Minor Works

[keiron2013]

Hi Guys,

Please could some tell me what qualification i would need to obtain to carry out minor works certification, i am 19 and about to become a qualified gas engineer, at present i am wiring central heating systems, from combination boilers to a fully pumped system with 3 heating zones, due to the client now requesting minor certifcation on every installation and would like to carry out the tests myself for me to complete the job quicker and cheaper

many thanks

Keiron

 

[ste77]

What test were you planning on carrying out? and quick and cheap isnt always the best option if youve no experience with electrics

 

[Sintra]

In a one word answer NONE. Although according to BS 7671 you have to be competent.

 

[telectrix]

you can complete minor works certs. as long as you can test. what might be a problem is if you install new circuits or do any work in bathrooms or kitches, i.e. notifiable works.

 

[keiron2013]

Cheers for the replys, I have some knowledge within the electrics field and testing, carrying out a course might be a bit more help full, I'm not installin new supply points I'm connecting onto existing water heater circuits and re labelling the board and changin the front from a switch to a switched fused spur

 

[toast]

Hi Guys,

Please could some tell me what qualification i would need to obtain to carry out minor works certification,

No qualification required, but knowledge on Inspection,Testing and Certification would be advisable, also calibrated meters would be required.

 

[keiron2013]

So I would be able to issue minor works certificates with no qualifications? :S

 

[toast]

So I would be able to issue minor works certificates with no qualifications? :S

You could, you could issue EIC without them to!

 

[keiron2013]

Yeah but legally and above board no come backs?

 

[ste77]

Yeah but legally and above board no come backs?

"legally" works both ways, get it wrong and if ur unable to prove your competent to carry out those work, your balls will be on a chopping block.

 

[telectrix]

according to BS7671, you must be a " competent person". that's it. 2382 and 2391 would be the qualifications that would help you prove competence if ever a job went pete tong.

 

[toast]

Yeah but legally and above board no come backs?

Not doing anything illegal. But if you are considering doing this as a service, I would suggest getting some knowledge.

 

[toast]

according to BS7671, you must be a " competent person". that's it. 2382 and 2391 would be the qualifications that would help you prove competence if ever a job went pete tong.

But it could be argued that BS7671 is not a legal doc, so no breaking of laws committed providing Part P is conformed to.

 

[keiron2013]

Lol this is all I'm asking is what qualification/course I need to do to be deemed compentant in testing, I'm confident in carryin out the test after watchin and carryin out tests with a qualified elecy

 

[ste77]

BS7671 isnt a legal document but the electricity at work regs is, and thats why you would end up in court

 

[toast]

Lol this is all I'm asking is what qualification/course I need to do to be deemed compentant in testing, I'm confident in carryin out the test after watchin and carryin out tests with a qualified elecy

Well you would firstly require 2382, then 2394.

 

[Des 56]

Lol this is all I'm asking is what qualification/course I need to do to be deemed compentant in testing, I'm confident in carryin out the test after watchin and carryin out tests with a qualified elecy

That is impressive,it took me quite a few years to do so, whilst also understanding what exactly it was I was testing
Times change I suppose

 

[ste77]

That is impressive,it took me quite a few years to do so, whilst also understanding what exactly it was I was testing
Times change I suppose

Its called cutting the middle man out!!

 

[telectrix]

i've been at it for bloody years, from wind up meggers and avo 8's and i still get it wrong sometimes.

 

[Dean Williams]

it's all very well testing, filling in the cert etc. but do you know an acceptable reading from an unacceptable one, do you know what the readings actually mean. you could be issuing a cert but the readings indicate an unsafe/dangerous/ non compliant state!!

 

[Engineer54]

Almost a qualified Gas Engineer at 19 years old, he's wiring central heating systems, and now wants to test them!!! Has the world in the UK gone totally stark raving mad!!! Or is the same thing happening in the gas industry with these fast track training centres, and Gas-safe registering them with minimal meaningless qualifications??

 

[Octopus]

Hum, an interesting one.

What type of of MFT do you have?

 

[partypest]

That does seen pretty young. Regardless of that, as others have pointed out, you may be called upon to prove your competency. Passing 2382, 2391, Part P and BS7671 17th would be evidence. You may also be called upon to prove how you have kept yourself up to date, joining a P scheme and The IET would be evidence of that. Just watching someone else do it doesn't prove you are competent. If you are putting your name to it, you need to be 100% sure. Just for arguments sake, would you be happy in a 747 if the pilot had learned to fly by watching a mate do it and never passed a test? Ignorance is no defence in law, so make sure you aren't ignorant is my advice.

 

[CTID]

Almost a qualified Gas Engineer at 19 years old, he's wiring central heating systems, and now wants to test them!!! Has the world in the UK gone totally stark raving mad!!! Or is the same thing happening in the gas industry with these fast track training centres, and Gas-safe registering them with minimal meaningless qualifications??

If he started a four year apprenticeship at 16 then that would be right

 

[Marnik]

If he started a four year apprenticeship at 16 then that would be right

Maths??? 16 + 4 = ? No not 19 but 20 !! and even then, i for one would not deem that as competent or qualified.
Equation is as follows in my eyes Knowledge)+(Qualification)+(common sense)+(experience)= competancy

 

[Octopus]

Back to the OP.

Are you planning on starting up self employed and registering for Gas Safe etc?

If so then the sensible step would be to become Part P registered with a scheme and that would "cover" the electrical bases too.

Quite an undertaking at 19/20 years of age.

 

[keiron2013]

Lol can't believe ur arguing over my age lol, I've been doing it since I was 12 part time. Yes we have our own business with my dad n brother, employing 7 engineers so plenty of experiance around me, will go to collage to take the realavnt exams as ur all havin a bitch fit lmaoo

 

[ste77]

Lol can't believe ur arguing over my age lol, I've been doing it since I was 12 part time. Yes we have our own business with my dad n brother, employing 7 engineers so plenty of experiance around me, will go to collage to take the realavnt exams as ur all havin a bitch fit lmaoo

Bitch fits?? you asked peoples opinions, maybe they dont match the answers you wanted but they are hardly bitch fits, now you're showing your age.

 

[Octopus]

Lol can't believe ur arguing over my age lol, I've been doing it since I was 12 part time. Yes we have our own business with my dad n brother, employing 7 engineers so plenty of experiance around me, will go to collage to take the realavnt exams as ur all havin a bitch fit lmaoo

My posts #22 and #26 aren't having a bitch and your responses are?

 

[markc123]

Keiron, are you serious?

I've just read that whole thread and nobody was having a bitch fit - and if you think they were, you should read some of the other threads on here...come back in 2014 when david cockburn re-registers if you want to see a proper bitch fit.

People were just giving you plain and simple advice. You need to undertake the 2382, 2394 & 2395 aswell as a part-p course / register with a scheme. This will prove your competent to sign off your own work.

Yes, as others have mentioned you can sign off a MWC now if you really want - but if anyone gets hurt you'll definitley go to prison because you wont be able to prove your competent to undertake the work you've done.

 

[keiron2013]

Lmaoo, some ov u r , on bout my age and tha, engineers 54 is the worst, you stick to the lightin and ring mains ill do the central heating,

 

[ste77]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

 

[keiron2013]

Keiron, are you serious?

I've just read that whole thread and nobody was having a bitch fit - and if you think they were, you should read some of the other threads on here...come back in 2014 when david cockburn re-registers if you want to see a proper bitch fit.

People were just giving you plain and simple advice. You need to undertake the 2382, 2394 & 2395 aswell as a part-p course / register with a scheme. This will prove your competent to sign off your own work.

Yes, as others have mentioned you can sign off a MWC now if you really want - but if anyone gets hurt you'll definitley go to prison because you wont be able to prove your competent to undertake the work you've done.

Thanks mark,
You have give me exactly what I asked for, most of the goin on bout BS, and my age, how can I be able to wire?, most experianced people are worse than inexperiance, inexperiance people are cautious in what they are doing

 

[markc123]

you're welcome.

 

[markc123]

Thanks mark,
You have give me exactly what I asked for, most of the goin on bout BS, and my age, how can I be able to wire?, most experianced people are worse than inexperiance, inexperiance people are cautious in what they are doing

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

 

[keiron2013]

All I wanted to knw if I need to be qualified? Yes or No, and if so what course do I need to undertake, not all the bull****. Aswell I didn't knw if I was coming or going, thanks to mark I nw knw what I need to do to undertake the tests,

 

[Octopus]

All I wanted to knw if I need to be qualified? Yes or No, and if so what course do I need to undertake, not all the bull****. Aswell I didn't knw if I was coming or going, thanks to mark I nw knw what I need to do to undertake the tests,

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

I agree with that mark, I'm gettin slated because I've asked do I need to be qualified to do the test, but in order to gain experiance u need hands on aswell as knowledge no good sat in collage learnin out of a book need the onsite to get true experiance

 

[Andy78]

All I wanted to knw if I need to be qualified? Yes or No, and if so what course do I need to undertake, not all the bull****. Aswell I didn't knw if I was coming or going, thanks to mark I nw knw what I need to do to undertake the tests,

You got the precise answer to your question in the second reply on this thread.

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

Its all down to giving a better service, and we don't get paid unless we hav e a minor works, will help with cashflow

 

[Octopus]

Its all down to giving a better service, and we don't get paid unless we hav e a minor works, will help with cashflow

So you are ignoring my posts then.

How do you issue certs now?

The last Gas Safe man's work I looked at had installed a spur, which was off a spur, which was off a spur, off a ring on a 32A MCB

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

So you are ignoring my posts then.

How do you issue certs now?

The last Gas Safe man's work I looked at had installed a spur, which was off a spur, which was off a spur, off a ring on a 32A MCB

We are not installing new spurs, we are changin the fronts from a water heater which is on it own breaker to a switch fuse spur or unswitch sock

 

[Octopus]

We are not installing new spurs, we are changin the fronts from a water heater which is on it own breaker to a switch fuse spur or unswitch sock

Sooner or later you WILL need to install a new circuit or make changes in a kitchen so Part P will be a requirement. and then theres bonding, RCD protection etc, etc.

 

[Andy78]

we don't get paid unless we hav e a minor works, will help with cashflow

We are not installing new spurs, we are changin the fronts from a water heater which is on it own breaker to a switch fuse spur or unswitch sock

Not making a lot of sense there.

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

No we are installing boiler if we every did do a kitchen we would get a spark in to do the works

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

Ok we are not running supplys just changin the front, which is not notifiable works.

 

[Engineer54]

Lmaoo, some ov u r , on bout my age and tha, engineers 54 is the worst, you stick to the lightin and ring mains ill do the central heating,

Spoken by a true immature kid!!! Ignorance is bliss at your age!!

As the part Pee system has been in place for several years now, how come your father and brother haven't taken the necessary electrical courses?? Come to that, any of these 7 gas fitters your father employs??

Better still get some trusted qualified electricians on a call retainer basis, or employ one of them, if you have that much work on....

 

[keiron2013]

its a relevant point, how can you be experienced/competent at electrics when youve only observed an electrician, you need to be aware of why we carry out tests, what readings are accceptable and why they differ with different protective devices, its best to stick to what you know best til youve gained the relevant qualifications instead of trying to earn a few quick extra pounds.

I can't say i agree with how you've completley conducted yourself in this thread, and regardless of what else has been said, as i can't really be arsed to get involved in 'bitch fits' at the time being...

That is completley true, when i was learning the trade i used to notice my dad work live all the time, and sometimes get a little belt.

Now, as im older the times have changed and at one point i used to make sure everything is dead....replacing a FCU now or w.e. i'll just do live.

The more experienced do get hurt more i'll agree, but thats their own fault.

But, having said that...Experience is knowledge in this trade im afraid.

So are you simply ignoring my posts #22 and #26?????

You dad, should do the right thing and take on a competent sparky and see how it goes. He's the boss!

Spoken by a true immature kid!!! Ignorance is bliss at your age!!

As the part Pee system has been in place for several years now, how come your father and brother haven't taken the necessary electrical courses?? Come to that, any of these 7 gas fitters your father employs??

Better still get some trusted qualified electricians on a call retainer basis, or employ one of them, if you have that much work on....

Yeah my old man got his part p and is niceic approved but due to being busy we use sparkys at the moment but is causing problems with efffiency, we are always look to produce a better and more efficent service within our company, donno bout u but u sound like that don't matter to u?