the firm went bust the lads on site could have done all sorts to the wiring if they didn't get payed or new it was coming!

 

[GT1]

This is a "cloak" ventilation fan.
The installers didn't bother to fit a pipe on the other side and it vents into the floor void.
This new build house was finished by a different company that started the job because they went bust.

It's FULL of problems and most of them HAVE to be malicious.
The down pipe from the upstairs shower was left unconnected, and then walled in. So it flooded the kitchen when used.
Lord knows what else will be found.

Personally I wouldn't put my name to anything I didn't fit.
Test and inspect it. Yes.
Issue an installation cert. no.

 

[acvc]

GTI you're right! In this scenario ..... i wouldn't go near it. Can I delete my previous post now?

 

[Marvo]

GTI you're right! In this scenario ..... i wouldn't go near it. Can I delete my previous post now?

You can edit it if the edit button is still visible. Deleting posts isn't generally discouraged on forum boards because usually the thread makes no sense when posts are missing.

 

[GT1]

Don't get me wrong I'd do the inspect and test..!
Have a very similar job to price tomorrow. Full rewire done by someone including CU.
No paperwork. !
Client wants paperwork as its a rental. So EICR it is (PIR).

 

[mogga]

THIS QUESTION IS CROPPING UP MORE AND MORE DUE TO
1 Firms going under and original electrical contractor unwilling to complete due to monies owed
2 electrical contractor going under
both of the above IMO should be PIRd before any quote for outstanding is done and check with scam provider what action to take ( thats why you pay them money for their advice as well as their notifications ect)#
3 the Builder,client and electrical contractor falling out ect ect again Scheme provider should be first port of call
Then theirs the "Homer" " forigner" " cash in hand" jobs where client has got jimmy to do the work cheap and Jimmy altho an electrician hasnt got part PEE so cant sign ity off but clients all happy n rosey till insurance,Sale,Renting ask for certificates This again IMO should be a FULL PIR NOT an EIC as you cant see through walls celings ect and can only surmise that JIMMY has done a good job
This is something that scheme providers and governing bodies should sort out as I say it will become more common as the money pit swallows companies and clients penny pinch

 

[Guest111]

I,m with you on this one Mogga,had a right do with a mate who set up as a general builder,wanted me to sign off a job that he,d done wires eveywhere no clipping in loft run diagonally in walls,you name it it was wrong,anyway he,s there calling me allsorts as iI won,t sign job off for him and he has took clients money and cant get a cert.Told him in future to get a sparks in,this type of work is exactly what the rules were brought in to prevent.By the way he said work was ok and it was just me being arsey lol.

 

[BlueToBits]

I also agree Mogga.
The client is just going to ditch the PIR and use the EIC for the second fix as full installation documentation whatever the limitations or description of works. the PIR is just a report anyhow. Only electricians read or understand EICs & PIRs - show one to your neighbour and ask him or her what it all means, if anything, I'd bet they will likely say something like "It's an electrical certificate. It says your electrics is safe" and give it back to you.

There are so many pitfalls with this type of work, I don't take it on.

I have experienced:

• The 'new' company that bought out the liquidated company has the same MD, and this MD also owns a handful of dormant companies with a similar name, ready to bust this one, use another the buy the assets for next to nothing and continue building without having to pay anyone for work and materials to date.
• It matters not what terms you lay down, if the installation doesn't work because of a defective first fix. The chances are that you won't get paid unless you correct it at your own expense.
• A PIR on a boarded and plastered first fix isn't worth a carrot. There's virtually nothing to see or test. Certainly not enough to assess it's suitability for a problem free second fix. It isn't an installation, just a collection of buried wires and boxes, Yes you could go round and IR test every cable end you can see, but the time that takes you may as well second fix and test in one go.
• Even with drawings and a competent spark, it can take ages to work out what's going on with someone else's first fix. I have come across several first fixes that have been 'sabotaged' by electricians that were un-paid. I've done it myself and I recon most are now doing it. If the client starts paying late or I suspect that his cash flow may be a problem, and I have to make the decision to keep on going or to play the 'We're not continuing until we are paid' card, I may leave a few simple 'anomalities' that anyone else would be tearing their hair out trying to find, but would be happy to send a list of where they were once the cheque had cleared. I was going to give a few examples, but I'm sure most of us already know the sort of thing....