Being self employed and the coronavirus

[HappyHippyDad]

Well it seems that we'll just have to wait and see if we get any financial help and if the process of getting it becomes more simple and clear.

I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.

 

[davesparks]

I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.

Its a good idea, but as with any plan it has it's issues.
Where does the money come from and does it have to be paid back?

 

[Phil L]

I agree £1000 per person would be of a benefit for those that need it, however was that to be a £1000 per household that is another story, how would your average family with let’s say 2-3 children survive on that when you take into account Mortgage/Rent, gas, leccy, water and all the other standard monthly bills, that doesn’t even take into account car/van payments that most people will have especially there self employed

 

[pirate]

These are difficult times, no-one's fault, but a huge shake-up for humanity. I don't know what can be done really, but the fact is the government has certainly tried to help with mortgages and rents and i expect many people will be very glad of that assistance, and I expect more measures will follow. What heartened me yesterday was that the big box at Tesco where folks donate a box of cereal or tins of soup etc for the food banks was overflowing and on asking one of the staff he told me it wasn't just an accumulation but they had had to get the guys to uplift the donations twice as often recently. As for self-employed, like I am, I am retired but not yet of pensionable age so I don't expect any assistance...however, with folks being stuck at home I am very busy doing minor works for loads of people! As I don't usually charge for tiny jobs, my cellar is growing with the bottles i get given, so that's a bonus!
My daughter was offered a new job 2 weeks ago, having been made redundant before Christmas...naturally, as she can be self-employed doing freelance work, she has made a small amount that way, but the new job heralded a big step forward...then last week she got an email saying her new employers couldn't manage to take her on after all, which resulted in the bathroom fitter being put on hold and he has put his tiler and plasterer on hold so none of them have any work for about 2 weeks, with more cancellations coming in daily. The Men's Shed where i volunteer has been closed too...this is sad because we exist to help those who need the company and help of others, so we are in effect failing those we seek to support, but cannot support them in the Shed because many have health issues which require them to be extra careful about contact with others...
and, oddly, my golf course has closed too, which seems daft, but there are some good reasons for this, so instead of golf "spoiling a good walk", I am just going for a walk without my golf clubs, which, to be fair, is less hazardous for those nearby!
Just when I thought things were getting better, here I am STILL supporting my daughter!
On a serious note, being self-employed has a bonus if you are a one-man/woman band, in that you don't have the awful task of laying people off...but if you run a bigger show, it is one of the hardest things to do to tell employees that you have to let them go. Difficult times...

 

[ipf]

Bit harsh @FatAlan....people didn’t vote for this at all no one saw it coming, I’m not a fan Particularly of this or any other government but to use this situation as a point scoring political exercise is disgusting...you should be ashamed, I’m very impressed on the whole with how this country has come together and all trying they best in a very bad situation!

I'm with you, generally but I'm sorry to say all this 'herd' mentality being shown in the supermarkets by panic buying, inconsiderate, selfish, ignorant, common senseless, so called fellow citizens is really pi$$ing me off.
Trying to put work together to help others whilst earning, along with many health workers, daily and then coming across these true artisans of life really takes a great deal of class......from our side at least.

 

[JK-Electrical]

Useful information for those of us who are self-employed and may be in need of financial assistance can be obtained via these two links:

COVID-19: support for businesses - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-to-employers-and-businesses-about-covid-19/covid-19-support-for-businesses#support-for-businesses-through-the-coronavirus-business-interruption-loan-scheme

https://www.british-business-bank.co.uk/ourpartners/coronavirus-business-interruption-loan-scheme-cbils/for-businesses-and-advisors

 

[Baddegg]

There’s now talk on the news of enforcing a lockdown, I’d like to think if that happens they’d have to sort the issue of self employed people, as much as people would like to comply.,,.kids need feeding bills need paying.....

 

[plugsandsparks]

I am currently on a Ferry coming back from Spain doing the last Calais to Dover crossing leg.
I have flown out to Alicante and drove back with my mum who has been struggling.
Both Spain and France are deserted totally and utterly. This is coming our way so plan for the long term. In terms of Gov support, i think if you give citizens advice a few days to absorb the government intentions i would ring their support line. Citizens advice are specialists in UC and benefits in general so ultimately i would trust their advice over either a website or a rep from DWP.
Hope this helps

 

[Baddegg]

Just watched the PMs latest news conference, not all of it the kids are here ?....but the question I wanted asked was relevant to this thread in that If Simeon the 1.5 m people list is the sole bread winner AND self employed what are the government proposing?

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Morning all.

I have had nearly all my jobs cancelled now. Still got a weeks work ahead but then perhaps 1 day a week. I was wondering if anyone new what the government plans are for the self employed with regards finance?

This might be a good thread to add to as new government plans come out.

All I really know if that they are postponing the July tax payment.

I expect I'll continue to get small jobs over the next few months perhaps amounting to a day a week, perhaps emergency jobs only, who knows. Does this mean I'll still be able to get some financial help even though I still have work?

It's all a bit confusing.

as i understand it you could claim universal credit and would get rent or mortgage support, they will base the uc claim on what you earn not assume a certain income.


I share you worry. I am fortunate to have some savings and have checked my diary and have 5 weeks of work booked in, none should be cancelled unless I get sick myself, all are either me outside in the garden or up scaffolding away from people. got lots of ev chargers to fit and still booking them in.
long term I dont know what will happen, by the sounds of it my work should run out come the peak of this virus in the UK when I will probably want to stay home anyway. I had planned for 2 1/2 weeks off at start of June anyway for a now cancelled holiday so will get the 5.2k back for that once the FCO give the dont travel notice for June. the money will keep me going for a while if I need it,

 

[Risteard]

have 5 weeks of work booked in, none should be cancelled unless I get sick myself

I believe it is highly likely that you will be compelled to cancel it. It seems highly likely to me that we will be ordered to stop work.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

I believe it is highly likely that you will be compelled to cancel it. It seems highly likely to me that we will be ordered to stop work.

i did think that, if they enforce a mandatory shut down then yes I would of course cancel.
one is in a workshop installing high bay light fittings, landlord has already paid me for the job and materials.
others are car charger installs in peoples garages or coming off the cut out with henley blocks., one is a full light install in a large garden where i dont need to go in the house as fuse board is in the garage.
Got a few EICRs for empty properties booked in aswell. but as you say it comes down to any mandatory lock down.
I do all the electrical work for a local 40 bed care home, got jobs to do but they are on hold until further notice, I do have to go and sort the emergency lighting outside as its a safety issue but dont need to go inside for that other than to turn the circuit off, which I can do easily enough without touching anything and wearing ppe.
they have agreed they will otherwise only call me in an absolute emergency where it is a safety issue, if not it waits. so its about working sensibly

 

[Risteard]

i did think that, if they enforce a mandatory shut down then yes I would of course cancel.
one is in a workshop installing high bay light fittings, landlord has already paid me for the job and materials.
others are car charger installs in peoples garages or coming off the cut out with henley blocks., one is a full light install in a large garden where i dont need to go in the house as fuse board is in the garage.
Got a few EICRs for empty properties booked in aswell. but as you say it comes down to any mandatory lock down.
I do all the electrical work for a local 40 bed care home, got jobs to do but they are on hold until further notice, I do have to go and sort the emergency lighting outside as its a safety issue but dont need to go inside for that other than to turn the circuit off, which I can do easily enough without touching anything and wearing ppe.
they have agreed they will otherwise only call me in an absolute emergency where it is a safety issue, if not it waits. so its about working sensibly

Hope it works out for you. Couple of bits left to do here but practically nothing's open (in terms of businesses) and I think very few people in terms of domestic customers will want people in. God knows when things will change.

 

[David Prosser]

Bit harsh @FatAlan....people didn’t vote for this at all no one saw it coming, people voted as to who they felt best represented their views and aspirations of the future, sounds like more sour grapes from the socialist left wingers (or anyone who’s spent they life mollycoddled in state employment) I’m not a fan Particularly of this or any other government but to use this situation as a point scoring political exercise is disgusting...you should be ashamed, I’m very impressed on the whole with how this country has come together and all trying they best in a very bad situation!

NHS workers are employed by the state !! Just pointing that out otherwise agree !

 

[Baddegg]

NHS workers are employed by the state !! Just pointing that out otherwise agree !

I did think that when I wrote it David, my wife works for the nhs as a radiographer, but I think you’ll agree they certainly are not mollycoddled.....as some within continuous ringfenced state employment are....

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Got a carpenter friend who I have been discussing this with. He said he is also worried about work drying up as he's got a 2 year old kid and girlfriend is pregnant.
He said he looked at his insurance policies and doesn't think due to the wording that he would be covered if he got the corona virus as if he did get it and makes a recovery as he would have had the illness for less than 30 days I think it was. it won't pay out as its for long term sick and injury cover and isn't a specified condition.. If he got it and died his family get 25k cash. He said that if work does go really bad then he would be better off having an '' accident '' and have a broken arm or leg as then he gets 5k tax free!
I don't advocate insurance fraud but I can see his thinking in the current climate.. I get a couple grand on mine if I break an arm or leg bone. Certainly makes you wonder how good these insurance policies for I come etc really are.

 

[Risteard]

Got a carpenter friend who I have been discussing this with. He said he is also worried about work drying up as he's got a 2 year old kid and girlfriend is pregnant.
He said he looked at his insurance policies and doesn't think due to the wording that he would be covered if he got the corona virus as if he did get it and makes a recovery as he would have had the illness for less than 30 days I think it was. it won't pay out as its for long term sick and injury cover and isn't a specified condition.. If he got it and died his family get 25k cash. He said that if work does go really bad then he would be better off having an '' accident '' and have a broken arm or leg as then he gets 5k tax free!
I don't advocate insurance fraud but I can see his thinking in the current climate.. I get a couple grand on mine if I break an arm or leg bone. Certainly makes you wonder how good these insurance policies for I come etc really are.

Seemingly pandemics are generally specifically excluded from them, and for those that don't exclude it Covid-19 isn't listed as it's too new. So generally speaking insurance won't cover it.

 

[Zerax]

They've banned evictions for 3 months, but after 3 months they can evict you if you failed to pay your rent during those 3 months.
They have urged landlords to be lenient and allow tenants to pay the missed rent once the crisis is over. So as work is slowly picking up again after this crisis those of us who rent will need to be earning more than ever to pay back the missed rent.

There is also an issue for landlords that rely on the rent to live...
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I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.

Don't forget that anyone employed by any government organisation (about 50% of the workforce)... will still get paid regardless... as I suspect will any salaried people... so it affects a relatively small number of people... So why give money to everyone ??

 

[davesparks]

There is also an issue for landlords that rely on the rent to live..

Yes there is, and those landlords need support too.
But if tenants can't pay their rent then they can't pay their rent, no matter how much a landlord needs the money.
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Don't forget that anyone employed by any government organisation (about 50% of the workforce)... will still get paid regardless... as I suspect will any salaried people... so it affects a relatively small number of people... So why give money to everyone ??

Do you have anything to support these figures? 50% of the workforce being employed by a government organisation seems unlikely.

 

[Zerax]

Do you have anything to support these figures? 50% of the workforce being employed by a government organisation seems unlikely.

It's like late 40s not exactly 50%... don't forget you need to include central government, local government, quangos, police, fire, NHS etc etc... it all adds up.

 

[pirate]

Regarding landlords, those who own their rental properties outright will have to rely on the tenant getting some assistance from the State, whereas those who have mortgages may get a "payment holiday" so the cashflow may continue for a while, but the loan still racks up...I guess it's really a question of cashflow/income for everyone.
There are many people who live within 2 bills of bankruptcy, and have no savings or other support. Just buying food for their families is going to be a real problem if they have no income. I just hope the government gets the cash to those in need quickly...

 

[suffolkspark]

I'm lucky I have money to fall back on as have been saving hard for a mortgage, my girlfriend has just lost her job in a pub though and as it was a zero hour contract cant get anything from them, I think us self employed can get universal credit if we aren't working but that's it for now. I've got a few jobs I can do in a closed leisure centre, and a very small building site, and a bit on a fruit farm which only has 2 staff, im doing the 2meter thing. I've stopped going in peoples homes.

 

[snowhead]

Don't forget that anyone employed by any government organisation (about 50% of the workforce)... will still get paid regardless... as I suspect will any salaried people... so it affects a relatively small number of people... So why give money to everyone ??

Public sector employment, UK - Office for National Statistics

The official measure of people employed in the UK public sector, including private sector estimates.

www.ons.gov.uk

Try 16.5% in the Public Sector or 5.44 million.
All of whom are still working, possibly excepting some teachers.

Just because someone is salaried doesn't mean they'll automatically get paid. look at B.A staff they've been asked to take unpaid leave as will a lot of other employees I suspect.

I was salaried for around 2/3rds of my working life, I don't remember any clause in the T&Cs saying I'd get paid if I wasn't working other than company sick pay, which this current situation wouldn't inlcude.
Very few companies could afford to do it.

 

[multimick]

my tenant works for wigan coucil ,he is at risk so is self isolating, he gets paid ,but on half salary after 1 month off

 

[peterhyper]

I just hope the part Pee organisations will allow members to freeze their memberships if they need to (without paying their monthly fees). The same applies to the advertising scams such as trustatrader and checkatrade etc.

 

[Zerax]

Try 16.5% in the Public Sector or 5.44 million.

As with anything to do with the state sector... it's all very complicated. I was referring to the widest measure of anyone to gets paid from taxpayers funds... not the narrow direct employed measure. This is the one that's relevant to the issue of the day.
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Try 16.5% in the Public Sector or 5.44 million.

As with anything to do with the state sector... it's all very complicated. I was referring to the widest measure of anyone to gets paid from taxpayers funds... not the narrow direct employed measure. This is the one that's relevant to the issue of the day.

 

[Colonel6271]

All is explained here.

COVID-19 financial support for businesses

Find out what financial support you can get for your business.

www.gov.uk

 

[EalingBadger]

It seems S/E is being looked at.
The issue they've got with payments is they're trying to use existing systems, so amongst other things they know they're paying to genuine people and not scammers, who will of course be out in their thousands.

The U.S plan of sending a cheque for every household for $1500 or so doesn't seem a good idea when all the Millionaires and Billionaires will also get them.

What is the likely ratio of Millionaires and Billionaires to ordinary Joes?

And what will this translate to in terms of the percentage of the total funds distributed?

I reckon it will be quite small and therefore does not justify the administrative overhead of trying to confirm the financial status of each citizen before sending out the cheques.

Remember, they would have to check the status of every single person, not just the Millionaires and Billionaires, so the cost would be enormous and likely dwarf any saving that might be made by identifying those subsequently judged to be not worthy.
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Yes, it's not quite as good as it seems though.
They've banned evictions for 3 months, but after 3 months they can evict you if you failed to pay your rent during those 3 months.
They have urged landlords to be lenient and allow tenants to pay the missed rent once the crisis is over. So as work is slowly picking up again after this crisis those of us who rent will need to be earning more than ever to pay back the missed rent.
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I'm sure i'm not the only self employed person who has thought about this, supermarkets etc are on a bit of a recruitment drive, they need staff in all departments at the moment. The income would be enough to keep the wolf from the door,

It makes me wish id taken the opportunity to get an HGV licence a couple of years ago, i'd be happy to spend the next few weeks driving trucks of food around.

I couldn't do a public-facing job, not because I fear catching the disease but because I just don't have the temperament for it.

Yes, technically the ban on evictions is strictly limited but I bet it will get extended as and when it becomes clear that the crisis is going to last longer.

Also, believe it or not, landlords REALLY don't like to evict. It is very stressful for all concerned, invariably costs a great deal and takes a long time to actually achieve.

And in the current climate the chances of finding a new tenant are seriously reduced.

if you are a good tenant apart from diffuclties with the rent during the current crisis then a landlord would have to be insane to evict.
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Its a good idea, but as with any plan it has it's issues.
Where does the money come from and does it have to be paid back?

It will simply be printed. Period.

(Oh to possess a printing press like one of those government ones...)
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Seemingly pandemics are generally specifically excluded from them, and for those that don't exclude it Covid-19 isn't listed as it's too new. So generally speaking insurance won't cover it.

Got an email from Nationwide this morning - paraphrasing:

We will not be paying out any insurance claims for Corvid related claims from 23/3/20 as insurance is to cover the risk of the unexpected and since the virus is now a clear reality it can no longer be considered as unexpected.

IOW, FOAD (probably somewhat more literally than usual as far as this acrynym typically goes!)

 

[davesparks]

And in the current climate the chances of finding a new tenant are seriously reduced.

A fact I'm hoping I can use to my advantage, find a new place to rent and get a lower rent because the landlord is struggling to get a tenant

 

[EalingBadger]

A fact I'm hoping I can use to my advantage, find a new place to rent and get a lower rent because the landlord is struggling to get a tenant

A case of market forces working in both directions.