Wiring 6kw generator 3 pin sockets to domestic sockets?

[Richard Knight]

Just bought this generator Villiers V6000ES 6kW Silent Petrol Generator - Villiers from pump.co.uk - W.Robinson & Sons (Ec) Ltd UK


For use on a construction site and to occasionally power the caravan on.


It has two 110v sockets and one 240v 32 amp socket. it's the 240v socket that I will be using as all my tools run off 240v.


Firstly I think I need to ground the generator, is that correct? I have purchased a 4 ft copper grounding rod.


On the generator there is one 32 amp socket - how do I safely wire this to convert it to domestic sockets.


I have found a 16 amp version 1 METRE GENERATOR FLY LEAD 16 amp PLUG TO 13 amp TWIN SOCKET 1m | eBay but not a 32 amp version.


Do I have to purchase a 32 amp to 16 amp splitter Camping Electric Hook Up Cable Caravan Boats 3 way splitter 32a to 2x 16a | eBay I'm guessing these have some sort of transformer?


Or can I just wire a 4 gang switched socket strip onto the 32 amp sockets...my common sense says that's not safe as sockets should be 13 amp. What size cable would be best also?


Thankyou!

 

[Meggerman]

You don't need an earth rod. You don't need a transformer. Just because the generator socket is 32A does not mean you have to draw 32A from it. Put a 13A socket on the end of it.

 

[Richard Knight]

Thanks

Should I get fused sockets or will just normal ones be fine?

Why is there earthing connections on the generator then if it doesn't need earthing?

 

[Doomed]

http://ri.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A7x...type=pdf/RK=0/RS=1CWVAaqiRR0u74DpoPKlkiUpd0c-

look here

 

[Knobhead]

For your sake and the safety of others, get an electrician to look at the job for you.

 

[davesparks]

You don't need an earth rod. You don't need a transformer. Just because the generator socket is 32A does not mean you have to draw 32A from it. Put a 13A socket on the end of it.

Your crystal ball is obviously working better than mine if you can tell for absolute certain that an earth rod isn't needed without assessing the situation in person and properly.

 

[Engineer54]

You don't need an earth rod. You don't need a transformer. Just because the generator socket is 32A does not mean you have to draw 32A from it. Put a 13A socket on the end of it.

Best remind yourself, not to work on generator installations, unless it's with those piddly little 2 to 3KW jobbies, that will almost certainly have a floating earth arrangement!!

 

[Knobhead]

You don't need an earth rod. You don't need a transformer. Just because the generator socket is 32A does not mean you have to draw 32A from it. Put a 13A socket on the end of it.

Had you looked at the link in the OP you would have seen that 13A sockets are not suitable. I would definitely use an earth rod.

 

[Richard Knight]

Had you looked at the link in the OP you would have seen that 13A sockets are not suitable. I would definitely use an earth rod.

Thanks, we have wired up properties before and we always get a qualified electrician to check all the work and it always passes. We have an electrical engineer coming to the site shortly who we will get to check what we have wired up.

I emailed the guy who sold be the generator and he told me to just wire a 4 gang socket onto the 32 amp plug provide. Is that ok? What size cable is best?

 

[Engineer54]

I emailed the guy who sold be the generator and he told me to just wire a 4 gang socket onto the 32 amp plug provide. Is that ok? What size cable is best?

Without knowing how it's been wired by the manufacturers, with regards to earthing arrangement no-one can tell you for sure. If there is a N-E (Frame) connection, then you will almost certainly need an earth rod. Do you have a manufacturers Schematic wiring diagram, if not you may be able to find one for your model on the manufacturers web site.

One more thing, ...if the generator does not have a AVR or other form of automatic voltage regulation, i wouldn't be using it to supply your caravan, the fluctuation of voltage and frequency can potentially take out your electronic appliances/audio-video equipment that you may have. Small generators without voltage regulation are primarily for use on building sites etc, basically to supply power tools and lighting etc...

 

[Richard Knight]

Without knowing how it's been wired by the manufacturers, with regards to earthing arrangement no-one can tell you for sure. If there is a N-E (Frame) connection, then you will almost certainly need an earth rod. Do you have a manufacturers Schematic wiring diagram, if not you may be able to find one for your model on the manufacturers web site.

One more thing, ...if the generator does not have a AVR or other form of automatic voltage regulation, i wouldn't be using it to supply your caravan, the fluctuation of voltage and frequency can potentially take out your electronic appliances/audio-video equipment that you may have. Small generators without voltage regulation are primarily for use on building sites etc, basically to supply power tools and lighting etc...

We have the earthing rod so it can't hurt even if it doesn't need it. But it has an earthing point on the generator so it looks like it needs one.

Yes the generator is AVR regulated, do you think its sensible charging things like my iphone and ipad using the sockets in the caravan when the caravan is running off the generator. Would hate to fry them!

 

[Schneker]

One more thing, ...if the generator does not have a AVR or other form of automatic voltage regulation, i wouldn't be using it to supply your caravan, the fluctuation of voltage and frequency can potentially take out your electronic appliances/audio-video equipment that you may have. Small generators without voltage regulation are primarily for use on building sites etc, basically to supply power tools and lighting etc...

Hi sir,
I don't want to seem a plank but is that why the generator is "not suitable for wiring into a domestic supply" ?

Cheers

 

[Knobhead]

The main reason is the generator output is centre tapped so all subsequent protective devices and switching should be double pole. Which is why BS1363 plugs and sockets aren't suitable.

Without an AVR there is a distinct possibility of damage to any electronic equipment.

 

[Richard Knight]

The main reason is the generator output is centre tapped so all subsequent protective devices and switching should be double pole. Which is why BS1363 plugs and sockets aren't suitable.

Without an AVR there is a distinct possibility of damage to any electronic equipment.

The generator has an AVR device fitted.

 

[D Skelton]

I think we need to be a bit clearer when we say this generator is not suitable for use as a domestic supply.

The arrangement of this generator's windings will be V-0-V, completely and utterly unsuitable for anything other than site tools or lighting, and I'd hazard a guess that the winding's center tap isn't bonded to the frame, but without looking at the schematics I can't say for sure on here.

Personally, assuming no frame bond, I wouldn't rod it and would restrict anyone from plugging anything into it that isn't class 2, but then I have no idea what this construction site you're on is like and whether the generator's use can be adequately supervised?

As others have said, you need an electrician, competent in the application of generators, to determine the best safety measures for your situation.

 

[midgetman]

All sites I have worked on its 110 tools only

 

[Richard Knight]

I think we need to be a bit clearer when we say this generator is not suitable for use as a domestic supply.

The arrangement of this generator's windings will be V-0-V, completely and utterly unsuitable for anything other than site tools or lighting, and I'd hazard a guess that the winding's center tap isn't bonded to the frame, but without looking at the schematics I can't say for sure on here.

Personally, assuming no frame bond, I wouldn't rod it and would restrict anyone from plugging anything into it that isn't class 2, but then I have no idea what this construction site you're on is like and whether the generator's use can be adequately supervised?

As others have said, you need an electrician, competent in the application of generators, to determine the best safety measures for your situation.

Sorry maybe I'm confusing people, I say domestic supply but I just mean taking the round 3 pins to square domestic 3 pin sockets. All our tools are square 3 pin 240v.

We will planned to use the generator to hook into the caravan, and use thing like microwave, hoover, etc of the caravan sockets.

I have no idea what a windings centre tap is... or what class 2 is. I'm definitely getting the electrical engineer to look over it all!

The construction site is a self build. All work done by myself, and business partner. No contractors at all so it will be only us using the generator and tools.

 

[D Skelton]

Where are you based Richard?

 

[Richard Knight]

Where are you based Richard?

We live in Lancashire, the plot and construction site discussed is in south west Scotland.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

I emailed the guy who sold be the generator and he told me to just wire a 4 gang socket onto the 32 amp plug provide. Is that ok?

NO, that is not OK. 4-gang trailing sockets are not made to the same spec as ordinary sockets used in permanent installations and normally require their supply to be fused at a maximum of 13A. Therefore, although an installed wall socket can be safely connected to a 32A supply such as a domestic ring circuit or your generator's 32A outlet, and will not be overloaded if two plugs both loaded to 13A are connected, doing this with a 4-gang leaves it liable to overload and burnout as it cannot handle 26A let alone 32.

Get your sparks to make up a distro panel with a couple of 16s and a couple of double 13s, with suitable protective devices. He can check the correct method of earthing at the same time. Note that not all good electricians have experience and knowledge of correct practice with generator supplies.

The main reason is the generator output is centre tapped so all subsequent protective devices and switching should be double pole.

Not necessarily. I have seen 115/230 output gennies where in 230V mode the CT is inaccessible leaving just a normal 230V supply. You would have to check the specs or measure it.

The construction site is a self build. All work done by myself, and business partner. No contractors at all so it will be only us using the generator and tools.

This does not exempt you from the need to work safely. Most risk assessments in the UK would indicate that correct practice would be to use 110V tools. Yours may differ - make sure it is correct!

Why is there earthing connections on the generator then if it doesn't need earthing?

There is an earth terminal on the back of my turntable but I wouldn't connect it to an earth rod! Seek advice from the above mentioned competent electrician.