The Snoopers Charter

[rolyberkin]

RIPA is not about the wholesale invasion of everyone's privacy it is about putting in legislation a framework whereby those who have a legitimate need to access information are able to do it with the protection of legislation, it is a balance to the human rights act which tends to be used to provide protection to those who consistently prey on the vulnerable in our society using the internet and other sources of data. You are right that there will never be 100% success in targeting those who prey on the vulnerable but in my mind if it prevents one child being subjected to emotional or physical sexual abuse, prevent or detect terrorism or protect an elderly person being fleeced of their life savings then to potentially give up a bit of privacy is a worthwhile sacrifice.

 

[Marvo]

There's a lack of oversight and the list of organisations entitled to the info is way too broad. The requests for info by security services under the existing framework run into hundreds of thousands. Obviously, with the expanded number of organisations now with their spoon in the pot, this number is going to increase radically. There's no way that each of these requests can be individually and thoroughly assessed for validity so it just becomes a rubber stamping exercise. Also there's the fact nobody ever wants to deny a request because of the likelyhood of them becoming the scapegoat down the line so they're far more likely to approve invalid requests to cover their own asses.

As for the argument 'if it saves one child or one victim or stops one terrorist.......' I completely disagree. A persons right to privacy has always been a fundamental right and as such it can't be trumped by another fundamental right. In the US it's written in stone in the constitution, in the UK, up until fairly recently, it was deeply enshrined by centuries of case law but it has now been erroded by very recent legislation.

The 'if it saves one child' argument is the kinda sheep fodder main course the government will feed the general population to pass self-serving legislation. followed by some 'if you've got nothing to hide' fodder for dessert.

 

[Dan]

Well this seems to have been swept through without much publicity.(By the folks who control publicity)
see The Government just passed the most extreme surveillance law in history – say goodbye to your privacy - http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/snoopers-charter-theresa-may-online-privacy-investigatory-powers-act-a7426461.html
"Well I don't do anything wrong so it wont affect me ? "
Well it wont if you are an MP the very people who have introduced the bill have exempted themselves.
MPs just passed the most draconian spying laws ever. Guess who they made exempt - http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/investigatory-powers-bill-a7447781.html

Here's a list of who can snoop on you now.

Metropolitan police force
City of London police force
Police forces maintained under section 2 of the Police Act 1996
Police Service of Scotland
Police Service of Northern Ireland
British Transport Police
Ministry of Defence Police
Royal Navy Police
Royal Military Police
Royal Air Force Police
Security Service
Secret Intelligence Service
GCHQ
Ministry of Defence
Department of Health
Home Office
Ministry of Justice
National Crime Agency
HM Revenue & Customs
Department for Transport
Department for Work and Pensions
NHS trusts and foundation trusts in England that provide ambulance services
Common Services Agency for the Scottish Health Service
Competition and Markets Authority
Criminal Cases Review Commission
Department for Communities in Northern Ireland
Department for the Economy in Northern Ireland
Department of Justice in Northern Ireland
Financial Conduct Authority
Fire and rescue authorities under the Fire and Rescue Services Act 2004
Food Standards Agency
Food Standards Scotland
Gambling Commission
Gangmasters and Labour Abuse Authority
Health and Safety Executive
Independent Police Complaints Commissioner
Information Commissioner
NHS Business Services Authority
Northern Ireland Ambulance Service Health and Social Care Trust
Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service Board
Northern Ireland Health and Social Care Regional Business Services Organisation
Office of Communications
Office of the Police Ombudsman for Northern Ireland
Police Investigations and Review Commissioner
Scottish Ambulance Service Board
Scottish Criminal Cases Review Commission
Serious Fraud Office
Welsh Ambulance Services National Health Service Trust

Under the guise of counter-terrorism, the British state has achieved totalitarian-style surveillance powers – the most intrusive system of any democracy in history. It now has the ability to indiscriminately hack, intercept, record, and monitor the communications and internet use of the entire population.



Anyone read the book 1984?

Would be interested in your comments please.

Use a proxy service and end to end encryption email and tor browser and things like that if it's a big thing you're concerned with.

Most large firms already have data on all of us anyway.

It does annoy me but what can we do?

 

[Dan]

How can I protect myself from government snoopers? - https://www.theguardian.com/technology/askjack/2016/nov/24/how-can-i-protect-myself-from-government-snoopers

A cool article.

 

[Wilko]

My concern is the lack of balance. I hear of police hampered in their investigations etc, and I don't want that. On the other hand, there's the shopping list of pedestrian agencies that can now do it ... So I'd like to see penalties for incorrect use of information, to give pause for thought when we've apparently agreed we no longer need a judge and a warrant to get in their way. Perhaps these penalties already exist?

 

[Dan]

It's going to get abused for sure. It'll be years before a whistleblower announces it lol

 

[FatAlan]

You may find that list of agencies is just those authorised under RIPA. I fail to see whether a local authority or like could ever justify getting involved in intercepting or monitoring communications. You need very high level authorisation for that.

 

[FatAlan]

Police only play lip service to fraud investigations. What they do look at is just the tip of the iceberg. Action Fraud just sweeps everything under the carpet as there are no resources to investigate. Currently all detectives are tied up on historic sex abuse investigations.

 

[Marvo]

My concern is the lack of balance. I hear of police hampered in their investigations etc, and I don't want that. On the other hand, there's the shopping list of pedestrian agencies that can now do it ... So I'd like to see penalties for incorrect use of information, to give pause for thought when we've apparently agreed we no longer need a judge and a warrant to get in their way. Perhaps these penalties already exist?

There never are penalties for incorrect use of information. After the Snowdon revelations on the UK illegal monitoring activities there was zero fallout, they just passed new laws to to make their illegal behaviour into legal behaviour.

It's not about 'hamperaing' investigations, it's about making police activities easier but if you want to do that then the best way is nighttime cerfew or military law, roadblocks every mile as you enter city centres, make everyone carry full boimetrics ID documents around their necks. The job of the police will be a doddle......it will be a pretty ---- life for everyone else though.

 

[Barry White]

Well its been challenged by the European court of justice. EU judges said communications data could only be retained if it was used to fight serious crime.
I agree the Act was too wide reaching with poor guidelines.
Of course there will be an appeal.

See EU data retention ruling goes against UK government - BBC News - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38390150

 

[Pat H]

Luckily at least for a while yet we have the EU to protect our rights. The snoopers charter has been declared illegal.
Mind we'll be out of Europe eventually and then our government will be free to snoop and more all under the guise of protecting us.

 

[Marvo]

Well its been challenged by the European court of justice. EU judges said communications data could only be retained if it was used to fight serious crime.
I agree the Act was too wide reaching with poor guidelines.
Of course there will be an appeal.

See EU data retention ruling goes against UK government - BBC News - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38390150

There was already an official petition with more than double the required sign-ups but they've declined it already. Petition: Repeal the new Surveillance laws (Investigatory Powers Act) - https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/173199

 

[Barry White]

The real reason MPs and councillors are "sort of exempt" from the snoopers charter.
There are 139 MP's and Councillors on the UK Sex offenders register
Councillor / Political party | The UK & Ireland Database - https://theukdatabase.com/category/councillor-political-party/
SHOCKING ?

 

[andyb]

There are 139 MP's and Councillors on the UK Sex offenders register

SHOCKING ?

Had a quick look at the link, couldn't see any MPs, to save me time going through all of it, how many MPs are on there?

 

[Barry White]

Had a quick look at the link, couldn't see any MPs, to save me time going through all of it, how many MPs are on there?

Had a quick look myself and have to admit there aren't many MPs and some are very historical. Obviously I have not read the full list

 

[Midwest]

S##t, I didn't realise the extent of this. I'm gonna have to stop using those gardening & knitting web sites. How am I going to train my clematis and weft & warp.