**CU Changes And YOU**

[TPES]

Hi Jason

I found out some very handy info from 'DurhamSparky' on here, and I am sure he wont mind me passing it on, regarding changing a CU and non earthed lighting ciircuits.
The crux of it was that al lighting and switchgear needs to be changed to class 2 and a label needs to be applied to the new CU stating that the lighting circuit is not earthed and that no metal fixtures can be applied to it.
If the customer does not agree to the changes in their fixtures then a sparky is advised not to go ahead with the CU change.

Hope that helps.

Old thread I know..

Just wondering what your thoughts are if the customer does not want to change a few of metal light fittings in the house (all plastic light switches)

But they want you to change there old rewireable fuse board.

Would you all walk away from the job and not change to a new CU?

 

[Des 56]

Here is the guidance and no,I would not walk away
You cant force people to be sensible and spend money, but you can advize and still stay in work

http://www.esc.org.uk/pdfs/business-and-community/electrical-industry/BPG1v2_web.pdf

 

[TPES]

I have read the many different guides and unless I'm reading them wrong they say "do not proceed with CU change"

So if the customer doesn't want the disruption of running cpc's to the lights and doesn't want to change his metal fittings what would you do to cover yourself when issuing cert.

A spark I know said he's not leaving the installation in any worse condition than before he started, puts a warning label on CU about having no cpc's to lights and and issues a "potentially dangerous condition notice" and comments on the EIC..

This makes sense I think, but then there are sparks who will follow what's written in guides and walk away from the CU change.

 

[Des 56]

The esc guide doesn't stop you doing the cons unit
It tells you that if they refuse the upgrade, but still want the consumer unit, then you carry out a risk assessment
If it was me,my risk assessment would be to have a look at the location of the class 1 fittings, for proximity to nearby piework etc, and test the fittings to ensure they are good insulation values to the metalic parts of the fitting,then between those parts to the pipework
Advize the customer the best bet is upgrade the circuit
If they refuse
Take into account the test + inspection of the fittings,put a warning label at the cons unit about the lack of cpc and plonk all the information on the eic then do the job and get paid

 

[TPES]

Take into account the test + inspection of the fittings,put a warning label at the cons unit about the lack of cpc and plonk all the information on the eic then do the job and get paid

With having no CPC for the lighting circuit how would you fill in your results for the "schedule of test results" on that circuit? eg, Continuity, Zs, RCD...?

N/A?

 

[Spudnik]

Basically yes.

 

[james king]

3 - Quick Basic Check & Tests

i) If convenient, isolate supply and take off the CU cover
ii) Evidence of additions or alterations?
iii) Carry out IR test between Earthing bar & Neutral bar at 250V


iii what does that test for? and what test results should u get? >299??? if 0.00 would this mean dead short? and also would it mean borrowed nutruals?

 

[TPES]

It's funny no one knows how to respond to that! I keep going write something then have to delete it

 

[ukpablo]

>299 is an open cct which is what u would ideally be lookin for, anything less tan 2Mohm would mean that a possible fault exists on one of the ccts, investigation req. (i would only do this at 250 v on my megger which would give u >99 Mohms)

Borrowed neutrals could only be identified by checking each neutral against each other unless i am wrong. 0.00 would mean a short across neutral to earth and this would ping the rcd when the new board is replaced. Further investigation by removing 1 neutral at a time could identify which cct it is on.

 

[domestic spark]

Now, if there are issues with an installation that are not considered unsafe, although not to current BS, (unearthed lighting circuits excluded), you ARE NOT generally required to put these right, although they should be noted on the cert in the correct box.

whatdo you mean by this, thanks

 

[nickblake]

Basically means that if you carry out a cu upgrade with say a lighting circuit with no cpc then you'd mark it on the electrical installation cert one thing you would have to do is the bonding to the services gas water etc , in the case of no cpc's you must mark the Cu to prevent people installing metal clad class 1 face plates and fittings

 

[domestic spark]

Basically means that if you carry out a cu upgrade with say a lighting circuit with no cpc then you'd mark it on the electrical installation cert one thing you would have to do is the bonding to the services gas water etc , in the case of no cpc's you must mark the Cu to prevent people installing metal clad class 1 face plates and fittings

so you cant condem an installation (lighting circuit) for having no earth)??? or any other circuit?


would this be because, wiring is old and work would have not been done to 16, 17th ed etc!! (dependant on age est)

or because there are no metal fittings?

if you were doing a PIR what code would this be??

with/ and without metal fittings.?

 

[lloyd1980]

A great thread BTW

I have glanced at this as about to price for a CU change
Just a quick one, domestic 30ma RCBO . Will trip when there is a 30ma imbalance between the line and neutral conductors

If I was to do an IR test at 500V dc between neutral and earth prior to install;

0.00 would indicate a short and would then indicate definate fault once installed

my question is this, if your Ir readings are low but above 1M ohm ( min ac ceptable reading )

at what point would the RBCO start to register a fault???? eg if the IR reading are low 2.6Mohm or in region of this fig, would an acceptable IR reading still trip the RCBO?

obviously its not a short but its showing signs of deterioration - at what point would the RCBO trip, when there is a short only????
I have known RCBO's to trip without there being a short, just preasure faults where conductors are kinked as been stuffed behind accesories.

just wondering does anyone have a definative answer to this
Thanks

 

[tedy]

A great thread BTW

I have glanced at this as about to price for a CU change
Just a quick one, domestic 30ma RCBO . Will trip when there is a 30ma imbalance between the line and neutral conductors

If I was to do an IR test at 500V dc between neutral and earth prior to install;

0.00 would indicate a short and would then indicate definate fault once installed

my question is this, if your Ir readings are low but above 1M ohm ( min ac ceptable reading )

at what point would the RBCO start to register a fault???? eg if the IR reading are low 2.6Mohm or in region of this fig, would an acceptable IR reading still trip the RCBO?

obviously its not a short but its showing signs of deterioration - at what point would the RCBO trip, when there is a short only????
I have known RCBO's to trip without there being a short, just preasure faults where conductors are kinked as been stuffed behind accesories.

just wondering does anyone have a definative answer to this
Thanks

I'm new here, but I think the tripping point when "the RBCO start to register a fault" is not so much related with IR (isolation resistance) but very much in relation with the csa of the cable, it's length, and it's impedance Zs.
Basically the RCBO is "watching" fluctuations of the current in cable, and in between cables

I don''t think you will find an definitive answer to your question, like a precise value ... because this varies with the length of the and CSA in principal.

And lastly, we have 30 mAmps, 100 mAmps and other, to clearly show us that is the (MAXIMUM) variation of the current in between the wires at tripping moment. (this is my own supposition)

 

[rryles]

A great thread BTW

I have glanced at this as about to price for a CU change
Just a quick one, domestic 30ma RCBO . Will trip when there is a 30ma imbalance between the line and neutral conductors

If I was to do an IR test at 500V dc between neutral and earth prior to install;

0.00 would indicate a short and would then indicate definate fault once installed

my question is this, if your Ir readings are low but above 1M ohm ( min ac ceptable reading )

at what point would the RBCO start to register a fault???? eg if the IR reading are low 2.6Mohm or in region of this fig, would an acceptable IR reading still trip the RCBO?

obviously its not a short but its showing signs of deterioration - at what point would the RCBO trip, when there is a short only????
I have known RCBO's to trip without there being a short, just preasure faults where conductors are kinked as been stuffed behind accesories.

just wondering does anyone have a definative answer to this
Thanks

To trip the RCD part of a 30mA RCBO will require at least 15mA of fault current. This corresponds to an IR reading of less than 15.3K. If the fault is Neutral-Earth then it will take an even lower resistance before the RCD trips (As Neutral-Earth voltage should be a small fraction of 230V).

So if you get an IR > 1M, then this is a long way off tripping a 30mA RCD (including RCBO).

 

[i=p/u]

good thread , if doing any work on any circuit, i thought was ok to IR test at 250v between l-n, n-e, l-e as this would save you removing all elements and sensitive equipment.and getting more than 2Mohms is this ok????

 

[nickblake]

you will find that even testing at 250 volts you will get low IR reading due to the resistance of the load , the easiest way to carry out thi test is to short out the L and N then test to the cpc and mark that that test has been carried out this way you are unlikly to damage any sensitive equipment etc , especially will all the low voltage transformers,pir fans etc , if i can unplug and disconnect every thing i will and test that way but doing that you may have neons in the circuit which may well cause false readings

 

[saabuldin]

you will find that even testing at 250 volts you will get low IR reading due to the resistance of the load , the easiest way to carry out thi test is to short out the L and N then test to the cpc and mark that that test has been carried out this way you are unlikly to damage any sensitive equipment etc , especially will all the low voltage transformers,pir fans etc , if i can unplug and disconnect every thing i will and test that way but doing that you may have neons in the circuit which may well cause false readings

When shorting L and N and doing IR test between L+N and earth. Can this test be done using 500v or do you have to stick with 240v.

 

[Lioned]

Hi ,have tried to read back and ,unless i've missed it,cant see it yet.When changing CU then its a must to upgrade main earth connection to 16mm,but what about main bonding to water and gas ?
Quite often you will find some kind of earth to the water but maybe only 4 or 6 mm or smaller ! If you cannot reasonably get a new 10mm to the water can you just leave as is but advise should be done and code 4 ?

 

[clark]

Please could you clear up the earth and neutral IR query and test to be done at just 250v.

 

[chiplard]

Please could you clear up the earth and neutral IR query and test to be done at just 250v.

It should be carried out at 500v. Table 61, P158 of the BRB unless it is reasonably unpractical to disconnect equipment.

 

[rryles]

Hi ,have tried to read back and ,unless i've missed it,cant see it yet.When changing CU then its a must to upgrade main earth connection to 16mm,but what about main bonding to water and gas ?
Quite often you will find some kind of earth to the water but maybe only 4 or 6 mm or smaller ! If you cannot reasonably get a new 10mm to the water can you just leave as is but advise should be done and code 4 ?

Codes are for PIRs not EICs. There is however the section on the EIC for "departures from BS7671". However, as I understand it, earthing and bonding is the one thing that must be brought up to current regs for any work that you do - no exceptions.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Regulation 131.8 is the guide for earthing and bonding on alterations or installations

Then capter 54 for the set of regulations.

 

[mike2790]

Please could you clear up the earth and neutral IR query and test to be done at just 250v.

insulation tests at 250v is not a legitimate test, this is only done to give yourself peace of mind that you arent going to run into all sorts of faults which a residual current device will detect, ie faults which were already present in the installation which a fuse or a 60898 mcb etc would not have previously detected.
also....
a 30mA rcd has a maximum allowance leakage of 30mA before it will trip. in reality a ramp test will tell you at exactly what leakage that specific rcd/rcbo will trip at. i usually find between 23-27mA is the norm. this is not a required test and is done in addition to the required rcd tests and is done again to give peace of mind that the device not only complies but is also not too sensitive.

 

[malcolmsanford]

insulation tests at 250v is not a legitimate test, this is only done to give yourself peace of mind that you arent going to run into all sorts of faults which a residual current device will detect, ie faults which were already present in the installation which a fuse or a 60898 mcb etc would not have previously detected.
also....
a 30mA rcd has a maximum allowance leakage of 30mA before it will trip. in reality a ramp test will tell you at exactly what leakage that specific rcd/rcbo will trip at. i usually find between 23-27mA is the norm. this is not a required test and is done in addition to the required rcd tests and is done again to give peace of mind that the device not only complies but is also not too sensitive.

I do realise that the BS 7671-2008 is not a statutory document and so therefore technically every test in it is not legally binding.

As the tests and testing procedures, as stated in this and the GN 3 is industry recognised as being "legitimate" why do you consider IR to regulation 612.3.2 not therefore legitimate. Can we assume that the whole of section 612 to be the same?

 

[ukpablo]

i think mike2790 is referring to the pre test at the CU mentioned by the OP (or soft test as it has been called between neutral and Earth bar at 250V) to determine if any faults are present before doing any work on CU changes.

 

[malcolmsanford]

i think mike2790 is referring to the pre test at the CU mentioned by the OP (or soft test as it has been called between neutral and Earth bar at 250V) to determine if any faults are present before doing any work on CU changes.

So why is it not legitimate?

 

[ukpablo]

im not saying an IR test is not legitimate, just does not state the test between Neutral and Earth bar at CU as a pre test prior to a CU change in GN3 or BS 7671. This is something that was pointed out as a thing u may want to do by the OP. Thats the way i read it anyhow?!
i see what u are saying malcomsford and im not stating that u are wrong either, im just reading between the lines on this thread????!

 

[mike2790]

So why is it not legitimate?

as chiplard has stated above, IR tests should be performed at 500v unless it is not practical to disconnect all loads. obviously in a domestic dwelling 99% of the time it IS practical to disconnect all loads to enable a 500v IR test, so in this instance a 250v IR test would not be legitimate. the section of the regs you pointed out does highlight that a 250v test IS ok if there is an item of equipment which is not practical to disconnect, but ONLY that circuit, so all others have to be tested at 500v. you missed the point a little bit with what i was getting at anyway but i do realise the good book is open to a lot of interpretation. just tell me whether you would pass your 2391 or any other exam which involves testing at some point if you IR test at 250v? the 250v test described in this thread is just a quick test on neutral and earth which will give you an idea whether or not the fancy new rcd board will trip like a hippie on acid, turning your few hour board change into an all nighter lifting floor boards.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Mike I don't take the view that what your saying is not in good practice correct, what I'm saying is that when you use words such as legitimate then it conveys that the 250v Test is not right.

I fully agree in an initial verication there can be no excuse for not doing a full 500v DC test across LIVE/LIVE and then LIVES/EARTH. But the post was for a board change and therefore literally either a full or semi PIR on the existing installation.

I don't know about you but I would indeed, unless I was truely concerned with the installation, just do a 250v LIVES/EARTH only test and see what that got me. If I had a poor result then I would indeed do each circuit individually again at 250v LIVES/EARTH until I found which was giving me that poor reading, Then look at the individual circuit more closely. If I got good results then I would indeed do the 500V test but again only LIVES/EARTH

I always found that the regs as a guide was invaluable, but it gives scope for thought and interpretation. I know as a competant person if I was changing a CU on an installation that was 50 yrs old perhpas even wired in VIR that I would be doing a lot more testing before I fitted the board than a 10 yr old installation that had no obvious signs of tampering, Each installation would though both be tested to ensure that they were safe and still in a condition to be used, it would just mean different levels and perhpas even different ways of testing.

To just say that someting is not legitimate conveys that it must never be done, and I'm sorry that is wrong. I will not comment on the way individulas are trained, but fortunately I was trained to think and to assess, which to me is what a competant person is.

Please don't think I'm carping at you, as I said at the start your not incorrect for an initial verication every time, but on a PIR and so a board change, you are giving scope by the BS 7671-2008 to assess the installation.

 

[nickblake]

Actually a 250 volt is a legitimate test especially when doing PIR's i will never carry out a PIR and do an straight IR test at 500 volts and i was taught many years ago not to , the reason is simple if for any reason there is still an appliance plugged in boiler washing machine PIR's even a sub board with an RCD main switch the chances of blowing these up are very high and could be very costly , so an initial test of 250 volts followed by a test at 500 volts if the installation is clear and mark it down on the Certs even omitting the LN test by shorting out theL and N and testing that between earth and noting this down on the certs it is a acceptable way of testing , totally agree with malcome comments

 

[mike2790]

Actually a 250 volt is a legitimate test especially when doing PIR's i will never carry out a PIR and do an straight IR test at 500 volts and i was taught many years ago not to , the reason is simple if for any reason there is still an appliance plugged in boiler washing machine PIR's even a sub board with an RCD main switch the chances of blowing these up are very high and could be very costly

actually, did you not even read my post? i never said just test at 500v and fingers crossed nothing blows up, quite the opposite. this threads turned a little bit ----for-tat and a bit boring too. however i feel that testing each circuit fully is the best way to go. just a quick question to you and malcolm, do you do a full test cert for a board change? and if so what do you record as r1 or r1+r2? because in a lot of instances you would need to disconnect loads at the furthest point of each circuit to obtain a reading, for example a shower circuit. the only reason i ask this is that if your disconnecting the loads, why not test at 500v anyway? also the term 'competant person' is the reason a lot of us 'time served' electricians are struggling to find work, but thats for another thread i suppose.

 

[malcolmsanford]

I assume Mike your meaning R1 + R2 as your talking about a shower circuit and not a ring final circuit. Yes when I do an EIC fora new installation or an addition, I do the R1 +R2 on it, as I think it is a better than the R2 only test, which I'm quite entitled to do on an EIC, and on a CU change I might just do that on a lighting circuit if there are outside lights on PIR that I don't want to start taking apart. On a PIR I have often just done an R2 only espicially on hi bay warehouse lighting. Again as the tester I deem what tests are necessary.

I really don't know where this is going, In fact after this post I do think you need some refreshing on testing. It's R1 + R2 on a shower or any other circuit,you only do r1 rn and r2 on a ring final circuit. Also you just not only do a r1 test,there is no such recognised test, I think your meanig R2 but then I'm not sure what you mean.

I'm disputing you term legitimate. Now we can bat this about as much as you wish, IMO you using the term not legitmate when referring to a 250V test is not true, it is a perfectly Legitimate test.

It is completely irrelevant if you consider it legitimate or not, that is quite rightly your opinion on it. But you can not advise others that it is not a legitmate test when in the guide we adhere to advises it is.

A lot of us time served electricians do a 250 volt LIVES/EARTH test before we even start on a CU change, it is often used as a guide, and I would be quite within my rights to do that only test and put it on the EIC if I wanted to, as it is not a departure from the regulations. I'm sure like me the majority of us do also do a 500 volt test after, if we feel it warrents it and it is not likely to damage anything. After all I'm not going to go around an entire installation disconnecting everthing, possibly taking out 30 or 40 down light lamps, disconnecting transformers, PIR or dimmers, unless I found a problem.

 

[mike2790]

I really don't know where this is going, In fact after this post I do think you need some refreshing on testing.

why would i need refreshing? and who are you to say so? my qualifications are as good as any. we're merely trading opinions. people like you who get so ---- about things are the reason a lot of people avoid posting on sites such as this. this image springs to mind.

 

[nickblake]

Sorry mate didnt mean to offend and yes i did read your post i just wanted to express my opinion and belive you me i do a full circuit test drives my apprentice nuts and i will re do a test to i will never cut corners , my real point was that in some circumstances you could miss an item boiler etc with one of those nasty hidden away sockets behind cupboards etc with the years of doing inspections i have see almost every thing , when i test an R1R2 of say a lighting circuit i test at every point till i get the highest reading at the end of the circuit and the reason for this is beacause i got caught out a few years ago when i did a test R1 R2 insulation and Zs all tested fine but what i hadnt spotted was that the polarity changed half way down the circuit and then changed back again so you wouldnt spot it so im a swine when i test now , as for the competant and time served sparks struggling for work , i sympathise with those who are struggling ,but when you have the 3 week wonders and the 10 minuit PIR guys doing 6 PIR 's in a day this is where they need to stop it

again please accept my appologies if i offended you ,as i do take our trade very seriousley

Nick

 

[mike2790]

but when you have the 3 week wonders and the 10 minuit PIR guys doing 6 PIR 's in a day this is where they need to stop it

or the one hour board change brigade!

cheers nick

 

[Spudnik]

Change the record fellas,

I didnt start this for it to become another qualification vs experience bashing thread.

 

[nickblake]

Sorry jason wasnt my intention ,ive change the record and im listening to when im cleaning windows

 

[Lioned]

Hi. when doing a CU change is it an absolute requirement to upgrade the tails to 25mm.Got a job where the meters outside and tails 16mm go up cavity in a conduit,not enough room to get 2 x 25mm up there.
Can upgrade earth to 16mm but no way get new tails up.Its a 60 amp cut out so ok for 16mm,but if i use this one for my assessment is it going to be ok if i reconnect with the existing 16mm tails ?
Thanks.

 

[malcolmsanford]

The OSG does advise the tails being 25mm now, (see pg 17 section 2.2.3) but ultimately it is the DNO that will decide what tail sizes they want as it is their fuse that is supplying fault protection.

As the Fuse is 60 amp then keeping the 16mm tails will be ok, what it will mean though is that the DNO would not upgrade to a 80amp most likely and definately not a 100amp.

As it is an assement just advise the assessor that the protection device is 60amps and as the customer did not want to the extra cost and disruption that would have been caused by trying to fit 25mm ones, and that should be that. Remember your being assesssed to be a cash cow, he will not fail you if you explain the logic behind doing something.

 

[oldtimer]

Just to sober everyone up here in Glasgow today a Sherif found a "handyman" at fault for the death of a 21 month old toddler after the child put a "disconnected" oven supply cable in his mouth so heres the deal as far as I am concerned this forum is not a pi&&ing contest its for electricians to help each other out and yes there is some old heads like me are big on safety so when advice is given the person asking it needs to realise the they are tapping into a wealth of knowledge yes I know that sometimes advice can sound condisending but remember this is not a game people can and do die with house electrics and over the years every apprentice I have had I have said "do you trust me when I tell you its isolated ?" and when I get the "O yes" reply I tell them wrong answer I add you are your own safety man so the answer I want to hear is "well fine but I will still be checking it" and far from being insulted when they question me I am pleased hence why I am still alive today

So do not take it the wrong way if you are questioned about how you are doing something because its not a personal attack but more of a concerned individual wanting to make sure things are done correctly remember we get posts on this forum daily from people who may want to cut corners or have a pretty neat idea how to do something and sometimes they will say "But why not" and thats fine but at the end of the day we are not reinventing the wheel

 

[Ohmyword]

Just to sober everyone up here in Glasgow today a Sherif found a "handyman" at fault for the death of a 21 month old toddler after the child put a "disconnected" oven supply cable in his mouth so heres the deal as far as I am concerned this forum is not a pi&&ing contest its for electricians to help each other out and yes there is some old heads like me are big on safety so when advice is given the person asking it needs to realise the they are tapping into a wealth of knowledge yes I know that sometimes advice can sound condisending but remember this is not a game people can and do die with house electrics and over the years every apprentice I have had I have said "do you trust me when I tell you its isolated ?" and when I get the "O yes" reply I tell them wrong answer I add you are your own safety man so the answer I want to hear is "well fine but I will still be checking it" and far from being insulted when they question me I am pleased hence why I am still alive today

So do not take it the wrong way if you are questioned about how you are doing something because its not a personal attack but more of a concerned individual wanting to make sure things are done correctly remember we get posts on this forum daily from people who may want to cut corners or have a pretty neat idea how to do something and sometimes they will say "But why not" and thats fine but at the end of the day we are not reinventing the wheel

A man after my own heart!
I tend to follow the quote of "wrong answer" with a clip round the earole just to make it certain that the message has sunk in ;-)
They can't (and mustn't) rely on ANYBODY in our trade. They MUST learn to take responsibility for their own safety in this game.

 

[impecc]

Sorry if this has been answered before. If changing a CU with 100A double pole isolator, are you saying that is not composory to compel the DNO to change the tail to 25mm2 and supply earth to 16mm2?

 

[truckster]

Sorry if this has been answered before. If changing a CU with 100A double pole isolator, are you saying that is not composory to compel the DNO to change the tail to 25mm2 and supply earth to 16mm2?

The size of the isolator is not the determining factor but the size of the fuse in the cut-out. Nominally these are 100A whilst in reality they are more likely to be 80A or even 60A. The 25mm tails debate has been stirred by the OSG stating tails should match the nominal rating. The DNO's are usually happy with 16mm as they know they will only supply an 80A fuse.If you are concerned about it you need to get a definite answer from the DNO in question.

The tails and earthing conductor are the customers/your responsibility, the DNO's won't change them.

 

[pete433]

Hi

The correct procedure should be as follows:

1 - Periodic inspection & test
2 - Remedials works repaired
3 - Fuse board can then be changed as the house will be to regs
4 - Final testing and electrical installation certificate issued.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Hi

The correct procedure should be as follows:

1 - Periodic inspection & test
2 - Remedials works repaired
3 - Fuse board can then be changed as the house will be to regs
4 - Final testing and electrical installation certificate issued.

Welcome to the forum but though a good practice not every client will pay for a PIR, and certainly on a CU change only what remedials would you expect?

What if the house installation does not have a lighting CPC, This would contravene regulation 412.2.3.2, so would you not continue with the CU change.

 

[pete433]

When a conumer unit is replaced the electrical contractor is responsible for all circuits that are distributed from it, if a lighting circuit has no CPC with class I fittings then the consumer unit should not be replaced as you are leaving the installation in a dangerous condition, unless you are willing to replace all fittings to class II and note on the fuseboard and certificate there is no earth you should not go ahead. If a periodic is undertaken first, all issues will be found, this is a transparent way of working for you and the customer.

Remember that this is standard practice, also remember that you cannot issue an electrical installation certificate with faults applied to it.

 

[nikmet]

pete, what sort of average price are you ending up at after carrying out a cu change, pir and repairs to 'standard practice' and how many hours on average do you spend without taking any faults into account?

 

[pete433]

The regulations are there to be adhered to, I have found over the years that if you give customers the right information and inform them of the correct format for a consumer unit change probably over 90% will apreciate the information and we will gain the contract. Some installs after the PIR can be a few hours work others a few days for remedial, are main concern is that the property is to regulations and that the installation certificate will hold up to regulations. The days of just slapping a consumer unit in are long gone and rightfully so. All of the relevant bodies will back-up the pir,remedial,ccu change, test procedure.

 

[nikmet]

The regulations are there to be adhered to, I have found over the years that if you give customers the right information and inform them of the correct format for a consumer unit change probably over 90% will apreciate the information and we will gain the contract. Some installs after the PIR can be a few hours work others a few days for remedial, are main concern is that the property is to regulations and that the installation certificate will hold up to regulations. The days of just slapping a consumer unit in are long gone and rightfully so. All of the relevant bodies will back-up the pir,remedial,ccu change, test procedure.

I agree 100% with what you are saying, i was just genuinely interested as to how many hours for, pir, cu change, final testing, completing certificates, I am constantly hearing of sparks doing cu change in 4hours complete, (2 a day) and I think this is impossible to do it correctly in 4 hours?