PV immersion heater proportional control

[echase]

Which btw are yours ( Ive assume solar immersion ) ??

and what others are there as personally I only know of 3 units which do this - all completely different prices and all not wanting to explain how they stop flickering - lol

I am trying hard to restrict my posts on this forum to general discussion and not use it for advertising but you have forced me into it. See our website www.intelligent-immersion.co.uk If you use burst firing you may well get flicker. If you don’t you don’t. As we don’t we don’t.

 

[danesol]

I am trying hard to restrict my posts on this forum to general discussion and not use it for advertising but you have forced me into it. See our website www.intelligent-immersion.co.uk If you use burst firing you may well get flicker. If you don’t you don’t. As we don’t we don’t.

Think I might just order one of these......... as the "price is right........."

 

[danesol]

I have recently commissioned a 5kw wind turbine.
I requested a device to reduce export of power and they offered and fitted the immersun.
The switch has most of the bells and whistles I wanted but unfortunately my lights flickered to such an extent, when the surplus was being fed into the immersion, that I complained.
The turbine company researched the switch more carefully and decided the device was not really legal as it had no approval, so they want to remove it. This, they say, applies to all burst fire switches.
I checked out as many switches as pos and believe the Solar immersion does not use this system.
It has more or less the same options as the Immersun so I will opt for this if the turbine company agrees with me. Electronics are a bit mind blowing.

I believe it is essential to have at least 2 circuits to switch to, however what I would really like is a device which can remotely, via the ring main, switch on a selection of loads with sensing switches using various frequencies.
This would allow loads drawing from a ring main to take power when it is available or in rotation.

Regarding the immersion heater, If I cant find the remote switching I propose to EXTRACT heat from the tank when it is fully hot by running a selection of radiators through the indirect coil. This will cool the bottom area and the power will be redirected to the tank to replenish it. The pump would run when the relay diverts to the second service.
If anybody sees a flaw in this please advise.
MOST especially, if there is an electronics wizard out there will he direct me to a remote switching product.
Perhaps the switch manufacturers who read and contribute to this discussion could consider adding this to their product.

Could these not be used in conjunction with SolarImmersion or Immersun units ???

http://www.diykyoto.com/store/assets/0000/0936/Optiplug_Brochure_web.pdf

EDIT:- or these

http://www.sailwider-smartpower.com...nitoring-and-control-system-solar-version.htm

 

[echase]

Could these not be used in conjunction with SolarImmersion or Immersun units ???

http://www.diykyoto.com/store/assets/0000/0936/Optiplug_Brochure_web.pdf

Think you will find they only talk to a Wattson energy monitor.

Their overall concept may work for mixit but I think you need to ask about long term reliability. Units like ours may have been criticised above for being hard wired in but when you look at a Wattson type product with sensors on small jack plugs you have to ask whether it’s still going to be working in 3-5 years time. I have a cheap energy monitor with plugs like that and you have to waggle the plugs occasionally to keep it working. I also have had 3 Wattson weather stations and their average life is only 2 years before irretrievably breaking down with PCB faults. Not saying this will definitely apply to their energy products but it needs to be looked at.

A ruggedly built reliable unit is needed in this market and not one with built in obsolescence. I do happen to work as a safety and reliability engineer when not designing solar products so design safety and reliability into our product.

 

[danesol]

Well the first manufacturer to bring out decent "remote switched plugs" to use in conjunction with their Immersion Control kit for home automation will have access to some of my slush fund immediately.............. as I am desperate for such ability !

 

[SibertSolar]

Ahem.....see here and here for a couple of downloadable brochures relating to Greenologic's Elios4You platform. It's essentially an accurate monitoring platform that will have control bolt-on features available over coming weeks, including wireless smart sockets & wireless proportional immersion control (phase angle, not burst-fire) and other features later on in the year.

If anyone wants to discuss further then feel free to contact me off-line or via PM etc,

Andy

 

[lydart]

Ahem.....see here and here for a couple of downloadable brochures relating to Greenologic's Elios4You platform. It's essentially an accurate monitoring platform that will have control bolt-on features available over coming weeks, including wireless smart sockets & wireless proportional immersion control (phase angle, not burst-fire) and other features later on in the year.

If anyone wants to discuss further then feel free to contact me off-line or via PM etc,

Andy

I like the look of your system but would be concerned on how quickly the initial investment could be recovered. I have just installed the SolarImmersion Mk3 (£209) and it is working really well.
Hopefully I'll be in profit after a couple of years.

It will be interesting to see how the market for these devices develops but I can't see any product with a long payback period being very successful.

 

[danesol]

Exactly unless its packaged as part of s total solution for energy saving for say the householder

 

[Worcester]

Andy's solution is a good piece of kit - at the sheap end - for your 'remote control' of sockets, you've got this:

though of course the sockets are 'on' or 'off'. Renewable Energy Management Unit REMU I - UK Starter Kit with RF Switch

 

[thushar]

SolarImmersion Mark III (SolarImmersion - Surplus Solar Energy Water Heater | ) proportional controller surplus pv divert switch now at special offer - Price reduced to £229 (was £249)

 

[echase]

The Intelligent Immersion i2 was also recently reduced in price to £199 and is now available with enhanced software that gives less export and a better looking but just as robust enclosure www.intelligent-immersion.co.uk

 

[thushar]

http://solarimmersion.co.uk looks like a more professional unit and with the advanced features offered by Solarimmersion ( http://solarimmersion.co.uk ), the £29 more spend is really worth it.

 

[liquidity]

advertising wars!

 

[echase]

advertising wars!

To avoid getting too far into this here I’d say both have their merits depends whether you need a ruggedly built well proven unit or one with a few more features. Contact the firms and compare them.

 

[pmcalli]

http://solarimmersion.co.uk looks like a more professional unit and with the advanced features offered by Solarimmersion ( http://solarimmersion.co.uk ), the £29 more spend is really worth it.

Just done a trial on intelligent immersions latest unit. The unit is well built and survived my very old immersion going short circuit which is impressive. The performance is very good under all house power factor conditions which cannot be said of some rival units. I would be very nervous of solar immersions claims of only 5W export at 800W available as this cannot be achieved under normal power factor variations.

 

[Worcester]

Thushar, EWP and echase are all promoting THEIR OWN products, along with some very shill looking support posts.. But then I am a cinic, and will probably be berated as such

You'll find that the leading product is promoted by installers. (see my comment in the line above )

If you want to know who will be around in 5 years time to support their warranties look at the companies behind each of the various products, and see how long they have been in business and check their financials - do a credit report on each of them. Also check out their current record on support and warranty support - what does each provide to an installer if one needs replacing? Then make your own decisions.

You have a few to choose from
Solar Immersion
Solic 2000
ImmerSun
Intelligent Immersion
Sola Controlla
Open Energy Monitor
Solar Cache
Solar Divert 3000

And I know I've forgotten a couple of others.

Do your own research first.

 

[jbella]

Thushar, EWP and echase are all promoting THEIR OWN products, along with some very shill looking support posts.. But then I am a cinic, and will probably be berated as such

You'll find that the leading product is promoted by installers. (see my comment in the line above )

If you want to know who will be around in 5 years time to support their warranties look at the companies behind each of the various products, and see how long they have been in business and check their financials - do a credit report on each of them. Also check out their current record on support and warranty support - what does each provide to an installer if one needs replacing? Then make your own decisions.

You have a few to choose from
Solar Immersion
Solic 2000
ImmerSun
Intelligent Immersion
Sola Controlla
Open Energy Monitor
Solar Cache
Solar Divert 3000

And I know I've forgotten a couple of others.

Do your own research first.

Thanks! Good, but could somebody (preferably impartial) please quickly summarise above mentioned proportional controllers.
Particularly info like: burst fire / phase controller; possible flickering; internet connection (via Arduino or something similar); extra benefits if any...
If you could indicate price tag would be great although I can see some prices even on last couple of pages...
I believe there are more people like me seeking this kind of info in one place.

I'm following (but not regularly) this thread for a while but to be honest I've lost a continuity. I guess as these controllers are on the UK market they should meet certain criteria for the home installation. Is that a case for all of them?

I'm about to upgrade my old combi boiler for a new condensing boiler and I'm considering to install also immersion heater as a either main source of hot water (summer) or preheat (winter) unit for the combi boiler. Obviously I would like to use surplus from my solar PV (Juraj'sPV 2.850kW | Live Output) and I'm looking for the right proportional controller for me.

Already for a year or so I'm using Sailwider (Home Energy Monitoring and Control System Solar Version with automatic operation function) controller to control 3 remote sockets for a background heating in north facing rooms to my full satisfaction.
I just hope that I'll be able to continue to use it in conjunction with proportional controller. I'm not an electrician but I do not see any reason why it should not work.
My idea is that proportional controller will feed the immersion heater up to water temperature of 60 degree and then the rest will be spread by this Sailwider controller.

thanks in advance,

Juraj

 

[danesol]

Thanks! Good, but could somebody (preferably impartial) please quickly summarise above mentioned proportional controllers.
Particularly info like: burst fire / phase controller; possible flickering; internet connection (via Arduino or something similar); extra benefits if any...
If you could indicate price tag would be great although I can see some prices even on last couple of pages...
I believe there are more people like me seeking this kind of info in one place.

I'm following (but not regularly) this thread for a while but to be honest I've lost a continuity. I guess as these controllers are on the UK market they should meet certain criteria for the home installation. Is that a case for all of them?

I'm about to upgrade my old combi boiler for a new condensing boiler and I'm considering to install also immersion heater as a either main source of hot water (summer) or preheat (winter) unit for the combi boiler. Obviously I would like to use surplus from my solar PV (Juraj'sPV 2.850kW | Live Output) and I'm looking for the right proportional controller for me.

Already for a year or so I'm using Sailwider (Home Energy Monitoring and Control System Solar Version with automatic operation function) controller to control 3 remote sockets for a background heating in north facing rooms to my full satisfaction.
I just hope that I'll be able to continue to use it in conjunction with proportional controller. I'm not an electrician but I do not see any reason why it should not work.
My idea is that proportional controller will feed the immersion heater up to water temperature of 60 degree and then the rest will be spread by this Sailwider controller.

thanks in advance,

Juraj

Not really sure how the sailwider senses that it has available energy at its disposal, so I assume is via a CT, if so I think you may have an issue using any one of the Immersion Devices - as they may fight for use of the surplus energy and secondly do you have enough energy available for both systems |??

If you do you may find that its very seasonal when both can take advantage of surplus at somepoint during the shiny hours, but fight the rest of the time ?

 

[danesol]

.........snip


Already for a year or so I'm using Sailwider (Home Energy Monitoring and Control System Solar Version with automatic operation function) controller to control 3 remote sockets for a background heating in north facing rooms to my full satisfaction.
I just hope that I'll be able to continue to use it in conjunction with proportional controller. I'm not an electrician but I do not see any reason why it should not work.
My idea is that proportional controller will feed the immersion heater up to water temperature of 60 degree and then the rest will be spread by this Sailwider controller.

thanks in advance,

Juraj

Just thinking out loud now and I dont confess to know how all immersion devices work, but there are ones which have an inbuilt secondary replay such as the Solar Immersion Device which you maybe able to take advantage of to use with the Sailwider by monitoring that secondary replay????

Moves away now for the experts.........................

 

[danesol]

Not really sure how the sailwider senses that it has available energy at its disposal, so I assume is via a CT, if so I think you may have an issue using any one of the Immersion Devices - as they may fight for use of the surplus energy and secondly do you have enough energy available for both systems |??

If you do you may find that its very seasonal when both can take advantage of surplus at somepoint during the shiny hours, but fight the rest of the time ?

Just a quick follow on since I made this initial suggestion, I've had a brief look at your PVo and your Sailwider seems to do a fairly good job of utilising your surplus, HOWEVER its lets you down on really sunny days as if you review 25 March - you simply dont utilise all available surplus...... therefore I think you need to findout how immersion systems would interact with your existing Sailwider before moving forward with one of them - that IMO maybe the weak link for you, unless you can do as I suggested previously.