Double Two Way Switch Wiring Advice Please

[chris301up]

Right. My Son wanted me to change his light switches which generally isn't too much of an issue, until I came to replace the double rocker double two way switch at the bottom of the stairs. Just to clarify, one switch is for the stairs, and one for the lounge lighting. Both of which are two way circuits.

I have replaced these switches previously without too much of a problem but this one has me a little baffled.

If you look at the photos I have attached you will see the current wiring layout, but this is totally different to the new switch configuration. I was just expecting to see two sets of three wires plus earth for each switch, but no! Perhaps someone may be able to point me in the right direction?

Sorry about the photos/ For some reason they won't show in the correct orientation but I'm sure they will clearly show my conundrum?

 

[Charlie_]

L1 to L
L2 to L1
L3 to l2

 

[Dustydazzler]

As above

 

[DT1991]

So much easier to help when the cables are not removed from the old switch!

 

[ipf]

I'm baffled...…..why you're baffled

 

[freddo]

Don't forget to earth the front plate!

 

[chris301up]

Am I correct in saying that the layout for one switch on the old unit is inverted in relation to the new replacement switch?

 

[chris301up]

Don't forget to earth the front plate!

Yes. I always earth metal front panels and the knock out box as a matter of course.

 

[freddo]

Am I correct in saying that the layout for one switch on the old unit is inverted in relation to the new replacement switch?

Yes.

 

[chris301up]

I just wanted to be absolutely sure. Thanks

 

[Charlie_]

If you find that the 1 of the switches is upside down then swap over L1 & L2

 

[hasel5]

why replace a good old switch with a piece of crap?

 

[telectrix]

why replace a good old switch with a piece of crap?

because it's shiny and matches the kitchen cupboards.

 

[Charlie_]

why replace a good old switch with a piece of crap?

Hmm, I don’t know.. why?

 

[chris301up]

why replace a good old switch with a piece of crap?

Because the plastic ones are crap, and since they were installed in 1970. I think it's about time for a bit of modernisation.

 

[freddo]

1970?!

 

[chris301up]

1970?!

Yes. Thats when the house was modernised

 

[Charlie_]

I will go for approx 1990

 

[ruston]

I will go for approx 1990

Looks like you get the lollipop.
BS 3676-1:1989 - Switches for household and similar fixed electrical installations. Specification for general requirements - https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail/?pid=000000000030008491

 

[MJPD29]

The one you are taking off will more than likely outlive the one yo h are now fitting. So many new sockets/switches are such poor quality

 

[chris301up]

I will go for approx 1990

My Father owned three properties, including this one, and I remember them all being modernised in 1970/71. Prior to this they all had the old 'brew houses'. All three properties had these types of switches fitted. I know this has I lived in the house next door at the time.

 

[Charlie_]

Was he a time traveler?

Ooh that’s just reminded me of a joke

 

[Jim_e_Jib]

Looks like you get the lollipop.
BS 3676-1:1989 - Switches for household and similar fixed electrical installations. Specification for general requirements - https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail/?pid=000000000030008491

Or the OP could get the lolipop?

BS 3676:1963 - Specification for switches for domestic and similar purposes (for fixed or portable mounting) - https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail/?pid=000000000010068282

 

[ruston]

Or the OP could get the lolipop?

BS 3676:1963 - Specification for switches for domestic and similar purposes (for fixed or portable mounting) - https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail/?pid=000000000010068282

Lol I missed that , I will have to go to bed earlier.

 

[Charlie_]

Yes but if that was a 1970 2 way switch it would have been wired in singles and strappers?

 

[Jim_e_Jib]

Yes but if that was a 1970 2 way switch it would have been wired in singles and strappers?

Perhaps on the IOM but not on the forward thinking Mainland...?! ;-)

 

[Charlie_]

Perhaps on the IOM but not on the forward thinking Mainland...?! ;-)

That could well be the case..
We still have steam trains, electric trams and horse trams as our main modes of transport

 

[DT1991]

You got channel 5 yet?

 

[Taylortwocities]

If you find that the 1 of the switches is upside down then swap over L1 & L2

How could it even matter? Both circuits are two-way, so the switch on/off orientation will depend on the position of the other switch(es)!

 

[Charlie_]

How could it even matter? Both circuits are two-way, so the switch on/off orientation will depend on the position of the other switch(es)!

Don’t shout!
It does matter.. Think about it!

 

[rsgaz]

How could it even matter?

Taylor, are you saying you'd be happy if you had two switches in different orientations, but the lamp was off?

Burn the witch!!! ↑↑↑↑↑

 

[Charlie_]

You got channel 5 yet?

You telling me there is a fourth one?

 

[Taylortwocities]

Taylor, are you saying you'd be happy if you had two switches in different orientations, but the lamp was off?

Burn the witch!!! ↑↑↑↑↑

I have thought about it.

Start off with the lights off and all the switches in the up position.
Go to the upstairs switch and move the switch down. The light comes on, but the switch downstairs is still in the up position (nominated as off). This is all fine and dandy until you have two 2-gang switches. Then the up is off convention falls apart as what the light does is dictated by the position of one or other of the other switches. Even more fun if there's a third (intermediate) switch. Waddayagonnadothen, brainbox?

 

[rsgaz]

Waddayagonnadothen, brainbox?

Doesn't matter if there's 7 switches for one lamp, when they're all in the off position, the lamp should be off.

 

[Jim_e_Jib]

You got channel 5 yet?

Those Manx-onians don't care-they're all too busy riding the fast motorbikes, sailing the yachts and flying the helicopters they bought with the tax they saved!

 

[Charlie_]

I have thought about it.

Start off with the lights off and all the switches in the up position.
Go to the upstairs switch and move the switch down. The light comes on, but the switch downstairs is still in the up position (nominated as off). This is all fine and dandy until you have two 2-gang switches. Then the up is off convention falls apart as what the light does is dictated by the position of one or other of the other switches. Even more fun if there's a third (intermediate) switch. Waddayagonnadothen, brainbox?

It doesn’t take brains
Now you’re overthinking it
Just swap strappers over as I 1st suggested if one of the switches ends up the wrong way round

 

[Charlie_]

Those Manx-onians don't care-they're all too busy riding the fast motorbikes, sailing the yachts and flying the helicopters they bought with the tax they saved!

And riding very fast too on our roads with no speed limits

 

[telectrix]

And riding very fast too on our roads with no speed limits

there's a valid reason for that. all roads are close to the sea. ride/drive too fast, you go splash. IOM population control active.

 

[ruston]

That could well be the case..
We still have steam trains, electric trams and horse trams as our main modes of transport

We had electric trolley buses in Newcastle when I was a boy . I wonder if if electric transport will ever catch on...

 

[Charlie_]

A few years ago I got the chance to see one of the Mercury arc rectifiers in operation, it was a sight to behold