EICR report and £900 remedial work - seems fair?

[josey1978]

Hello, I felt hot sockets in my house.

I called an electrician who said the fuse board was dangerous - just by looking at it. Horrified was the word used. He carried out testing and did some other work.

£120 for the report
£140 for bonding to gas and water services
£80 for T&E cable to front of house
£50 for T&E cable to back of house
£460 for new fuse board
£165 for 3 twin sockets in kitchen

Another report was done a few months earlier and it was satisfactory.

Any comments on this report please?

Thanks.

 

[littlespark]

I think the electrician has been a little harsh.

With what he's written, it seem "satisfactory" to me, but with recommended improvements noted. (such as lack of cpc or rcd)
However, I would say that these jobs need done on safety reasons, and i dont think the price is too far off course.

Hes charging for bonding the gas and water, but in part 9, hes ticked the box that these are already bonded?

BTW. Pictures paint a thousand words. We can advise better if we see a photo of the fusebox. We can then say how "horrified" he should have been.

 

[Dustydazzler]

£460 is pretty reasonable for a board change

Locally to me you are looking at anything from £500-£1000 for a basic board change

 

[SparkyAndGeorge]

4.11 d. Hes put c3 'improvement recommended' for presence of rcd six monthly notice where required but you do not seem to have any RCD's at this time thus not requiring the labels. It should have been an N/A.

 

[fairlight]

It does not look like a well compiled report, the first thing I notice is that there are no ring continuity readings, despite circuit 2 being on a 30a OCPD, if that's not a ring with 2.5/1.5mm conductors that's a code 2.
However a poorly compiled report does not mean that the defects noted are wrong and remedial work suggested is not required, the price quoted does not look unreasonable IMO.

 

[telectrix]

and why has he put N/A for testmeter used when he's done readings. price wise. looks reasonable for the work he's described. as with all works, might be an idea to get a second quote. a few members down in the black country might be interested. thing is, your "fuseboard" was compliant when installed. it won't comply with current regs. that is not to say that it's not fit for continued use, just that a new board with RCD protection is much safer.

 

[MJPD29]

Not a whole lot wrong with the report or the price really

 

[josey1978]

Please see attached photos.

When I called the electrician, he instantly found the problem. He then checked the fuse board which he said was in need of updating and conducted a basic visual check of other sockets and light switches. He was absolutely shocked by what he found and horrified they were not highlighted in the previous report.

I am wondering what was so horrifying?

£460 for a new fuse board is perfectly reasonable, I agree, but I have read elsewhere on here the following advice for not having RCD protection:

'Id have said c3...unless you wanted alterations but even then you could slap in an rcbo to protect the circuit you're altering.'

It would be good to get an idea of whether a fuse board was actually required or should have been a recommendation. Could an RCBO have been fitted based on the information the EICR contains?

 

[westward10]

Those are Type 4 circuit breakers which are not suitable for not only domestic but many installation types. It is doubtful although not impossible the higher rated devices such as 30A are not providing fault protection. I see from your Report he appears to have them as Type 2 assuming they are Roman numerals which is incorrect.

 

[josey1978]

Just to be clear, my issue is not the price of the works done as such - because they seem fair. I just want to be satisfied that the inspector has not been overly strict and is charging me for work that didn't need doing. So should some of the C2's have been C3's and the decision left to me?

Also, should he have been horrified and worried me so much?

That's all
[automerge]1571159559[/automerge]
Should there be a serial number next to the test instruments he used?

Also, how long should have the testing taken? I have a 3 bed house.

 

[westward10]

Looking at the schedule of test results again circuit 2 does not provide fault protection with a Type 4, 30A device. The schedule is incorrect indicating the person carrying out the test lacks suitable experience.

 

[Deleted member 105166]

On page 2, he has got his C2 & C3 definitions the wrong way around.

 

[josey1978]

Thanks for the input everybody.

I think I should change my question, is the report worth the paper it is written on?

 

[HappyHippyDad]

I think his prices seem good.

I would feel uncomfortable bad mouthing an electrician unless I could say it to his face or if it was so bad that I would class it as very dangerous.

He may not have written the prettiest report but at least he's picked up on things that the previous report hadn't found. The consumer unit looks like it needed changing and the cracked socket was certainly a C2.

He may have been over zealous on certain other C2's, but I don't get the impression he was trying to rip you off.

 

[Dustydazzler]

This is the problem when dealing with Ecirs

You get a lot of subjective views and opinions

For me a good eicr will clearly highlight the very most obviously dangerous aspects which need addressing

The rest is very how do I say a matter of opinions

 

[westward10]

My view isn't subjective. He has quoted the protective devices incorrectly hence missing a C2 issue.

 

[telectrix]

OK, the EICR is not perfect, but i can't disagree with his recommendations. that fuseboard is almost as old as me. .best to upgrade now and have the work done in 1 hit.

 

[westward10]

Technical content on an EICR should be correct. Whether his overall view is correct is based solely on the lack of additional rcd protection and no more. Had he had more competence he would have backed this up with the type of protective devices employed.

 

[Dustydazzler]

My view isn't subjective. He has quoted the protective devices incorrectly hence missing a C2 issue.

Indeed and I fully agree

But i have seen reports suggesting a C type breaker as a C2 , and when I queried this with the person who did the report their answer was ‘ I dint like C breakers in domestic’

 

[Zerax]

If you go ahead with it... send him one of the pics from here that shows a very neatly made up board... as an example of what you're expecting...

 

[Flanders]

Did the electrian replace your fuse board or just quote for a new one if he has replaced it you should have an electrical insulation cert

 

[westward10]

Indeed and I fully agree

But i have seen reports suggesting a C type breaker as a C2 , and when I queried this with the person who did the report their answer was ‘ I dint like C breakers in domestic’

Aside from the dreadful presentation of that Report it is a classic example of why a huge percentage of people who carry out EICRs should steer well clear of them.

 

[Flanders]

Yes agree with westward its seams to me that electrians know how to do all the testing and inspection but struggle to understand the forms . On this report they have put N/A in the insulation resistance test for live and live . This should of been tested or Limmed out

 

[josey1978]

All of the work mentioned above has been completed.

Should I just have an electrical certificate or also a minor works certificate?

 

[Flanders]

All of the work mentioned above has been completed.

Should I just have an electrical certificate or also a minor works certificate?

You should have an electrical installation cert. Which will say on what work has been done . For example. Replaced consumer unit . Bonding to gas and water and remedial work carried out to rectify observations on eicr and the work is notifiable the document you have posted is the electrical condition report

 

[happysteve]

Those are Type 4 circuit breakers

(Not doubting you for a second, but) how do you/would you know?

 

[westward10]

Experience I suppose. Square D QO-X mcbs if coloured brown are Type 4 and nothing else. Later white cased ones can be 1, 2, 3, B, or C and are never brown cased. The brown ones would have had it stamped on the front but nine times out of ten it has worn off.

 

[ashrow]

@ happysteve

By experience

 

[josey1978]

Sorry, one mistake above. The original report was also unsatisfactory. There was a C2 for the socket. Nothing else mentioned apart from a recommendation to upgrade the fuse board which I was content to do.

I have emailed the electrician and asked him about some of the things that have been written above and whether he thinks my installation is now safe. I also mentioned the serial number of the test instrument not being recorded properly (it doesn't look like a serial number, more like a model number). I have also emailed him about the socket which is broken and still not replaced even though it was promised by him verbally. I am worried it could deteriorate further.

I have bought this house recently and want it to be as safe as possible. I'm worried that the test recordings may not be correct and also whether the electrician has picked up all existing faults.

His reply to my email was:

Hi Xxxxx
Have a look on niceic website
My company name is
Xxxxx Ltd
We are approved contractor
We do both inspection on domestic and commercial
Never had any issues with insurance, you can phone niceic and ask any questions you want about my company.
Regards


There was no mention of any of the issues I raised. Would it be a good idea to have a totally new EICR carried out by someone competent?

 

[telectrix]

i think that the EICR you have, although not perfect, does highlight the issues you have, and the recommendations appear to be reasonable. i'd go with the guy's quote for remedials, but makes sure you both agree on what works are to be carried out a £---. get this in writing, so you are both on the same page.

 

[josey1978]

Thanks, the work has already been done though

Would using a non-calibrated test instrument invalid this report for all intents and purposes?

How can he prove the machine he used is accurate and whether he tested the new fuse board competently?

 

[telectrix]

you should have received an Electrical Installation Cert.after the work was done. this should have details of his test equipment on it, unlike on the EICR. also, itis a condition of his NICEIC membership that his gear is regularly calibrated. my advice is to talk to him first, querying any issues you are concerned about.

 

[WallaceP]

I think having an honest and direct conversation with the electrician would be more positive than going on an online forum. There is a lot that of variables that is hard to cover on a message board.

 

[Zerax]

I think having an honest and direct conversation with the electrician would be more positive than going on an online forum. There is a lot that of variables that is hard to cover on a message board.

I think the OP is just trying to improve his knowledge and understanding before having the conversation that you suggest and will ultimately happen.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Sorry, one mistake above. The original report was also unsatisfactory. There was a C2 for the socket. Nothing else mentioned apart from a recommendation to upgrade the fuse board which I was content to do.

I have emailed the electrician and asked him about some of the things that have been written above and whether he thinks my installation is now safe. I also mentioned the serial number of the test instrument not being recorded properly (it doesn't look like a serial number, more like a model number). I have also emailed him about the socket which is broken and still not replaced even though it was promised by him verbally. I am worried it could deteriorate further.

I have bought this house recently and want it to be as safe as possible. I'm worried that the test recordings may not be correct and also whether the electrician has picked up all existing faults.

His reply to my email was:

Hi Xxxxx
Have a look on niceic website
My company name is
Xxxxx Ltd
We are approved contractor
We do both inspection on domestic and commercial
Never had any issues with insurance, you can phone niceic and ask any questions you want about my company.
Regards


There was no mention of any of the issues I raised. Would it be a good idea to have a totally new EICR carried out by someone competent?

I think it would be a very good idea to have another EICR carried out Josey. The reason being that you are clearly concerned about the EICR you have now (perhaps rightly so) and will remain concerned until you have an EICR that has been written out more professionally.

You clearly have some electrical knowledge so when choosing the next electrician to carry out the report I would quiz them a little before hand on aspects raised in this thread so you can gauge their competence. I wouldn't mind at all if a customer asked me exactly what they were going to get for there money, I would be happy to discuss it in detail.

Expect to pay a minimum of £150 for a decent report, this is based on a 3 bed semi. I charge £175. You would pay more for a larger house/consumer unit.

Good luck and I hope you manage to get some closure.

PS.. You could always look on this forum for an electrician close to you. I'm not saying that everyone on here will provide a very good service but on average I think you are far more likely to get a good electrician off this site than elsewhere as we are all a bit sad and enjoy discussing our trade and how to constantly improve.