HELP! EICR advice please

[a111an]

I wonder if any electricians can offer some advice? I feel that I may be getting taken for a ride. I rent out a 2 bedroom flat built in 2005 that has just needed an EICR. The letting agents have managed this for me and the report has come back as failed with a draft quote to pass the EICR that consists of a new consumer unit and other bits for £1173.60!

My main concerns in the report are that I have the following C2's.

A) Additional RCD protection is required for circuits supplying outdoor equipment...

The main sockets are on RCD protection, but it's a 3rd floor flat. I can't see why outdoor equipment would be mentioned?

B) Consumer unit is not fire rated...

Looking at the report it is a C2 on the Observations page, but on the Inspection schedule page, it's a C3. Could it be both?

Additionally to the C2's above, they are charging me to fix an open circuit on the earth, would they not have tested all the sockets on the test and fixed them, if required, as they went along?

I have also wondered what 'Replace fixed bathroom fittings' at £154+vat would be, any ideas?.


I have gone back to letting agent to pass my questions and concerns over to the electrical company and they have just responded with the following:

We have reviewed the EICR again and stand by what we have advised, the parts where the LL suggested the work doesn't need doing due to the regs is a really grey area, it depends on the engineer as to whether they would recommend the works or not - and rather we say they do not need work and an issue were to arise, that would leave us liable for not recommending these works be completed.

We might be airing on the side of caution, but we would rather be safe than sorry.

Is this a fair response, and not to answer my questions above? Does the report and draft quote look fair? EICR has already cost me £200.



Thank you for taking the time to read the above.

 

[westward10]

I have deleted the links as they show too many personal details including the testing company. You can repost these but blank out any addresses and personal information.

 

[Flanders]

Sounds like the observation are code 3s. I would as the letting agent electrian to back up their findings with evidence

 

[a111an]

I have deleted the links as they show too many personal details including the testing company. You can repost these but blank out any addresses and personal information.

Report and quote re-attached. Thanks.

 

[westward10]

Unless the schedule is incorrect the consumer unit has an 80A rcd which appears to cover the socket outlet circuits however there are no rcd trip times on the schedule.

 

[ruston]

There are still details of the tester on the General Condition Of The Installation form. Including address.

 

[Strima]

Can you post a picture of your consumer unit showing the circuits, protective devices etc? Also is it located in an escape route or is it in a cupboard etc?

Note to self, I need to put my prices up...

 

[freddo]

Yea it starts off ok on the observation list but, the sockets all appear to have rcd protection but the rcd is not tested for some reason. The c2 items I'd probably put as c3, and remove the rubbish about outdoor circuits. The tick list is a joke though with things ticked that don't seem to be applicable to the installation.

The testing company hasn't been blanked either

 

[freddo]

Note to self, I need to put my prices up...

Lol I was thinking that too.

 

[westward10]

There are still details of the tester on the General Condition Of The Installation form. Including address.

Didn't spot that, gone now.

 

[westward10]

This is a recurring issue, lesson don't let your agent arrange these works.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

The prices for the works seem ok, the codes are questionable. Just pay it and get it done.

 

[Wilko]

Hi - when doing a Report there is no obligation to fix issues, but I certainly would’ve fixed a loose earth wire as part of confirming all terminations are sound. However, if the fault wasn’t there in front of me I would record Further Investigation code and move on.

I have seen where a Report bigs up an issue and then quotes big to fix it. So I would get an independent Electrician to quote for repairs. Many good Electricians here would be happy to help if you need a quote.

Bathroom lights might not be IP rated for use in there, so fair enough if true. A plastic CU in good condition is normally C3.

 

[a111an]

Can you post a picture of your consumer unit showing the circuits, protective devices etc? Also is it located in an escape route or is it in a cupboard etc?

Note to self, I need to put my prices up...

The consumer unit is not in the Hallway as mentioned in the report. It is in a small storage area with a fire door at the front of the property high up near the ceiling. Pictures attached - thanks.

 

[Deleted account]

The consumer unit is not in the Hallway as mentioned in the report. It is in a small storage area with a fire door at the front of the property high up near the ceiling. Pictures attached - thanks.

Sorry th3 pics are not too good and I can’t see the whole board.

 

[westward10]

With the rcd off check to see if all sockets are dead. Use a small appliance like a hair dryer to verify.

 

[westward10]

Sorry th3 pics are not too good and I can’t see the whole board.

It looks dual tariff with split load rcd on the normal side.

 

[a111an]

Sorry th3 pics are not too good and I can’t see the whole board.

Sorry, it's all I have from an old inventory. The RCD circuits are the ones in the centre. Which are for the Kitchen sockets, General Sockets and heaters. It's circuit numbers 6 - 9 in the report.

 

[a111an]

It looks dual tariff with split load rcd on the normal side.

Yes, it's eco7.

 

[Strima]

It would be possible to add RCD protection to circuits if required.

However on the test results sheets there's no mention of RCD tests carried out.

Additional protection for the bathroom would normally attract a C3 if there's supplementary bonding in place. Without seeing the installation I can't comment fully.

Additional protection for outdoor equipment is not applicable as it is a third floor flat, no code.

Consumer unit not fire rated is not even a code, it should be made of non-combustible material however as it is located in a cupboard away from an escape route it would only attract a C3.

Smoke detectors are not part of the installation and shouldn't be coded, they should receive a comment advising they're replaced, they do not fall under BS7671.

They haven't even coded the discontinuous conductor on the ring final circuit yet have quoted for investigation and rectification? At my normal call out rate and hourly charge that's four hours to find a broken CPC in a flat? They're taking the Mickey.

 

[Deleted account]

I’m not a big criticiser of other people reports, but...
C2 for plastic board -wrong Should be C3 or no code.
C2 For out of date smokes - wrong Should be no code. Smokes are not part of our regs. Only the hard wired connections and electrical safety are what we are establishing. Yes it’s worth a mention but that’s all.
C2 for no RCD for circuit passing through room containing bath or shower. wrong unless there is no supplementary bonding present. This was not mentioned therefore we cannot judge.
C2 for sockets that may be used for outdoor equipment. Correct, but as you said it has RCD protection.

something isn’t right with this one. Get a second opinion.

 

[dodger421]

Bathroom lights might not be IP rated for use in there, so fair enough if true. A plastic CU in good condition is normally C3.

Yet suitable IP rating for location gets a big old tick in the schedule of inspections.

As others have said, a number of irregularities between the inspections and test results. Second opinion required I think, or at least ask for quotes from other electricians and supply them with this report.

I understand the letting agents not wanting to get involved, ultimately they don’t want to take on any more liability in the event of a problem.

 

[Deleted account]

I really think there are fully qualified sparks doing EICR’s that don’t know what they are doing. An EICR is totally different to any other certification we are trained to do.
anyone who hasn’t taken the appropriate course should not be doing them and I think they need to be more scrutinised To ensure they are to an appropriate uniformed standard.

We have a problem at the moment in so far as the new laws regarding rental properties and eicrs.
i have to say I absolutely agree with the new laws.

The problem is There are thousands of landlords requiring EICRs now. I have a list of 23 to do before April 1st. I haven’t given any of them a date of completion yet as I am going to do them one at a time and then do there remedial if necessary before going on to the next. This is between all the other jobs I have booked and emergency calls I am getting in.

I am not committing to any more EICRs And have turned down over 5 in last 2 weeks. This means they will use anyone Qualified or not.
In your case a111an I think you have a fully qualified spark, but he hasn’t done an EICR course and there is not requirment to do so.

 

[ipf]

No sign of the supply characteristics, earthing arrangements or particulars at origin, either....might tell a tale or two.

 

[Welchyboy1]

Even if the socket outlets were not rcd protected, surely that’s a C3 if it’s a 3rd floor flat.?

 

[Welchyboy1]

Would be cheaper to start from the beginning and get another electrician in I reckon

 

[dodger421]

No sign of the supply characteristics, earthing arrangements or particulars at origin, either....might tell a tale or two.

I think @westward10 removed that page because it had the inspectors name and signature on it still. It was there earlier.

If I remember rightly it was TN-C-S and the earth electrode boxes were N/A’d obviously, but I’ve just noticed the schedule of inspections has a tick for presence and condition of earth electrode :-S

 

[westward10]

Even if the socket outlets were not rcd protected, surely that’s a C3 if it’s a 3rd floor flat.?

Yes in my opinion although I have seen extension leads from upper floor flats. If all your sockets are on that rcd (check for one on a cooker control unit) that Report is incorrect.

 

[Eric12]

Its rampant this sort of thing, looked at a job last week after client queried an condition report arranged through he's letting agent. Wanted £1200 for new consumer unit. Report was full of holes, even got the circuit numbers wrong. Sad to see a 6mm for the cooker on a 40a and did not even mention that. All it needed was a few mcb's replaced with rcbo's

 

[HappyHippyDad]

So what is the answer? The landlord/lady lives hundreds of miles away so has to trust a third party to manage the property! Very frustrating. I think I would personally try and find a local electrician to carry out another report. However, I would first make sure the electrician is a member of a competent person scheme , has some good reviews on line and also I would show them the certificate and ask there opinion to gauge if they know what they are talking about ( you can compare it to what you have learnt from this thread).

I realise that all sounds like a bit of a pain in the back side but your other choice is to just pay up.