Ring final circuit vs Radial final circuit

[kevster]

there was talk of the ring final circuit being done away with when the 17th edition was being drafted but nothing, maybe its on the cards for the near future, the rest of europe are on radials with DP breakers i believe

 

[lawsonium]

Hello Matt,
I would suggest that you post this as I new thread starter as this is all getting a bit long winded and off topic.(but you should be bringing things up to 17th spec if you are doing major renovations at this time)

True, I will do later today hopefully, thanks. (Sorry for hyjacking this thread )

Matt.

 

[jimwee79]

Jesus none of you came up with the most obvious answer. if you get a fault on a ring it is a lot harder to find than on a radial. I aint even gonna explain why unless somebody asks but it`s pretty simple if you just apply a little common sense.

 

[ian.settle1]

Jesus none of you came up with the most obvious answer. if you get a fault on a ring it is a lot harder to find than on a radial. I aint even gonna explain why unless somebody asks but it`s pretty simple if you just apply a little common sense.

Why? the only difference between them is the extra leg back to the board.

 

[jimwee79]

Think if you have a fault on a ring you still have 2 live ends to test and a lot of live skts. where as on a radial wherever ur break is all skts thereafter are dead.

 

[Tokyo Joe]

...so, whats the negative aspects of a ring cct? Apart from more cable clips.

Don't forget the aspect of.......... Diy ers... kitchen fitters etc ....... cocking up ring mains over the years
As I have seen on lots of occasions.......... Then try to solve it !..... at least it is really hard to cock up a radial
Ps I am A 4.00mm radial fan !!! ....... So much easier to work with ... forget the cost !!!

 

[Mac]

Don't forget the aspect of.......... Diy ers... kitchen fitters etc ....... cocking up ring mains over the years
As I have seen on lots of occasions.......... Then try to solve it !..... at least it is really hard to cock up a radial
Ps I am A 4.00mm radial fan !!! ....... So much easier to work with ... forget the cost !!!

I did post something a while back,can't find it at the mo.Do away with rings and just use 4mm radials.The way to go

 

[leekemp85]

If for example you were rewiring a house would you still use the same method with the 4mm radial (kitchen, down stairs and up stairs) for the power circuits or would there be more circuit ie one circuits per room

 

[Mac]

If for example you were rewiring a house would you still use the same method with the 4mm radial (kitchen, down stairs and up stairs) for the power circuits or would there be more circuit ie one circuits per room

Kitchen on it's own circuit,rest of downstairs and upstairs on it's own circuits.Upstairs and downstairs circuits literally use nothing.

 

[supertoad]

a 16 A radial is easier to test /run/and idiot proof for uncle bill the was an electrician for the years ago and diy using the home electrics books. most important it allows seperation of cks for customer conveniance in case of a fault, its basicly foolfroof, for plugs 2xrad + kitchen+lts is enough for av 3bed flat-most important-cant make a ring a hazard-cable run up to 30 m no problems

 

[Andy78]

Really ?

 

[Guest55]

holy freakin thread resurection !!!!!!!!!
lol.

 

[supertoad]

4mm rad ideal in gally kitchens where kitchen fitters/etc need all high load appliances on one leg of a 2.5 mm ring /or any other kitchen

 

[supertoad]

yes!!!!!

 

[supertoad]

yes! and the rest-potential disaster

 

[Toonlad]

Price of copper these days??

 

[Engineer54]

4mm rad ideal in gally kitchens where kitchen fitters/etc need all high load appliances on one leg of a 2.5 mm ring /or any other kitchen

That just smacks of bad design, than anything else!! Tell us what potential disaster your trying to sell us on??

 

[supertoad]

typical kitchen fitter design, one leg of ring ofted overloaded, if it looks flash ok, nevermind the electrics

 

[Engineer54]

typical kitchen fitter design, one leg of ring ofted overloaded, if it looks flash ok, nevermind the electrics

Well they aren't electricians are they!! So what's this potential disaster your on about??

 

[mrloy99]

RING ISSUES AGAIN...I'm sure I've said this before but not on this thread...Anyway.I had to do some work in a house,moving a socket for the tv amp or something.My apprentice was at the consumer unit switching off,then back on again,the mcbs one at a time coz nothing was labled at the consumer unit. But the socket tester's neon indicators failed to extinguish. My apprentice was also leaving me in the dark as he was switching off 6amp mcbs too.So we swopped,me at the board end and him at the socket.I switched all the mcbs off except one 32amp and it was still live,then I flicked the last one off too and he yelled down to me that,that was it.So I flicked everything back on except that last mcb,only to find when I'd got back to the socket that it was live again(the hard way)...swearing profusly at my"thick" apprentice,I made my way back down to the cu and knocked the other 32amp mcb off and the first one back on again,then back up to the attic again,the attic socket(still live?) just had one cable at it...a spur off the house ring..It took a wee while before it sunk in that in order to isolate this circuit it was necessary to operate two breakers and later found out the same applied to the kitchen ring too.....The two ring legs had been interconnected,outgoing house ring leg connected to return leg from kitchen,at the mcb and return house ring connected to outgoing kitchen leg.It was impossable to switch off any socket via a single mcb. Ever since that I've gone off rings...Pity someone wouldn't enlighten the designers and engineers who do the drawings for us to follow, of the HAZZARDS of(improperly tested) ring circuits.

 

[Engineer54]

RING ISSUES AGAIN...I'm sure I've said this before but not on this thread...Anyway.I had to do some work in a house,moving a socket for the tv amp or something.My apprentice was at the consumer unit switching off,then back on again,the mcbs one at a time coz nothing was labled at the consumer unit. But the socket tester's neon indicators failed to extinguish. My apprentice was also leaving me in the dark as he was switching off 6amp mcbs too.So we swopped,me at the board end and him at the socket.I switched all the mcbs off except one 32amp and it was still live,then I flicked the last one off too and he yelled down to me that,that was it.So I flicked everything back on except that last mcb,only to find when I'd got back to the socket that it was live again(the hard way)...swearing profusly at my"thick" apprentice,I made my way back down to the cu and knocked the other 32amp mcb off and the first one back on again,then back up to the attic again,the attic socket(still live?) just had one cable at it...a spur off the house ring..It took a wee while before it sunk in that in order to isolate this circuit it was necessary to operate two breakers and later found out the same applied to the kitchen ring too.....The two ring legs had been interconnected,outgoing house ring leg connected to return leg from kitchen,at the mcb and return house ring connected to outgoing kitchen leg.It was impossable to switch off any socket via a single mcb. Ever since that I've gone off rings...Pity someone wouldn't enlighten the designers and engineers who do the drawings for us to follow, of the HAZZARDS of(improperly tested) ring circuits.

Why would they need to do that?? They are expecting the installation to be installed by competent qualified electricians, not by some knob who was stacking shelves a few weeks previously!!

 

[supertoad]

glad its not only me has had this problem! working on my own i use a "singing plugin tester"
agree with all your comments

 

[Engineer54]

glad its not only me has had this problem! working on my own i use a "singing plugin tester"
agree with all your comments

What and whose comments??

 

[kingeri]

RING ISSUES AGAIN...I'm sure I've said this before but not on this thread...Anyway.I had to do some work in a house,moving a socket for the tv amp or something.My apprentice was at the consumer unit switching off,then back on again,the mcbs one at a time coz nothing was labled at the consumer unit. But the socket tester's neon indicators failed to extinguish. My apprentice was also leaving me in the dark as he was switching off 6amp mcbs too.So we swopped,me at the board end and him at the socket.I switched all the mcbs off except one 32amp and it was still live,then I flicked the last one off too and he yelled down to me that,that was it.So I flicked everything back on except that last mcb,only to find when I'd got back to the socket that it was live again(the hard way)...swearing profusly at my"thick" apprentice,I made my way back down to the cu and knocked the other 32amp mcb off and the first one back on again,then back up to the attic again,the attic socket(still live?) just had one cable at it...a spur off the house ring..It took a wee while before it sunk in that in order to isolate this circuit it was necessary to operate two breakers and later found out the same applied to the kitchen ring too.....The two ring legs had been interconnected,outgoing house ring leg connected to return leg from kitchen,at the mcb and return house ring connected to outgoing kitchen leg.It was impossable to switch off any socket via a single mcb. Ever since that I've gone off rings...Pity someone wouldn't enlighten the designers and engineers who do the drawings for us to follow, of the HAZZARDS of(improperly tested) ring circuits.

I don't really get what you're saying. Because at some point some idiot has joined up two circuits, how is that a problem with ring circuits in general? Someone could just as easily join two radials, or two lighting circuits. If a ring is designed and installed properly then it is a very versatile and useful circuit. What happens years down the line when some fool messes with it isn't a refection on the circuit itself.

 

[candles]

I don't really get what you're saying. Because at some point some idiot has joined up two circuits, how is that a problem with ring circuits in general? Someone could just as easily join two radials, or two lighting circuits. If a ring is designed and installed properly then it is a very versatile and useful circuit. What happens years down the line when some fool messes with it isn't a refection on the circuit itself.

I have encountered this problem as well. Each leg of a ring main in a different mcb. Whoever wired the circuit made a mistake. At least with radial circuits this cannot happen.

 

[7029 dave]

Old thread.

 

[Knobhead]

Wonderful, you’ve resurrected a two year old thread to tell us absolutly nothing useful.

 

[Adam W]

It might be old but it's still relevant and one of those discussions that comes up time and again, like exporting an earth to an outbuilding.

 

[Knobhead]

Comes up now and again? It’s so repetitive even Epsom Salts won’t help it.

 

[driverman]

Re wrong connections like above...........been going for years..........With just the old 4 way Wylex fuse boxes, with 1 x cooker 1 x ring 1 x imm/htr 1 x light circuits, many electricians would connect one leg of the ring with the IMM/HTR circuit and the other leg of the ring would then be on its own 15amp fuse...........so nothing new! lol