Green Deal and PV...

[Berneray]

Here is why it won't work for us.

We sold a 4kpw system earlier in the week. Out of curiosity I accompanied the DEA we use when he was doing the EPC. He is also a qualified Green Deal Assessor.

During the survey our customer asked him about Green Deal and pv solar. He said the report would recommend pv but it would not qualify for full funding and she would have to contribute toward the cost.

She is also looking for new windows and doors, LED lighting and some top up insulation.

So the DEA is now going to do a Green Deal Plan.

And for us this is where it all goes belly up. Up to the point the EPC was started we had a signed contract with our customer for a 4kpw system.

So say she decides to take whatever Green Deal funding is available for PV Solar, windows, lighting and insulation......We then loose all control of the job, Because it then becomes the job of the provider to organise and award all the work.

So then the Green Deal Provider eventually passes us the pv job to do. We have to buy all the materials, install and commission the job.....and then invoice not our customer....but the Green Deal Provider and wait the 30 days or so until they decide to pay us.

Furthermore no funding will be paid out ALL the work is complete. So if windows/doors ect are also being part Green Deal funded then no one gets paid till all the work is done...

 

[SRE]

and that assumes you've topped up to Pas2030 to be able to install it at all - we haven't, so we would lose the job completely. Assuming that the other 2 companies that the customer is encouraged to go to doesn't undercut us and that we can afford to pay the Green Deal provider the referral fee they will no doubt require.

I'll be very carefully selecting DEA's that don't do Green Deal - thanks for the heads up on this.

 

[whinmoor]

Yes - the requirement for payment to be delayed until all the measures are complete is a complete stinker. The cash-flow implications are crippling.

 

[Gavin A]

good point well made.

We mostly get the epc assessment done after the job these days unless we're really not sure, which partially solves this issue, but then the ones we don't will be the ones that have the most work needing doing on other areas. I had been thinking that green deal would work in these situations to help fund the other work that needed doing, but this has given pause for thought on that.

 

[Earthstore]

So every installer on the GD list will try make sure that their job is the last then,
hmmm that could drag on a bit...

 

[sparkless]

the puzzle is:
MCS are very critical on the wording on the CONTRACT between us (the installer) and the customer.
yet, with Green Deal
the contract is between the installer and the GDP.
and another between the customer and the GDP.

So the contract would suit the purposes of the Green Deal but be useless for the FiT and vise versa

The left hand isn't talking to the right hand

 

[sedgy34]

You won't get a sniff after green deal provider is involved unless you are pas 2030 for Pv as SRE said. Why don't you get your customer to carry on with your contract and they can have green deal on other measures you might even get a payment for passing on the enquiry from the provider.
Your customer don't want a topup/ on loft and have LED lighting and pay a 7% interest when it's affordable anyway.

 

[TedM]

The problem is that if multiple measures are all bundled into a single Green Deal loan then it is allowable for a measure that doesn't quite meet the Golden Rule (e.g. PV) to be subsidised by other measures that more than meet it. Also the larger a total GD loan you take out the lower the effective interest rate will be.

These two things will encourage people to bundle as much as possible into a single Green Deal. None of which will be of any benefit to installers unless they can cover all the measures in a one-stop shop.

 

[Gavin A]

Personally I'd just send the customer links to all the articles critical of green deal, then suggest they at least wait until the system is set up and functioning before considering that route for the other measures, but get the PV installed now... or offer to install some of the other measures at the same time without green deal.

 

[Berneray]

Here is what I ended up doing. Knocked the Green Deal into touch. Applied for a £2000 Interest Free Loan from Energy Savings Trust for our customer instead. She is putting the balance onto her mortgage at about 5%. Sorted.

But for me a real lesson learned. NEVER EVER again will a Domestic Energy Adviser I ask to do an EPC mention Green Deal again.......makes me even more determined to complete my DEA qualification as soon as possible....

 

[SRE]

Well done - we don't have access to EST interest free loans over the border, good thinking about the DEA - maybe worth thinking about if only to protect your own sales.

 

[Berneray]

You can get DEA training from a decent trainer for about £1200 +VAT. You can then get up to £500 grant from:

Skills Development Scotland - Improving the skills of Scotland's people. Careers, learning and skills advice. - Skills Development Scotland

We pay £60 for an EPC......So if you do them yourself the course has paid for itself in about ten sales.

But its also a really good service to be able to offer your potential pv customers. The fact that you can do the EPC yourself. Gives you an edge over competitors. (Hope that does not come back to bite me on the bum in the months to come.....But I believe in KARMA. The more you help others the more you help yourself)

The course is not difficult. Its a mix of accurate measuring, common sense and load of photographs...

After the course you need to build a portfolio of a mix of different types of properties. I've done that by shadowing the DEA's doing my EPCS.

I signed up for DEA and GDA training......but I am now only interested in the DEA side. For now there is nothing in the Green Deal for us...if we go down that route we effectively become subbies and servants to the Green Deal Provider.....with the added hindrance of having to buy the materials ourselves....