EICR, no 3A fuse for a fan

[callumald]

Just wanted to get some thoughts from other electricians who regularly do EICRS, does anyone else code a fan isolater with no 3A fuse protection?

 

[littlespark]

It depends if the fan's instruction manual asked for it in the first place. Some do, some don't.

The lighting 6A breaker will trip well before a 3A fuse will blow anyway

 

[Pretty Mouth]

The lighting 6A breaker will trip well before a 3A fuse will blow anyway

Other way round. For any given overcurrent, a 3A BS1362 fuse has a faster operating time than a 6A BS60898 breaker.

 

[westward10]

The 3A fuse is actually for fire protection.

 

[James]

The 3A fuse is actually for fire protection.

wow, that is what they recommend to prevent overheating due to a stalled motor?
or have I mis understood?

 

[pc1966]

wow, that is what they recommend to prevent overheating due to a stalled motor?
or have I mis understood?

Indeed, the motor windings are far thinner than 3A fuse wire.

I do wonder what they do in the EU where they don't have 3A fuses as part of typical fixed wiring?

 

[brianmoooore]

My only comment on this thread is that there was a fire in a new build near me, a few years ago, that originated in the bathroom fan. Stalled motor and no 3A fuse in the feed was reported to be the cause.

 

[pc1966]

My only comment on this thread is that there was a fire in a new build near me, a few years ago, that originated in the bathroom fan. Stalled motor and no 3A fuse in the feed was reported to be the cause.

My suspicion is that is what the insurer's say to get out of paying.

What do they do in the EU where 3A fuses are practically unheard of?

How is the disconnection level of the fuse, say ~6A = 1.3kW, making a big difference to a fire in such a small area, and are there not thermal cutout to protect the motor, etc.

Yes, I know that the MI says "XYZ" ands we should be following it, but equally it would be interesting to see just what the theoretical modelling of a fault is that allows a 3A fuse to save the day but a 6A MCB is able to cause an inferno.

 

[DefyG]

As some do and some dont (to quote littlesparks post#2) and without MI's you could code it - FI!

Personally I wouldn't code it if on a 6A circuit.

 

[ipf]

It depends if the fan's instruction manual asked for it in the first place. Some do, some don't.

The lighting 6A breaker will trip well before a 3A fuse will blow anyway

Doing an EICR, would you expect to see instruction manuals for such equipment, mostly installed years previously.

 

[littlespark]

Doing an EICR, would you expect to see instruction manuals for such equipment, mostly installed years previously.

No, but you could take the model number and google it…..

 

[ipf]

No, but you could take the model number and google it…..

Was he the dog on Magic Roundabout?

 

[timhoward]

In general I'd rather end up with a shorter list of EICR findings that are actually significant than a long list with some of them being more or less irrelevant.
If I code a missing 3A fuse for a fan it could lead to other findings that are much more important being taken less seriously.

 

[cliffed]

Usually the Fan is connected to the lighting supply in a domestic situation & in the bathroom area.
Not seen a switched spur in those situations, which could be awkward to action.
Seems reasonable if required but like I said never seen it done, TBF don’t think I’ve ever coded it or even thought of coding, im looking for the isolation switch only… but may think differently now

 

[Taylortwocities]

looking for the isolation switch only…

How would you code it if there's no isolation switch? Don't remember a reg for that...

 

[James]

Can’t remember, there used to be a reg that said something like
local isolation for mechanical maintenance should be installed for rotating machinery?

 

[Taylortwocities]

Can’t remember, there used to be a reg that said something like
local isolation for mechanical maintenance should be installed for rotating machinery?

Yes, but that’s for stuff like lathes, not a bathroom fan.

 

[brianmoooore]

Bathroom fans need regular maintenance to remove the build up of skin tissue from them, and there are live exposed terminals (often permanently live) while doing so.

 

[cliffed]

How would you code it if there's no isolation switch? Don't remember a reg for that...

Maybe a C3 we always fit a 3/4 Pole isolation switch

 

[Taylortwocities]

Bathroom fans need regular maintenance to remove the build up of skin tissue from them, and there are live exposed terminals (often permanently live) while doing so.

I dont go maintaining/cleaning my fans at night time, so I (radical I know) wander over to the consumer unit and turn off the MCB for the circuit that powers the fan.