Trying to figure out wiring on old light fitting

[Penfold]

I am trying to replace a switched light fitting that is in a cupboard with a new ceiling rose. When I took off the existing fitting, I can't work out which wires are which in the existing fitting and there are no markings on the existing fitting to help. It looks pretty old and the wiring on this one fitting looks really old too.



Any advice on how I should swap this over to the new fitting?

Thanks in advance.

 

[littlespark]

I presume the power is off at the consumer unit/ fuseboard at this moment?
The 2 reds joined together are a permanent live feed. These go into the centre terminals in the new ceiling rose marked 'loop'
One of the blacks is the switch wire, and should be marked with a bit of tape or something.
The other black is the neutral.
These two blacks connect to the lampholder or pendant flex of your new fitting.

I'll say it again. If you haven't isolated the circuit at the consumer unit, those reds will be live, even if the switch is off

 

[Andy5678]

what fitting are you replacing it with?
You may require a cpc there too

 

[Andy-1960]

One of those black cables looks like a loose connection as it’s been running pretty warm. Make sure it’s stripped back and the damaged part of the cable removed before reterminating in the new fitting.

 

[westward10]

I presume the power is off at the consumer unit/ fuseboard at this moment?
The 2 reds joined together are a permanent live feed. These go into the centre terminals in the new ceiling rose marked 'loop'
One of the blacks is the switch wire, and should be marked with a bit of tape or something.
The other black is the neutral.
These two blacks connect to the lampholder or pendant flex of your new fitting.

I'll say it again. If you haven't isolated the circuit at the consumer unit, those reds will be live, even if the switch is off

How will he fathom which black is the line return?

 

[Taylortwocities]

How will he fathom which black is the line return?

Using a two probe voltage test device. It’s basic equipment.

 

[westward10]

Using a two probe voltage test device. It’s basic equipment.

He is not an electrician.

 

[Penfold]

I presume the power is off at the consumer unit/ fuseboard at this moment?
The 2 reds joined together are a permanent live feed. These go into the centre terminals in the new ceiling rose marked 'loop'
One of the blacks is the switch wire, and should be marked with a bit of tape or something.
The other black is the neutral.
These two blacks connect to the lampholder or pendant flex of your new fitting.

I'll say it again. If you haven't isolated the circuit at the consumer unit, those reds will be live, even if the switch is off

Thanks for the detailed info. Ok, I will get my multi-meter out to work out which one of the two black ones is the switch as there is no tape or markings to denote that.

Thanks for the concern, I always make sure I isolate at the consumer unit and then test the circuit is dead. I got caught out on that last part one time, never again! Someone had wired a light into the ring mains so I thought it was isolated and luckily it was just sparks when I pulled the wire from the terminal. Thank god for insulated screwdrivers!!

what fitting are you replacing it with?
You may require a cpc there too

Its a normal plastic ceiling rose so there are no exposed metals that could conduct so assume that means having an earth cable is less of a concern?

One of those black cables looks like a loose connection as it’s been running pretty warm. Make sure it’s stripped back and the damaged part of the cable removed before reterminating in the new fitting.

I hadn't even seen that. Thanks, I will strip them back a bit and make sure they are tight in the new fitting.

 

[Andy5678]

May not be required but I would still like to see a cpc there somewhere. It looks like twin and earth, might pull down a bit and get a bit of slack so you can terminate it properlty into your new pendant as it will come with an earth terminal. Will need sleeving in it too. And the other cores tidied up and marked accordingly.

An electrician would also carry out nessesary tests and issue a minor works certificate for your records

 

[buzzlightyear]

Thank god for insulated screwdrivers!!

don't turn off the electrics off ,ring 999 ,wait for a ambulance .
turn it on ,bang .they you go. some body standing over you .
me I would call some one that knows what they are doing

 

[Pete999]

An old style Batten Holder, with regards to the cpc, it could well be that because the BH has no earth terminal, quite common at the time these BH were used, th eearth wires (cpc) have either been cut off, or tucked up in the ceiling, a common occurrence in the heyday of the building boom, I know some of the sparks I worked with, did just that. Best get an Electrician in to check out your lighting circuit, and remember if there are no cps on that circuit, you should ensure that there aren't any Metal or conductive switches or lighting fittings in use on that circuit.