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Discuss Hello everyone, I wonder if you could help me... in the Electrical Forum area at ElectrciansForums.co.uk.

?

Please select any statements you feel to be true..

  1. Competent Person Schemes (NICEIC, NAPIT etc) are a good thing

  2. Competent person schemes are a bad thing

  3. JIB is a good thing

  4. JIB is a bad thing

  5. Licensing is a good idea

  6. Licensing is a bad idea

  7. Electrical Safety First does a good job

  8. Electrical Safety First does a poor job

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
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  1. widdler
    Offline

    widdler Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    North East
    I am trying to collect some data together to see how things have come along in the past few years.

    There were meetings in 2014 with the department of local government with regards to the changes in Part P and the schemes got a bit of a wrist slap. They were given a couple of years to improve the standards for enrollment, the QS level and a couple of other things and I would just like your opinion on the current state the industry is in.

    Now with 2018 and the Eighteenth Edition coming in it is likely that there will be a fresh effort to strip you guys of your money in as many ways as possible. I'd like to know if you feel anything you are paying for is coming back to you as a reward?

    The JIB have announced the intention to finally introduce licensing, but it will be qualification based and will complement the existing CPS. Is this ok? Or do we need a completely new body built from within the industry to take on this stuff...


    Let me know any blessings or grievings you have in the comments or as a message that you won't mind me submitting as evidence.
     
  2. bluestar
    Offline

    bluestar Regular EF Member

    i feel the jib have had there day they have had years to get it right but never have although a gold card holder they only seem to be interested if you have done a jib apprenticeship or have an nvq level 3 where as many of us qualified pre nvq days try talking to them and they read from a script
    part p schemes I find it hard to accept that holding [email protected] 236 parts 1 and 2 and 2391 test and inspection I am excluded from installing or doing work in my house because I am not a member of a scheme yet I can wire houses, factories and everything else in between yet a 6 week wonder can
    t=there should be a licence scheme with grades on it and there are only 2 grades electrician and trainee/apprentice if you are a licence holder you should be allowed to install domestically and sign off your work with licence number on certs
    and finally stop dumbing down qualifications and courses
     
    • Winner Winner x 5
    • Like Like x 1
  3. widdler
    Offline

    widdler Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    North East
    Thanks for the polls so far everyone.

    @bluestar@bluestar yea I am finding the JIB a little hard to support at the moment.

    One issue is that they are not maintaining the grade, or checking on card holders to keep up to date..


    Plus they are looking to take on licensing, but plan on complementing the competent person schemes with it.. I just see more money going out and no slowing down in this madness.

    Electrical Contractors' Association (ECA) - http://www.eca.co.uk/blog/june-2017/driving-professionalism-across-the-industry?sthash.fuGQBosf.mjjo




    Oh and please don't assume that the license in the poll is referring to a JIB license, far from it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2017
  4. Pete999
    Online

    Pete999 Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Northampton
    Deleted for reasons you wouldn't understand.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. drzsta
    Offline

    drzsta Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    S.Wales
    I believe anyone who wants to earn a living as a spark should complete a competency based assessment.

    The AM2 should of been the answer but even that has been watered down far too much and not mandatory unless part of your NVQ or apprenticeship.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. Joshua
    Offline

    Joshua Steel Electrical Contractors Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Essex
    Business Name:
    Steel Electrical Contractors
    I think the competent person schemes were a good idea but they've not been implemented properly.
    for example you apply to the NICEIC,
    You get an assessment.
    if you fail the assessment they give you some tips and then book you in for another assessment.
    say you failed twice. . Don't worry they'll give you some tips and book another assessment.

    so you're guaranteed to pass it at some point if you're willing to pay for extra assessments.

    What they should of done is make you pay a 1 off fee of say £500 for an Am2 type of assessment, if you pass then you're in and then only pay £100 a year for the yearly assessments.
    Instead they make you pay £1000 just to join the first year and then it's £500 a year and you don't need to be fully qualified to join. Wrong wrong wrong.

    The JIB Should only give gold cards to someone with testing, how can an electrician install but not be able to properly test their own stuff?
    The NVQ is on too high a pedestal when everyone agrees the 2391 is the better out the 2.
     
  7. Vortigern
    Offline

    Vortigern Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    England
    Business Name:
    F.H. Electrical
    Deleted for more reasons you would not understand
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  8. Ian1981
    Offline

    Ian1981 Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    North east
    I'm not sure you can compare the NVQ 3 with testing as they are completely different in terms of scope and I would say both equally relevant to an electrician in their own right.
    Testing is what it says on the tin and can be obtained with a week long course and the NVQ demands technical qualifications and on the tools site assessment/practical skills to fully earn the qualification.

    As for the schemes themselves, they need to be able to inspect and assess any work the contractor has undertaken not just what is shoved in front of them when assessment day arrives.
    How that is achieved I do not know.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2017
  9. Murdoch
    Online

    Murdoch Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Woking
    Tbh there needs to be the Jib and a single CPS, run as a ltd company with public access to the accounts

    None of this multiple CPS stupidity, which means costs to us
     
  10. PEG
    Offline

    PEG Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Manchester
    It's a crazy,broke-down,worsening set-up,which will only lurch from one marginal solution to another,in ever more costly steps...just got to keep on keeping on.

    An assessment,interview and test of all undertaking paid electrical work,with removal of authorisation,as a leveller,would be fine...but it would not happen.

    Global warming,is going to take a hit...with all those hair-dryers,warming and removing van stickers :)
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  11. FatAlan
    Offline

    FatAlan Trainee Trainee Access

    Location:
    Surrey
    Regulation is needed to maintain safety standards but conflict of interest occurs when government abstains responsibility for regulation and farms out management to private enterprise that is in it only to make money. Major conflict of interest in my view. It's a big issue for public services and in my view it will cost us all big time in the long run.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  12. Pete999
    Online

    Pete999 Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    Northampton
    Bluestar's post 2 below says it all for me, I agree with the post wholeheartedly.
     
  13. gutterball
    Online

    gutterball Electrician's Arms

    Location:
    Fife
    most of my clients don't have a clue about the competence of electricians. to them an electrician is an electrician and they assume we all work to the same standards.
    what we need is 1 licence whereby you are trained to be competent in all disciplines with a random inspection of jobs.ie the inspector picks a couple of job that you have submitted test sheets for from the previous year. it should also be the individual electrician that is registered not the company that they work for.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  14. davesparks
    Offline

    davesparks Trusted Advisor

    Location:
    guildford
    In my opinion no scheme or 'license' which is not a legal requirement will ever be effective.
    And I think that unless the regulations become law there will be no way of doing this.
    It would be a very long and slow process to get it put in to law and be adopted and complied with.

    To take gas work as an example, it became regulated in law many years ago and has only recently, partly with the replacement of corgi by gas safe, become really effective in the domestic sector.
     
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