Spur off 32a house socket form garage for 20a supply.

[Johnconnor]

Hi, if getting back to the CU is not an option, instead of spurring off a socket via a Sfs putting the rating down to 13a. Could you spur off the socket and take it down to 20a or 16a instead via a submain to allow for that extra kW if needed. If the cable size was sufficient for the length. For a garage sub main wired in swa. (32a ring circuit). In theory if you had sockets on a 16a rcbo and lights on a 6a then it's under the 27A limit generally a 2.5 can take. Thanks

 

[mainline]

Again that's not in line with OP's proposal of 16A or 20A protection.

You're here in your capacity as an electrician providing advice. What might or might not be okay is of less relevance than what regulations permit.

People often come here and listen only to points which suit their thinking. As such I'm of the opinion that advice to DIY members shouldn't play fast and loose with regulations. On this occasion the OP declined the opportunity to provide any information about experience or qualifications, so should be treated as being entirely without either.

The OP asked a simple question, "Could he achieve a bigger supply to a garage of 16 to 20amps, rather than the 13amp Fcu that he has.

And the answer is : Yes he can
He can do that by simply extending the ring.
So the answer i gave is correct.

 

[mainline]

I know and it was this I challenged. Nothing has yet supported your position that the proposed '16A or 20A spur' is acceptable.

Permanently connected equipment may be connected directly to a ring final circuit using a fused connection unit incorporating a BS 1362 fuse (not exceeding 13 A) or a Type B or C circuit-breaker (not exceeding 16 A) complying with BS EN 60898 or BS EN 61009-1, or BS EN 60947-2. In the case of some existing installations, Type 1, 2 or 3 MCBs complying with BS 3871 may still be encountered.

 

[mainline]

The OP asked if he was "allowed" to take use 16A or 20A protection from an unspecified device to give himself an extra 3kW on a garage supply. The OP stated that their intention was to do so by "spurring" this unspecified protective device off a ring final circuit in place of a fcu. Her went on to clarify that this would supply 16A & 6A RCBOs in the garage.

You responded by stating that "he could".

No I didn't my response was to a later clarified by the OP post, I have now said this a number of times, but you seem to be ignoring it.

 

[nicebutdim]

The OP asked a simple question, "Could he achieve a bigger supply to a garage of 16 to 20amps, rather than the 13amp Fcu that he has.

And the answer is : Yes he can
He can do that by simply extending the ring.
So the answer i gave is correct.

Again we seem to be skipping inconvenient detail.

The OP specifically asked 'is this allowed?" Maybe you thought he was asking if you allowed it, but I think most people would understand the question was specifically about what the Wiring Regulations might make of the proposal.

 

[mainline]

Again we seem to be skipping inconvenient detail.

The OP specifically asked 'is this allowed?" Maybe you thought he was asking if you allowed it, but I think most people would understand the question was specifically about what the Wiring Regulations might make of the proposal.

Extending the ring is allowed.

And so is:
Permanently connected equipment may be connected directly to a ring final circuit using a fused connection unit incorporating a BS 1362 fuse (not exceeding 13 A) or a Type B or C circuit-breaker (not exceeding 16 A) complying with BS EN 60898 or BS EN 61009-1, or BS EN 60947-2. In the case of some existing installations, Type 1, 2 or 3 MCBs complying with BS 3871 may still be encountered.

 

[nicebutdim]

Permanently connected equipment may be connected directly to a ring final circuit using a fused connection unit incorporating a BS 1362 fuse (not exceeding 13 A) or a Type B or C circuit-breaker (not exceeding 16 A) complying with BS EN 60898 or BS EN 61009-1, or BS EN 60947-2. In the case of some existing installations, Type 1, 2 or 3 MCBs complying with BS 3871 may still be encountered.

Leaving to one side any argument over how 'permanently connected equipment' should be defined, as I feel we're going to be of differing opinion on that, your post actually undermines the point you've been trying to defend.

You gave the nod to a "16A or 20A supply" which is at odds with what you've quoted above.

 

[nicebutdim]

No I didn't my response was to a later clarified by the OP post, I have now said this a number of times, but you seem to be ignoring it.

This clarified post or another that no one else can see?

Apologies. My mission is to achieve a bigger supply to a garage of 16 to 20amps, rather than 13a. I'm not trying to achieve anything physically, I just want to know if it's possible, forgetting about what the spec is for the job. Is it allowed?

I'm not going to waste time repeating point which I've already made.

 

[nicebutdim]

Extending the ring is allowed.

OP's proposal never involved extending an RFC.

Don't make stuff up.

 

[mainline]

OP's proposal never involved extending an RFC.

And ?

OP :My mission is to achieve a bigger supply to a garage of 16 to 20amps, rather than 13a. I'm not trying to achieve anything physically, I just want to know if it's possible, forgetting about what the spec is for the job. Is it allowed?

And I said yes you can

This can be done by extending the ring, is this not correct

 

[nicebutdim]

This is the post I challenged, quoted below in its full glorious brevity.

Yes you could

You clearly feel it was an appropriate response to the OP's question or, more specifically, his later clarification.

I'm of a different opinion and no amount of arguing or attempting to change the facts is going to change that.

Feel free to continuing this argument as a solo endeavour as I've nothing more to add in response to you original comment, subsequent attempts at justifcation of it or defelction in various directions from it.

I've stated my case quite clearly. Several times.

 

[mainline]

This is the post I challenged, quoted below in its full glorious brevity.



You clearly feel it was an appropriate response to the OP's question or, more specifically, his later clarification.

I'm of a different opinion and no amount of arguing or attempting to change the facts is going to change that.

Feel free to continuing this argument as a solo endeavour as I've nothing more to add in response to you original comment, subsequent attempts at justifcation of it or defelction in various directions from it.

I've stated my case quite clearly. Several times.

Can you explain why he can't extend the ring to achieve what he wants to do ?

 

[mainline]

Leaving to one side any argument over how 'permanently connected equipment' should be defined, as I feel we're going to be of differing opinion on that, your post actually undermines the point you've been trying to defend.

You gave the nod to a "16A or 20A supply" which is at odds with what you've quoted above.

No, not at all, if he wants more than 16 then extend the ring.

Either way, my response was correct.

 

[nicebutdim]

Can you explain why he can't extend the ring to achieve what he wants to do ?

If you can't then my response to the Op is correct.

There's no reason that I know of why it couldn't be done, but it wasn't part of the proposal to which you initially responded and to which i felt the need to post a challenge.

No, not at all, if he wants more than 16 then extend the ring.

Either way, my response was correct.

Sure thing, bud

I'm done responding to spurious justifications in defence of a careless comment.

 

[Johnconnor]

Cheers guys, enjoyed reading all the responses. I'm an apprentice and it was a conversation that came up at work between two electricians. Basically I just wanted to know who was right. Thanks