Does MY HAMMER encourage cowboys???

[rocker]

Hmmmm just checked the NIC website for his business name and his proper name - nothing at the address given on myhammer, nothing under the postcode and nothing indeed in the city he trades from. Verrrry interesting.

EDIT: Or indeed ELECA or Napit.

 

[Des 56]

Just looked through the thread and had a lok at some jobs on my hammer
This one made me smile


Quote

House is low on earth and has been requested by a company to get an electrician in to check if next door has all the earth going to their house (semi detached house)




I might quote to pinch a bit of next doors,they surely dont need it all

 

[rocker]

Just looked through the thread and had a lok at some jobs on my hammer
This one made me smile


Quote

House is low on earth and has been requested by a company to get an electrician in to check if next door has all the earth going to their house (semi detached house)




I might quote to pinch a bit of next doors,they surely dont need it all

Ha Des you must live near to me, I saw that one on Saturday morning, how I laughed through the hangover!

'Darling, I'm running a bit low on earth, do you think you could pick me some up down the garden centre'.

 

[arjay]

Made the fatal mistake of thinking it might get me some work never won a job worh a light website operators, were oblivious to my complaimts ,unfortunately money talks and i joe public wants to keep it in his pocket so we cant win.

 

[lloyd1980]

unfortunatly guys this all goes back to, joe bloggs and mrs jones down the road, all domestic customers care about is the figure at the bottom of the estimate - they will always go for the cheapest one as everyone likes to think they have got ' a bargain '
cowboys on this stupid site play on this tendancy , the customer still expects a decent job and assumes they are getting the same re-wire for 800 that they would for paying 2000
you get what you pay for in life

pay peanuts and monkeys will work for you

MY HAMMER illustrates this point

I feel sorry for the people who end up with the shower wired in alarm cable

 

[Des 56]

MY HAMMER illustrates this point

I feel sorry for the people who end up with the shower wired in alarm cable

You saw my job then
I had a bit left on the coil so it seemed sensible to use it up
Just think of the benefits

Light to carry and manhandle
Small slots to lay it in (some stupid peope drill holes)
Minimum damage when chased in or clipped
The white colour goes with the tiles
Able to terminate in a light switch without crushing
Mind you I had to explain off the gkowing effect on the wire as a colour effect to indicate the shower was working( I suppose thats a justifiable excuse considering the other quotes were rip offs)
Can be used on all sizes and makes of shower
Cheap to buy, so the profit margin, along with other lower overheads like minimum tax donations means its a lucrative way of making a living

I also have an astute buisness sense
Other foolish people in this trade buy ready made certificates,now I ask you,why waste hard earned cash to pay for something that the customer doesn't understand or read
I'm overcome with work demand
You just have to be competetive thats all

 

[lloyd1980]

think theres a few of these everywhere

prob a few on this forum too its sad to say, lurking in the shadows, never posting, always reading and picking up tips and then ****ing things up for the customer in a good ol ' cash and dash '

 

[johnah]

Having read the quotes made on this topic I agree with the rogue trader part and how they possibly can be making a living out of the so low price jobs. But surely the main concern would be how low the agencies are asking "Electricians" to work on sites in London never mind in the "North" for less than the JIB and being paid CIS without any holiday pay etc.
900 for 7 days in 2010 compared to 1300 in 2005 for the same 70 hours [Olympics - Wembley] is a disgrace and proof of how far we have slipped.
You then throw in the con of the part P, a load of money making regulations and you can see why people are under cutting like mad and are willing to travel 70miles to earn a 100 pound for a days work. It's a lot better then working with bluffers on site for 9 1/2 hours for agencies who are making more money out of you than the 6% My hammer is. Even the JIB rate is laughable but exceptable if a firm pays all the benefits. [Not many left].
It is the "race to the bottom" for Electricians and all the construction sector until we all stand together in the country then nothing is going to change.

 

[lloyd1980]

JOHNAH

Nothing is ever going to change, even by standing together do you really feel it will make any difference?
what do sparks do? refuse a job when they have bills and wife and kids to pay for - purley to make a moral stand againsed agencies and the low pay?

look at the fuel blockades a few years ago - It ground the country to a halt, the government reduced fuel duty by 2p everyone backed down and then it got reinstated, now look at the cost of fuel!!!

the only way wages and rates will rise is when demand out strips supply, in that there are more jobs than people to do them, this wont happen for a long time yet due to the climate and confidence

the eastern europeans are not helping matters working / living on site for a bag of chips at the end of the week but this is what we face

we all just have to get our heads down suck it up and it will get better eventually.

just a matter of time

 

[jasperhound]

I am at my wits end with MyHammer.... They are, in my opinion, a total shambles and a cowboy outfit themselves. JUST POSTED THIS ON 'moneysavingexpert.com' FORUM: As a tradesupplier on the MyHammer platform, I have 2 concerns, one from a consumers point and one as a user of MyHammer. From a consumers perspective I am very concerned at how easy it is for any tom, dick or harry to quote on a customers job requirements. I continually see jobs being awarded to so called trades persons for figures I would lose money on, let alone break even. As a qualified NICEIC registered electrician there are stringent rules & regulations that have to be met including Part P & Building Regs notification for most jobs apart from minor works. Work in Kitchens & Bathrooms almost certainly require Building control notification and this can be a minimum of £200 for starters unless your Electrician/Installer is a member of a government approved body such as NICEIC, Electra, Napit etc. Safety is surely being compromised by allowing non qualified persons to quote on jobs involving electricity & water, in installing a shower for example. I have voiced my concerns to MyHammer, but they fail to respond. Be very vigilant if using MyHammer as there seems to be no safeguard in allowing the Cowboys of this world to thrive on this type of platform. *****To Trades people considering signing up to MyHammer***** Having signed up to a 3 month trial I have had nothing but headaches. If you have problems with MyHammer you may find that trying to get things resolved will cost you money in phone calls, time wasted in emails, loss of possible earnings through quotes being placed & questions asked, being deleted from your account as they continually place restrictions on it. Due to what I can see as total incompetence, they are failing to bring my account up to date. They are continually placing restrictions on my account due to what they claim is an unpaid Invoice that has been paid via transfer to their account, at their request, due to problems with their accounting system. Then, when they acknowledge its been paid they lift the restriction but within a day or two the restriction is back on again. This has now happened at least 8 times! I have sent over 10 emails, telephoned (0871) over a dozen times, & written to the CEO with no response to this issue. The operation is based in Germany & you speak to German girls when you phone who would not put me through to their accounts department nor let me speak to supervisors if indeed they exist. I have now hit a brick wall and when seeking advise from 'Consumer Direct' have been told that taking action against a German Company may be difficult to accomplish. Never have I dealt with such incompetency, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!! p.s. I have a further issue with them now that I won't go into, but, once again they have failed to respond to my emails.

 

[Colonel Hathi]

I have a problem with these people.
I signed up to a 3 month "Try Package".
The 3 months has expired and they are still sending notifications and invoices.
They claim that because I didn't cancel the trial period in writing, I have by default agreed to a 12 month contract!!!

I only quoted for one job during the trial (unsuccessfully) and have never used them since.

They cannot produce a copy of any contract - but say that I must have clicked on something in their website to agree to their general terms and conditions.

I have no intention of paying.
Has anybody else had this problem?
How did it work out in the end?

I have also had the same problem as other posters with completely unrealistic quotes being put up and with the very poor English of the call centre.
I actually asked to speak to a supervisor today but was told this is not possible as she does not speak English!!!

By the way the problem with tradesmen listed with just "City and Guilds" being listed as qualifications is again probably My Hammer's fault. I twice sent mine through (17th Edition, 2392, DISQ, 2377, Part P) but the site just states "C+G" three times. I tried to tackle this on the phone with them - but they are hopeless!

Thanks for any advice on dealing with the contract issue.

CH

 

[jasperhound]

I am now in the process of making a European Union Cross-Border Claim, the equivalent of a UK County Court Claim against this joke of an organization.
Its not the most straight forward of things to do but this company needs to be brought to account for its utter incompetence and appalling customer service.

I am considering writing to Watchdog and if more disgruntled customers do the same maybe our case will be taken up and MyHammer exposed on a national level.

 

[lloyd1980]

i am so pleased that Im not alone in hating MY HAMMER, and I wasnt unlucky enough to sign up, although I did consider it, I thought better of it when saqw the prices being quoted, although even though im not a member they still blanket my inbox with these stupid jobs, all 160 miles away in bilaricay or devon
Im really going to devon from chester to look at a broken switch

 

[arjay]

I am with you guys all the way i myself am involved in the same argument with them have threatened them with the press ,MP's trading standards but have stopped short of the missus no one deserves that !!!!

 

[jasperhound]

SENT THIS TO CHANNEL 5 TV TODAY AS (if you didn't know) MYHAMMER SPONSOR THEIR PROGRAMME... wait for it... COWBOY BUILDERS....HOW IRONIC IS THAT! :

I am concerned at how your TV program COWBOY BUILDERS is sponsored by MyHammer.
This site as with others of its like are a breeding ground for potential Cowboy Builders and the like due to the fact that anybody can quote on potential jobs posted by unsuspecting joe public.

Consumers, ( I suspect in these tough times trying to get a cheap deal) are awarding contracts to so called trades persons on quotes that are totally unrealistic and could only be achieved by serious compromises and cutting of corners which is frightening especially when dealing with electricity for example.
In my opinion, jobs are clearly being undertaken and completed by unskilled trades persons, possibly illegally, and I fear it won't be long before somebody is seriously harmed by employing a Cowboy through MyHammer.

Having seen the MyHammer sponsorship advert on your channel, I took on a 3 month trial with MyHammer which has resulted in an ongoing display of utter incompetence, ignorance and appalling customer service resulting in me starting proceedings to issue a European Union Cross-Border Claim, the equivalent of a UK County Court Claim against this company. I am not the only one to suffer as you will find if you search various forums. I have also voiced my concerns to MyHammer about unskilled people quoting for jobs but they fail to respond.

I would suggest that you visit trade forums to see for yourself what the professional, registered Trades People have to say about MyHammer.

Before associating yourself with certain sponsors would it not be worth delving deeper into their operations to at least protect your viewers from employing a possible Cowboy and appearing on your next series?, as well as professionals such as myself getting involved with MyHammer.... More like MY HEADACHE!

 

[lloyd1980]

nice mate, most people couldnt be bothered with the hassle but good on ya, money talks tho. and if MY SPANNER has stumped up 1000,s in advertising fees to channel 5 then they will prob not ask may questions

it is very very ironic that the program sponsored is COWBOY BUILDERS

 

[rocker]

Yea, well done. I think Lloyd's right though, I remember we sent letters to C5 before, specifically about the Cowboy Builders program, and while some of the 'electrical expert' scenes that were factually balls were pulled from the repeats, someone on here got a narky email from them more-or-less saying we don't know what we're on about.

 

[wh666-666]

Nothing is ever going to change, even by standing together do you really feel it will make any difference?

what do sparks do? refuse a job when they have bills and wife and kids to pay for - purley to make a moral stand againsed agencies and the low pay?

we all just have to get our heads down suck it up and it will get better eventually.

just a matter of time

I agree entirely with this sentiment, so much so it's changed me from a lurker here to a poster. I know an electrician a couple of streets away who used to work for a company but got made redundant over a year ago. However he needed to get his 17th edition ASAP to continue on his own but still hasnt.

He has been offered other work at £40 per day labour working within a team, but refuses work that he feels is "beneath him". If you cant earn £20 per hour anymore, suck it up and be prepared to earn only £7 if you cant find anything better. I know a lot of people with the same story, going from high earning salaries with a refusal to drop down in wages. Food and the mortgage paid is the most essential thing.

Lets just feel sorry for the poor sod who got an £ 800 rewire.
my guess would be new facias and a new board is all they got

Maybe, maybe not. I dont mean to make myself unpopular on my first post.

Myhammer may be full of cowboys, personally I dont know as I never use the service. If the customer is unknowledgable, the may just end up with new faceplates and board. However you run the risk with shabby work from those that quote the highest as well. I usually find price has no bearing on quality or integrity of a tradesman.

However a three storey rewire for £800 is entirely possible and even very profitable, although the margins are very tight and it requires proper quoting rather than picking a price out of the sky. Pricing up my own three storey home (well two storey + loft conversion), the materials for 3 + sockets per room in white works out at just over £400, in chrome somewhere between £500-£600.

For the sake of argument, lets call it £500 for materials, while betting they wont bother with too many outlets in each room. With £300 left you could work for two days (12 hr shifts solid) which would work out at £12.50p/h, right on the ball park with what a lot of sparks earn. With this being the case, how can some sparks justify quotes exceeding £2k?

To make it more profitable still, hire yourself a Electricians Mate. Leave them doing the lousy tiring work, such as channelling out walls and clearing up the mess at £5p/h or less, while you go round and do more work. You can leave them there while you go doing PAT work nearby for example. This reduces your working hours and increases you wages significantly, even after giving him a tool allowance.

outside lights new radial for boiler and new spot lights £ 110 inc VAT

this is rediculous

I will completely agree with you all here, this is a stupid quote. I havnt checked recent prices on lighting/etc but materials should be close to £100, Vat will suck up £20 ish, so where is the profit or allowance even for a couple of hours work?

Some clown quoted 200 quid. So I emailed him to ask what type of CU he would use and if it'd be certificated. He tells me he only fits Hager CUs and he'll fully certify it.

Now, can someone please tell me how this guy makes any money?

He probably doesnt make much. He may only make £20. However at least he can feed his children for half a week. In ultra competitive areas, many may not have the choice.

 

[mogga]

WH 666-666 Iv just got to wire my m8s shed (ok big massive shed) 6sockets drum o 2.5 3 floury fittings a 3 way cu 2 out door sockets and a 10mm swa how huch should I charge to make £20 to cover my petrol??

 

[wh666-666]

WH 666-666 Iv just got to wire my m8s shed (ok big massive shed) 6sockets drum o 2.5 3 floury fittings a 3 way cu 2 out door sockets and a 10mm swa how huch should I charge to make £20 to cover my petrol??

As I said before on the final quoted example in my post, Im unsure of todays market rates for the lighting example but I AGREED that seemed like a stupidly low quote.

However my example with a rewire still stands. You can rewire a house even buying materials from places like screwfix, charge 12.50 p/h over 2 x 12hr shifts for £800. The time will vary on how much wall you're going to be channelling out.



I appreciate you have expenses to cover, dont we all? Insurance, liability, replacement tools, etc. However if after materials and expenses, all you make on a job is £20 profit you either have the choice of quoting more, or taking whatever profit you can.

It depends how competitive quoting is in your area and how much you really like eating?


However if you're asking seriously how much you should charge for such a job I would personally say anywhere from £500 - £2k presuming the installation will be on its own separate fused board, wired back to the home network. It really depends on how much digging you're going to have to do and what you will have to dig through to lay cable from the house to the massive shed?

 

[pennywise]

A three storey rewire fully chased new fuse box bonding etc £800 the quote must have been submitted in the 1970s LOL. A plasterer could make that setting and finishing a hallway round London within the M25, comparatively I know which one would be more labour intensive . Slogging your guts out for that isn't worth it, thats £800 if the job goes perfectly to plan no hickups etc, thats why you would charge between 2k-3.5k for two guys minimum and more if occupied because your alowing for the risk that things will go wrong and at the end of the day a real business couldn't charge any less as they would be going under within a month. You've lost money the moment you pick up a driver, £800

 

[Des 56]

I live in an area where most people dont have 2 pennies to rub together
Quoting 800 for the most basic of rewires would be unrealistic even here
I, by the way have always been accused over many years of being silly with low prices

You mentioned overheads and said that at a basic hourly rate, they would be covered

One of the points about the critisism of my hammer has been that a tradesman with genuine overheads to make himself a legally operating individual,that individual would not be able to remain "legal" with the unrealistic prices
He may start off being so ,but eventually he would become forced to operate under the rader

Whichever way its looked at,the conclusion must be that
a,they are working illegally,no tax no necessary overheads or
b, they are rouges or cowboys who are operating in a sector where they have no right to do so

The firm must be doing well to be so well known
They therefore in my opinion have a duty to ensure that customers are aware of any shortcomings of the listed tradesmen on its site

 

[scotsparky]

my parents need a rewire may stick an ad on see what happens and then keep a very close watch as well as handing them the full specs after contract has been sighned.

 

[devon1]

I know an electrician a couple of streets away who used to work for a company but got made redundant over a year ago. However he needed to get his 17th edition ASAP to continue on his own but still hasnt.

He has been offered other work at £40 per day labour working within a team, but refuses work that he feels is "beneath him". If you cant earn £20 per hour anymore, suck it up and be prepared to earn only £7 if you cant find anything better. I know a lot of people with the same story, going from high earning salaries with a refusal to drop down in wages. Food and the mortgage paid is the most essential thing.
.

Now that there is hardly any work around has anyone heard of sparks offering their services to agencies for reduced rates?
for example if a job is advertised at £13 per hour and a spark is desperate to get it. Would agencies accept a spark who offered his service at £11 per hour just to get the job? Have you heard of this legal activity? does it happen?

 

[wattsup]

Please tell me where you can get a mate doing the lousy work at £5 per hour? channelling out, knocking socket boxes in...no chance whatsoever...if they do you will also need to employ a full time plasterer

 

[wattsup]

I couldn't rewire a tent for 800

 

[wattsup]

I once worked at barrow in furniss, rewiring sub-marines, anyhow while chopping a socket box out, the boat sunk

 

[arjay]

I am thinking this subject will go on and on i am still locked in a one sided battle with myhammer as they are unwilling to answer any legitimate questions i pose ,i am starting to think communicating with the afterlife would be easier, maybe as a German setup they should stick to what they know because they appear to have no idea as to how this country operates! I must also say in the defence of similar websites that at the same time as trying myhammer i joined Rated people and have had no issues with them at all ,Their customer service is very good and as i pointed this out to myhammer i suppose i won't get much joy from them but tactics are getting dirty now they seem immune to any thing coming back with the same automatic reply last time promising a response within two days that was on the 9th of June and i am still waiting i wont hold my breath as if i do you will have more chance of getting hold of me tham myhammer

 

[lloyd1980]

wait till sunday and see it as england V MY HAMMER
vee vill knock ze germans oot
ya vol
dankershan

 

[lloyd1980]

spreken ze deuch?

I dont think so - full english please