Being self employed and the coronavirus

Discuss Being self employed and the coronavirus in the Electricians Chat - Off Topic Chat area at ElectriciansForums.net

HappyHippyDad

HappyHippyDad

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Morning all.

I have had nearly all my jobs cancelled now. Still got a weeks work ahead but then perhaps 1 day a week. I was wondering if anyone new what the government plans are for the self employed with regards finance?

This might be a good thread to add to as new government plans come out.

All I really know if that they are postponing the July tax payment.

I expect I'll continue to get small jobs over the next few months perhaps amounting to a day a week, perhaps emergency jobs only, who knows. Does this mean I'll still be able to get some financial help even though I still have work?

It's all a bit confusing.
 
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At present the financial help is aimed at the employed so whether this is an over sight which will be addressed we will see as the self-employed sector are kicking up a fuss.
 
Luckily I have savings to fall back on so I'm not overly concerned.

As I'm high risk as are two of my girls I've decided to sack work and keep my distance. Working on BT street cabs is grotty at the best of time but the risk of infection is too much for me to keep working.
 
It seems S/E is being looked at.
The issue they've got with payments is they're trying to use existing systems, so amongst other things they know they're paying to genuine people and not scammers, who will of course be out in their thousands.

The U.S plan of sending a cheque for every household for $1500 or so doesn't seem a good idea when all the Millionaires and Billionaires will also get them.
 
I must say @Strima I am in the same boat praise be, we could afford a protracted period without work. I actually do worry about the guys on the forum who are not so lucky and will experience hardship with no work. Indeed the wider community as well. It is worrying but at the same time so many mixed messages that I am not sure which way to jump. So I err on the side of caution. The builders I work with say it's a load of B%%$%%s, which I think is pretty stupid! The expectation seems to be I should work but...why take the risk it is at least for me non essential strictly speaking.
 
Reading up on the govt website doesn't really clarify a self employed position.
It says, "if you are self employed and self isolating"
Well, its only self isolating if you or someone in your family is showing symptoms..and guidelines said to self isolate for 2 weeks until the symptoms passed.
None of us are self isolating. My kids are off school, because its closed to non-critical workers children, my wife runs baby classes and her head office has shut them down and im the self employed.
I am thinking of just stopping all work now, but will I get the universal credit?
 
FatAlan said:
It’s Cummings plan still for the self employed to carry on spreading as he’s all for the herd immunity scenario and is not worried about a few pensioners. Still, good majority voted for this deceiving bunch of criminals so the public gets what the public wants!
Click to expand...

Seems to me the government are handling things pretty well considering. Certainly better than some other countries. And to say they dont care about pensioners dying is pretty unbelievable to be honest.
 
Pack it in!
This is a discussion about Covid-19 and what we can do to support ourselves as work dries up. Not a have-another-go-at-the-government right now chat.

Ive just had the old house job suspending works for the time being, so im really thinking of just stopping myself and staying put in the house. Will I get support financially if I am choosing not to work and not actually "self isolating"
 
Bit harsh @FatAlan....people didn’t vote for this at all no one saw it coming, people voted as to who they felt best represented their views and aspirations of the future, sounds like more sour grapes from the socialist left wingers (or anyone who’s spent they life mollycoddled in state employment) I’m not a fan Particularly of this or any other government but to use this situation as a point scoring political exercise is disgusting...you should be ashamed, I’m very impressed on the whole with how this country has come together and all trying they best in a very bad situation!
 
Back to @happyhippydad 's original post:

I've had some jobs postponed - from older folk, or those with health issues - until it all blows over (so not outright cancelled), but most bookings still want to go ahead.

I've been phoning/emailing folk with bookings coming up, explaining I'm perfectly happy to postpone if they want. Where it's older clients, and the work is elective rather than a safety issue, I've been trying to put them off.

Enquiries are starting to dry up, and I have no problem with that, it's understandable.

I've been taking precautions when in peoples' homes: touching as little as possible (e.g. bannisters etc) and wiping down everything I do touch as I go or just before I leave. I no longer accept kind offers of tea/coffee.

As time goes on and the social pressure and/or "advice" to avoid "unnecessary" contact ramps up, I suspect I'll be doing safety-related works only.

But it worries me that folk will just try to do things themselves. A couple of times in the last week alone, when doing relatively simple jobs I've uncovered dangerous situations, whereby due to existing faults, they're down to one layer of protection (an earth connection) to avoid electrocution. It's about balancing and assessing the risks (shock/fire risk vs inadvertantly passing on a virus that could kill someone) and it's something I'm just going to have to deal with on a case-by-case basis (until the work runs out and I don't have to worry about it anymore).

Stay safe, folks :)
 
Guys... Westward has already deleted political points scoring and I've just had to do the same. Keep it up and I'm sure one of us will close the thread.

Now is not the time or place for political arguments. This is a thread about how we are going to cope and what help/advice etc. is available, so grow the f' up and if you can't contribute to the actual topic, take yourself off to another thread.
 
If you want to discuss the virus or the politics of the situation... start a thread. Please keep this thread on topic! How many more times???

On the topic at hand...

My phone has gone a little quiet but I have got a bunch of quoted work that people are still wanting to do and a couple of bigger jobs one of which definitely needs doing (rewire for a couple who were supposed to be moving in this weekend). After that, I'm not sure what's happening. I'd like to hibernate but financially I just can't.

I've gradually been ramping up the protection and am now wiping everything down, wearing glove, glasses or goggles to stop me touching my eyes, respirator.

It's scary times and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't really worried as there is a real possibility my hard work on building up my business could disappear down the pan.
 
Now is not the time or place for political arguments. This is a thread about how we are going to cope and what help/advice etc. is available, so grow the f' up and if you can't contribute to the actual topic, take yourself off to another thread.
[/QUOTE]
SC, you deleted my post in reply to a political point made earlier, my post was reasonable and polite, yet you've kept the origional post defending this goverment.
All threads morph into diferent areass, you'd have to delete about 75% of posts in just about every thread if you struk to that rule.
And do you think it's reasonable to tell a forum member to 'grow te f' up'?
 
I'm self employed and work primarily in the entertainment industry so have had a slight headstart on the work vanishing and it's pretty scary to be honest.
Luckily this week we had a job in a local school so I have done a full week's work, but now I'm scratching around for anything I can get.

I hope the government can find a way to help the self employed, I appreciate it is more of a challenge to support us as there aren't normally the systems in place to do so.

The other issue affecting me is that I rent privately, another thing it is very hard to provide government help for. The government know who all of the mortgage companies are and can contact them to arrange help for those with mortgages, there is no easy way for them to contact all of the private landlords or provide help to the tenants.
 
SC, you deleted my post in reply to a political point made earlier, my post was reasonable and polite, yet you've kept the origional post defending this goverment.
All threads morph into diferent areass, you'd have to delete about 75% of posts in just about every thread if you struk to that rule.
And do you think it's reasonable to tell a forum member to 'grow te f' up'?
Click to expand...

We're trying to keep the thread on topic as it's perhaps one of the most important threads of the day given what's going on. I don't think anyone has said you can't discuss the virus or the politics here on the forum, just try and keep this thread for it's intended purpose.

As for the f', sorry not necessarily directed at you personally, but I'm getting more than a little agitated these days by people who are trying to use what is a world wide catastrophe for political points scoring. Lets all just try and stay alive long enough to discuss the politics after the event.
 
Guys, created a new thread about the ethics of working during the outbreak, moving posts over to there. PLease keep this on topic.

New thread is here:-

www.electriciansforums.net

Ethics of working during the corona virus pandemic

The truth of the matter is that unless you are responding to an emergency stay at home and isolate yourself and your family, you should only be leaving your isolation to buy food or to collect essential medication. In an ideal world, I'd love to stay home as I'm sure everyone else would, but...
www.electriciansforums.net www.electriciansforums.net

Please try and keep this thread on topic - i.e. about the help/information that's available for the self employed and small businesses. Thanks
[automerge]1584883041[/automerge]
Thread re-opened now the discussion about the ethics is going in the new thread. Please try and keep this thread for updates/info about the help/information that's available for small businesses and the self-employed.
 
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ruston said:
This may apply to some members who are concerned about mortgages and rent in the short term.
www.gov.uk

Complete ban on evictions and additional protection for renters

Government announces radical package of measures to protect renters and landlords affected by coronavirus.
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk
Click to expand...

Yes, it's not quite as good as it seems though.
They've banned evictions for 3 months, but after 3 months they can evict you if you failed to pay your rent during those 3 months.
They have urged landlords to be lenient and allow tenants to pay the missed rent once the crisis is over. So as work is slowly picking up again after this crisis those of us who rent will need to be earning more than ever to pay back the missed rent.
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I'm sure i'm not the only self employed person who has thought about this, supermarkets etc are on a bit of a recruitment drive, they need staff in all departments at the moment. The income would be enough to keep the wolf from the door,

It makes me wish id taken the opportunity to get an HGV licence a couple of years ago, i'd be happy to spend the next few weeks driving trucks of food around.

I couldn't do a public-facing job, not because I fear catching the disease but because I just don't have the temperament for it.
 
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Well it seems that we'll just have to wait and see if we get any financial help and if the process of getting it becomes more simple and clear.

I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.
 
happyhippydad said:
I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.
Click to expand...

Its a good idea, but as with any plan it has it's issues.
Where does the money come from and does it have to be paid back?
 
I agree £1000 per person would be of a benefit for those that need it, however was that to be a £1000 per household that is another story, how would your average family with let’s say 2-3 children survive on that when you take into account Mortgage/Rent, gas, leccy, water and all the other standard monthly bills, that doesn’t even take into account car/van payments that most people will have especially there self employed
 
These are difficult times, no-one's fault, but a huge shake-up for humanity. I don't know what can be done really, but the fact is the government has certainly tried to help with mortgages and rents and i expect many people will be very glad of that assistance, and I expect more measures will follow. What heartened me yesterday was that the big box at Tesco where folks donate a box of cereal or tins of soup etc for the food banks was overflowing and on asking one of the staff he told me it wasn't just an accumulation but they had had to get the guys to uplift the donations twice as often recently. As for self-employed, like I am, I am retired but not yet of pensionable age so I don't expect any assistance...however, with folks being stuck at home I am very busy doing minor works for loads of people! As I don't usually charge for tiny jobs, my cellar is growing with the bottles i get given, so that's a bonus!
My daughter was offered a new job 2 weeks ago, having been made redundant before Christmas...naturally, as she can be self-employed doing freelance work, she has made a small amount that way, but the new job heralded a big step forward...then last week she got an email saying her new employers couldn't manage to take her on after all, which resulted in the bathroom fitter being put on hold and he has put his tiler and plasterer on hold so none of them have any work for about 2 weeks, with more cancellations coming in daily. The Men's Shed where i volunteer has been closed too...this is sad because we exist to help those who need the company and help of others, so we are in effect failing those we seek to support, but cannot support them in the Shed because many have health issues which require them to be extra careful about contact with others...
and, oddly, my golf course has closed too, which seems daft, but there are some good reasons for this, so instead of golf "spoiling a good walk", I am just going for a walk without my golf clubs, which, to be fair, is less hazardous for those nearby!
Just when I thought things were getting better, here I am STILL supporting my daughter!
On a serious note, being self-employed has a bonus if you are a one-man/woman band, in that you don't have the awful task of laying people off...but if you run a bigger show, it is one of the hardest things to do to tell employees that you have to let them go. Difficult times...
 
Baddegg said:
Bit harsh @FatAlan....people didn’t vote for this at all no one saw it coming, I’m not a fan Particularly of this or any other government but to use this situation as a point scoring political exercise is disgusting...you should be ashamed, I’m very impressed on the whole with how this country has come together and all trying they best in a very bad situation!
Click to expand...
I'm with you, generally but I'm sorry to say all this 'herd' mentality being shown in the supermarkets by panic buying, inconsiderate, selfish, ignorant, common senseless, so called fellow citizens is really pi$$ing me off.
Trying to put work together to help others whilst earning, along with many health workers, daily and then coming across these true artisans of life really takes a great deal of class......from our side at least.
 
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There’s now talk on the news of enforcing a lockdown, I’d like to think if that happens they’d have to sort the issue of self employed people, as much as people would like to comply.,,.kids need feeding bills need paying.....
 
I am currently on a Ferry coming back from Spain doing the last Calais to Dover crossing leg.
I have flown out to Alicante and drove back with my mum who has been struggling.
Both Spain and France are deserted totally and utterly. This is coming our way so plan for the long term. In terms of Gov support, i think if you give citizens advice a few days to absorb the government intentions i would ring their support line. Citizens advice are specialists in UC and benefits in general so ultimately i would trust their advice over either a website or a rep from DWP.
Hope this helps
 
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Just watched the PMs latest news conference, not all of it the kids are here ?....but the question I wanted asked was relevant to this thread in that If Simeon the 1.5 m people list is the sole bread winner AND self employed what are the government proposing?
 
happyhippydad said:
Morning all.

I have had nearly all my jobs cancelled now. Still got a weeks work ahead but then perhaps 1 day a week. I was wondering if anyone new what the government plans are for the self employed with regards finance?

This might be a good thread to add to as new government plans come out.

All I really know if that they are postponing the July tax payment.

I expect I'll continue to get small jobs over the next few months perhaps amounting to a day a week, perhaps emergency jobs only, who knows. Does this mean I'll still be able to get some financial help even though I still have work?

It's all a bit confusing.
Click to expand...
as i understand it you could claim universal credit and would get rent or mortgage support, they will base the uc claim on what you earn not assume a certain income.


I share you worry. I am fortunate to have some savings and have checked my diary and have 5 weeks of work booked in, none should be cancelled unless I get sick myself, all are either me outside in the garden or up scaffolding away from people. got lots of ev chargers to fit and still booking them in.
long term I dont know what will happen, by the sounds of it my work should run out come the peak of this virus in the UK when I will probably want to stay home anyway. I had planned for 2 1/2 weeks off at start of June anyway for a now cancelled holiday so will get the 5.2k back for that once the FCO give the dont travel notice for June. the money will keep me going for a while if I need it,
 
Risteard said:
I believe it is highly likely that you will be compelled to cancel it. It seems highly likely to me that we will be ordered to stop work.
Click to expand...
i did think that, if they enforce a mandatory shut down then yes I would of course cancel.
one is in a workshop installing high bay light fittings, landlord has already paid me for the job and materials.
others are car charger installs in peoples garages or coming off the cut out with henley blocks., one is a full light install in a large garden where i dont need to go in the house as fuse board is in the garage.
Got a few EICRs for empty properties booked in aswell. but as you say it comes down to any mandatory lock down.
I do all the electrical work for a local 40 bed care home, got jobs to do but they are on hold until further notice, I do have to go and sort the emergency lighting outside as its a safety issue but dont need to go inside for that other than to turn the circuit off, which I can do easily enough without touching anything and wearing ppe.
they have agreed they will otherwise only call me in an absolute emergency where it is a safety issue, if not it waits. so its about working sensibly
 
Gavin John Hyde said:
i did think that, if they enforce a mandatory shut down then yes I would of course cancel.
one is in a workshop installing high bay light fittings, landlord has already paid me for the job and materials.
others are car charger installs in peoples garages or coming off the cut out with henley blocks., one is a full light install in a large garden where i dont need to go in the house as fuse board is in the garage.
Got a few EICRs for empty properties booked in aswell. but as you say it comes down to any mandatory lock down.
I do all the electrical work for a local 40 bed care home, got jobs to do but they are on hold until further notice, I do have to go and sort the emergency lighting outside as its a safety issue but dont need to go inside for that other than to turn the circuit off, which I can do easily enough without touching anything and wearing ppe.
they have agreed they will otherwise only call me in an absolute emergency where it is a safety issue, if not it waits. so its about working sensibly
Click to expand...
Hope it works out for you. Couple of bits left to do here but practically nothing's open (in terms of businesses) and I think very few people in terms of domestic customers will want people in. God knows when things will change.
 
Baddegg said:
Bit harsh @FatAlan....people didn’t vote for this at all no one saw it coming, people voted as to who they felt best represented their views and aspirations of the future, sounds like more sour grapes from the socialist left wingers (or anyone who’s spent they life mollycoddled in state employment) I’m not a fan Particularly of this or any other government but to use this situation as a point scoring political exercise is disgusting...you should be ashamed, I’m very impressed on the whole with how this country has come together and all trying they best in a very bad situation!
Click to expand...


NHS workers are employed by the state !! Just pointing that out otherwise agree !
 
Got a carpenter friend who I have been discussing this with. He said he is also worried about work drying up as he's got a 2 year old kid and girlfriend is pregnant.
He said he looked at his insurance policies and doesn't think due to the wording that he would be covered if he got the corona virus as if he did get it and makes a recovery as he would have had the illness for less than 30 days I think it was. it won't pay out as its for long term sick and injury cover and isn't a specified condition.. If he got it and died his family get 25k cash. He said that if work does go really bad then he would be better off having an '' accident '' and have a broken arm or leg as then he gets 5k tax free!
I don't advocate insurance fraud but I can see his thinking in the current climate.. I get a couple grand on mine if I break an arm or leg bone. Certainly makes you wonder how good these insurance policies for I come etc really are.
 
Gavin John Hyde said:
Got a carpenter friend who I have been discussing this with. He said he is also worried about work drying up as he's got a 2 year old kid and girlfriend is pregnant.
He said he looked at his insurance policies and doesn't think due to the wording that he would be covered if he got the corona virus as if he did get it and makes a recovery as he would have had the illness for less than 30 days I think it was. it won't pay out as its for long term sick and injury cover and isn't a specified condition.. If he got it and died his family get 25k cash. He said that if work does go really bad then he would be better off having an '' accident '' and have a broken arm or leg as then he gets 5k tax free!
I don't advocate insurance fraud but I can see his thinking in the current climate.. I get a couple grand on mine if I break an arm or leg bone. Certainly makes you wonder how good these insurance policies for I come etc really are.
Click to expand...
Seemingly pandemics are generally specifically excluded from them, and for those that don't exclude it Covid-19 isn't listed as it's too new. So generally speaking insurance won't cover it.
 
davesparks said:
They've banned evictions for 3 months, but after 3 months they can evict you if you failed to pay your rent during those 3 months.
They have urged landlords to be lenient and allow tenants to pay the missed rent once the crisis is over. So as work is slowly picking up again after this crisis those of us who rent will need to be earning more than ever to pay back the missed rent.
Click to expand...
There is also an issue for landlords that rely on the rent to live...
[automerge]1584919131[/automerge]
happyhippydad said:
I personally think the American idea of £1000 monthly to everyone is a good idea. It's simple to put into place and negates the need to look into everyones financial circumstances which would take ages and cost a fortune, it is also enough for people to live on if they are frugal.
Click to expand...
Don't forget that anyone employed by any government organisation (about 50% of the workforce)... will still get paid regardless... as I suspect will any salaried people... so it affects a relatively small number of people... So why give money to everyone ??
 
Zerax said:
There is also an issue for landlords that rely on the rent to live..
Click to expand...

Yes there is, and those landlords need support too.
But if tenants can't pay their rent then they can't pay their rent, no matter how much a landlord needs the money.
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Zerax said:
Don't forget that anyone employed by any government organisation (about 50% of the workforce)... will still get paid regardless... as I suspect will any salaried people... so it affects a relatively small number of people... So why give money to everyone ??
Click to expand...

Do you have anything to support these figures? 50% of the workforce being employed by a government organisation seems unlikely.
 
davesparks said:
Do you have anything to support these figures? 50% of the workforce being employed by a government organisation seems unlikely.
Click to expand...
It's like late 40s not exactly 50%... don't forget you need to include central government, local government, quangos, police, fire, NHS etc etc... it all adds up.
 
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