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Alternatively circuits layout could be designed appropriately for an individual property.
Discuss Have the rules for ring mains changed over the years? in the Electrical Engineering Chat area at ElectriciansForums.net
I like the cut of your jibBad practice, in my opinion. I wire a downstairs room with the rooms above it. Uses less cable and allows power upstairs and down even if a circuit is out of operation. Tht power may not be in the room you require it, but it won't be far away.
It's not as easy to label the Cu thoughBad practice, in my opinion. I wire a downstairs room with the rooms above it. Uses less cable and allows power upstairs and down even if a circuit is out of operation. Tht power may not be in the room you require it, but it won't be far away.
The circuit protective conductor (CPC) is used to provide protection from electric shock and to allow sufficient current to flow, so the protective devices can trip.Which is correct.
So you think I said insulation. I can see where the confusion lies now. No, that's not it's sole purpose.The circuit protective conductor (CPC) is used to provide protection from electric shock and to allow sufficient current to flow, so the protective devices can trip.
How can you say its sole job is to react when there is a fault in the insulation, when it's obviously not its SOLE job. ?????
You actually said "who's sole purpose is to detect a breach of the dielectric barrier within the run of cable"So you think I said insulation. I can see where the confusion lies now. No, that's not it's sole purpose.
I've done this, but not over two floorsTend to label socket circuits by compass points, such as "sockets E", "sockets N" , etc. If it's a posh house, then "sockets N wing", etc.
For upstairs lights, I usually wire all the bedrooms on one lighting circuit, and landing and any passage lights on another. That way, you either have light in the room or just outside it.Nine times out of ten, if I had the opportunity I would wire lights to each room on each floor on separate circuits, but this was in the day of incandescent bulbs that would trip a MCB when they blew, saved the whole ground floor/first going into darkness.
That's fine, but the CU that needs to be found is usually on the ground floor.For upstairs lights, I usually wire all the bedrooms on one lighting circuit, and landing and any passage lights on another. That way, you either have light in the room or just outside it.
For upstairs lights, I usually wire all the bedrooms on one lighting circuit, and landing and any passage lights on another. That way, you either have light in the room or just outside it.
Dielectrics are classified based on molecular structure and polarisation mechanism. Classifications includes capacitors, transducers, photonic/ferroelectric devices but, yes, the insulation you mention does include a dielectric constant. It certainly forms part of the barrier.You actually said "who's sole purpose is to detect a breach of the dielectric barrier within the run of cable"
Dielectrics are materials that don't allow current to flow. An insulator.
They are not necessary. Neither are radials either.That's fine but i wasn't arguing that RoW uses radials because they can't use rings; more that the fact they don't use them proves they're not needed to install perfectly safe and operational installations. Rings are simply unnecessary.
It is a trade-off. How much more effort in running each circuit back to the CU? How much more cost in the RCBOs (or coming soon for a small premium AFDD for all)?I also think it's preferable to have different rooms or different sections of the home on different breakers. We're encouraged to split between floor levels but imo splitting between sections or rooms is much more preferable.
You have steered away from the point i made about your incorrect statement of a cpc's sole purpose being to detect a breach of the dielectric barrier within the run of a cable.Dielectrics are classified based on molecular structure and polarisation mechanism. Classifications includes capacitors, transducers, photonic/ferroelectric devices but, yes, the insulation you mention does include a dielectric constant. It certainly forms part of the barrier.
I believe you misunderstood and still misunderstand the point so we'll agree to disagree and move on.You have steered away from the point i made about your incorrect statement of a cpc's sole purpose being to detect a breach of the dielectric barrier within the run of a cable.
I like to learn so if you could explain what you meant when you saidI believe you misunderstood and still misunderstand the point so we'll agree to disagree and move on.
Maybe some people are, but not everyone.And that's the problem - even those with qualifications to design installations are still stuck on this idea that all power has to be on rings.
Wow, you have obviously had a very limited experience of installations in the UK.I've never been on a site in the UK where a radial has been used for power outlets, it's always rings.
I've been on site since i left school in the early 2000's.Wow, you have obviously had a very limited experience of installations in the UK.
I think there are very few installations I've worked on where there hasn't been at least one socket radial.
Adding an insulated layer to a dead conductor who's sole purpose is to detect a breach of the dielectric barrier within the run of cable is nonsensical from a safety perspective let alone an additional increased cost. Hence, there is a very good reason why we do not sleeve the CPC throughout the entire cable.
I've obviously seen radials but they are the odd one out of a thousand - my point was (put badly, yes) that the design choice for the main power is always a ring.
When designers are putting 2 sockets on ring finals, when said sockets are literally going to be used to run nothing but a hoover now and again, i question the competency of the designer.
Undoubtedly that is lazy design but I wouldn't call someone's competence into question over it!
If its a large installation then that kind of lazy design work may be a result of over-reliance on software for design.
It could also be a general spec put in place by someone higher up that makes it more cost effective to install a ring.
The same logic can be applied to parallel feeds. They are not necessary but if you have every had the misfortune to try and wrangle cable like 120mm and above you would be cursing the designer for not use two that are not quite so " anaconda on ------" to deal with.
Those UK electricians with OCD would love the French staggered RCD and MCB's connected together with a staggered busbar, it is very neat, even vertical bus bars to connect RCD's above each other in different rows.
Reply to Have the rules for ring mains changed over the years? in the Electrical Engineering Chat area at ElectriciansForums.net