Like for like replacement of fire alarm components

[Mike Johnson]

Then we are getting into the realms of legislating for everything, it would be a very sad world if we get back to the "have you got a ticket to do that" era.

 

[Lister1987]

Thank you for all the prompt replies. It's given me a few useful points to consider.

I might not have explained the situation very well in my first post.

Although we call our maintenanc staff technicians, handymen might be more accurate.
Their 'competence' is based on previous experience and on the job assessments by their supervisor rather than formal qualifications.
Currently they are only allowed carry out simple task such as replacing the glass elements in call points, blowing dust out of smoke heads etc. (And like for like on our standard electrical installations)

Recently the hold open magnet of an automatic fire door needed replacing at quite considerable cost and I've been asked why we are unable to do this work type of work in house. On the face of it I can seen the companies point, a like for like replacement of basic components should in theory be quite a simple task and because of the nature of reactive maintenance we often have slack hours in our facilities team.

My concern is how to prove the work has been carried out correctly and where to find suitable training material for our existing staff.
Of course if there is a regulation prohibiting anyone unqualified from carrying out this type of work, I can give the company a very straight forward answer.

Any opinions on this would be greatly appreciated.

The Fire Regulatory Reform Order (FRRO) is a good starting point for knowing what you must do. LFB have a guide to it; The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 - Fire safety law - https://www.london-fire.gov.uk/safety/the-workplace/fire-safety-law-explained/

Suitable training materials at the very least would be a copy of the FRRO and a copy of 5839-1 at least. The FIA do training courses for various people, theyve got courses aimed at all levels.

 

[Lister1987]

Then we are getting into the realms of legislating for everything, it would be a very sad world if we get back to the "have you got a ticket to do that" era.

I wouldn't call that a bad thing, especially when you're talking electricity and life safety systems. Any idiot can put up a smoke alarm, it takes an educated person to know there where to put it, why it goes there, how putting elsewhere will affect performance and so on, and as the smallest mistake can have catastrophic consequences, it makes sense to be very rigorous about it.

 

[loz2754]

Then we are getting into the realms of legislating for everything, it would be a very sad world if we get back to the "have you got a ticket to do that" era.

I get what you're saying Mike. The line has to be drawn somewhere though, between unskilled operatives carrying out routine replacements, and relying solely on a maintenance contractor that specialises in the particular system in question.
I for one would err on the side of protection of life and property.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Lister1987 your obviously young and have not lived through the era I am referring too, during that time no one was allowed to change a plug if they where not an electrician, it got totally out of hand and it would all start up again with one piece of nonsense reporting about what someone perceives as a major safety issue.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I get what you're saying Mike. The line has to be drawn somewhere though, between unskilled operatives carrying out routine replacements, and relying solely on a maintenance contractor that specialises in the particular system in question.
I for one would err on the side of protection of life and property.

Of course safety, the protection of life and property is important, but as you say the line has to be drawn somewhere, who should we trust to draw that line, IMO it should be an independent arbiter, does one exist already?

 

[loz2754]

Of course safety, the protection of life and property is important, but as you say the line has to be drawn somewhere, who should we trust to draw that line, IMO it should be an independent arbiter, does one exist already?

Only the General Operations Director.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Of course safety, the protection of life and property is important, but as you say the line has to be drawn somewhere, who should we trust to draw that line, IMO it should be an independent arbiter, does one exist already?

I would like to modify that too:

Of course safety and the protection of life is important,....................

 

[Lister1987]

I would like to modify that too:

Of course safety and the protection of life is important,....................

The magistrate would make the call should something go wrong, using the legislative frameworks avaliabile; FRRO, EAWR, HASAWA etc, they're the only ones you can really draw that line.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Magistrate's would not make that call, they are not fully trained in Law and its application and take their lead from The Clerk of the Court, if a point of law was needed to be made it would be referred to Crown Court where it would be qualified in chambers by senior bench officials.