UK Refresh my memory please

[simonnew]

I qualified as an electrician using the C&G 2330 route back in 2012...

I stayed in my current job which is non electrical so I spent 3.5 years for a peice of paper.

A breif description of why i need a little help. I bought a 1930"s house that needs a fair bit of work including a rewire or partial rewire.

The 2 x lounges and the bedrooms all have 1 double socket....I would like to extend the ring main in each room to something like the sketch I've attached...
Dont shoot me down, I'm happy to get a sparky in if needed but i do enjoy knowing I've done the work myself.

Am I right in thinking i can just extend a ring main by taking the 2 sets of wires out of a socket, chuck one in a Wago to branch out to a few more sockets then loop back to the original socket ?

 

[nicebutdim]

There are a lot of things that can be done, but are less than ideal.

Given that you want to extend a circuit in several places, I'd be inclined to aim for extending at accessories and plan to replace a few sections of existing cable.

Above assumes all else is equal and that current installation is tested and known to be to a satisfactory standard.

 

[littlespark]

only one socket per room? What about the kitchen? Is there only one socket circuit for the entire house?

What is the cables like? Doesn’t sound like it’s been rewired at all since built…. And importantly, what’s the consumer unit like? Museum piece fuse board??

Rather than patching up and adding inbetween… I’d be inclined to start from scratch and rewire everything.

 

[timhoward]

Agree. I think the fundamentals have to be looked at first.
Is there RCD protection. What is the insulation resistance measurement of the current wiring. Is it still a ring (end to end continuity tests)
Are the sockets all very low on skirting boards and in rather impractical positions.

Ruling out very old wiring or even possibly a conduit install needs to happen before you extend it.

By the time a few boards are lifted to extend circuits it is hardly any extra work to turn it into a new circuit (which could be a radial circuit)

A further thing to look at is whether the lighting circuits have a cpc (earth) as per 1966 they may not have.

 

[simonnew]

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

I'm open to all suggestions as this is a pretty big project for me, I'm more than happy to get the professionals in for jobs that I don't feel confident in doing or jobs I know I shouldn't even consider.

Yes, the lounge and 3 bedrooms only have 1 socket which is why I thought the best solution was to extend the ring main.

I have no idea what the lighting circuit is like as I haven't had chance to look yet.

The house has had a rewire at some point as I found the old rubber cables chopped and left under the floorboards, although I don't know when it was done.

I've attached a few photos for advice on how old the CU is...not sure you can tell by a photo ?

Also, is there an easier way to chase the sockets in....bloody hard work with a chisel

 

[littlespark]

Looks like original sockets were very low on skirting.

Yes, chasing in by chisel is hard work… it’s going to take you some time.
A professional will possibly have a few gadgets to help out there…. Chase cutter, rotary stop hammer drill to name a couple.

Better if you can get 35mm deep boxes, those only look 25. Not only gives you a bit extra space to dress cables behind, but options of having USB socket or flat plate designs fitted that need extra room behind. Grommets in the holes as well.

The CU is 1990’s at a guess, and changing that really isn’t a DIY job. Get a full RCBO board with SPD (and AFDD if you’re feeling flush) as most circuits now require rcd protection.

Your lighting will either be loop in, where a feed is looped between each light position, with a cable drop to the switches…. Or it’ll be a central joint box…. Likely under the floor on the landing, and just up through attic hatch.
More recently, lighting has been a looped supply to each switch… having a neutral for possible future smart switches, for example. Requires a deeper box again, as some lighting was wired with only a 12mm back box.

After lighting and power, you might also want dedicated radial circuits for high load kitchen appliances, smoke and heat detectors throughout, and any cabling required for heating controls.

Throw in some CAT6 data as well if your walls are likely to prevent decent Wi-Fi. Same with aerial and satellite feeds.
Extractor fans for bathrooms? The list goes on….


Then there’s the dreaded Part P which you’ll have to ask someone else about, cos we don’t have it up here in Scotland.

 

[Aaron b]

Have a through inspection and look for junction boxes. If it's been played with too much you might be better starting from scratch especially it the work is rough.

Part P is going to be a pain. I'd suggest contacting someone local agreeing routes and do all the building works to cut down on cost. Check they are really registered using the competent persons website.

Look for green goo leaking from the bottom of light switches and accessories in airing cupboards.

 

[simonnew]

Have a through inspection and look for junction boxes. If it's been played with too much you might be better starting from scratch especially it the work is rough.

Part P is going to be a pain. I'd suggest contacting someone local agreeing routes and do all the building works to cut down on cost. Check they are really registered using the competent persons website.

Look for green goo leaking from the bottom of light switches and accessories in airing cupboards.

Hi Aaron,
Thankyou for replying.
I found one junction box under the house, there may be more but in the downstairs only one.

What's the Green gunk, why would someone use it ?
Thanks

 

[simonnew]

Looks like original sockets were very low on skirting.

Yes, chasing in by chisel is hard work… it’s going to take you some time.
A professional will possibly have a few gadgets to help out there…. Chase cutter, rotary stop hammer drill to name a couple.

Better if you can get 35mm deep boxes, those only look 25. Not only gives you a bit extra space to dress cables behind, but options of having USB socket or flat plate designs fitted that need extra room behind. Grommets in the holes as well.

The CU is 1990’s at a guess, and changing that really isn’t a DIY job. Get a full RCBO board with SPD (and AFDD if you’re feeling flush) as most circuits now require rcd protection.

Your lighting will either be loop in, where a feed is looped between each light position, with a cable drop to the switches…. Or it’ll be a central joint box…. Likely under the floor on the landing, and just up through attic hatch.
More recently, lighting has been a looped supply to each switch… having a neutral for possible future smart switches, for example. Requires a deeper box again, as some lighting was wired with only a 12mm back box.

After lighting and power, you might also want dedicated radial circuits for high load kitchen appliances, smoke and heat detectors throughout, and any cabling required for heating controls.

Throw in some CAT6 data as well if your walls are likely to prevent decent Wi-Fi. Same with aerial and satellite feeds.
Extractor fans for bathrooms? The list goes on….


Then there’s the dreaded Part P which you’ll have to ask someone else about, cos we don’t have it up here in Scotland.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

I'll change the 25's to 35mm as over time I will want to change the sockets to suit USB versions, and I'll be using Grommets.

The CU is something I will pay a sparky to change, that's the kind of job I wouldn't feel confident doing. I value my life too much .

The list is endless, thankfully we have a bit of time to get it done, we just want it liveable for now.

Thanks for your recommendations.

 

[Aaron b]

Hi Aaron,
Thankyou for replying.
I found one junction box under the house, there may be more but in the downstairs only one.

What's the Green gunk, why would someone use it ?
Thanks

It's the plasticiser leaching from the PVC. Early t&e was polyethylene and shiny, when they moved to PVC they got it wrong and the plasticiser leaches out. It reacts with the copper and turns green. It accelerates in heat and the only way to stop it is replace the cables. I've never IR tested the goo but I assume it's that what causes poor insulation values.

There is a green gunk that's a waterproofing compound, sometimes stuck on earth connections or used for general water or vapour proofing. It also dyes your hands green...