NAPIT Certification Scheme Napit/MCS non-conformity

[SunbeamSolar]

Hey guys. Just had my annual MCS Inspection by Napit.
Plain sailing apart from the assessor minutely investigating my Handover Pack. Anyway, I came away unscathed apart from;
Refer to DTI guide 2006 clause 4.5 and add missing information on operation and maintenance to handover pack. Forward to office.

I do actually have information on the operation and maintenance of the system including safe isolation and start-up procedures. I asked him to be more specific as it had passed last years inspection but his response was, more or less, to say that he wasnt there to give me answers. I dont suppose someone could forward a copy of what they include in their Handover pack so I can compare and modify if required.

Also, before going to the view the installation, he asked if it was on a 16 or a 20amp mcb. I'm not sure if he was trying to catch me out but I said I thought anything above a 16amp (3.68kW) is G59. Again he just said other installers use 20 amp....WTF???? Am i just going around in my own little world and missing changes in guidelines and regulation?

 

[infinity]

Hi, Im Napit, If i were you i would be calling office and suggesting that if they were not prepared to at least give advice and try to be helpful i would be moving my accreditations elsewhere ECA or the like!

You pay them to provide a service! So you should rightfully expect one!

My assessor last week was quite the opposite, very helpful and made the whole experience much easier!
You must of just had a miserable git!

 

[SunbeamSolar]

Thanks infinity but for the sake of one trifling non-conformity and not wanting to lose my £600, I'd rather just re-write the operation and maintenance guidelines

 

[SolarCity]

The size of the MCB is nothing to do with the DNO or G59.

The MCB should be selected for the job - why would you just stick a 20A on?

 

[moggy1968]

trouble is, if you don't know why you failed, you could waste some more money failing again.
sounds a bit of a txxxxx to me, which is a shame as I was thinking of changing to NApit.
I wonder if he just felt he had to find something wrong.

 

[dansk]

Thats really odd, but then authority does funny things to people - NAPIT are sound at my end, i cant praise them enough and my field officer is a good guy, always helpful.

 

[SunbeamSolar]

The size of the MCB is nothing to do with the DNO or G59.

The MCB should be selected for the job - why would you just stick a 20A on?

I didn't use a 20amp!!!!!
My point was the scope of G83/1 covers installations of less than 16amps unless prior permission has been received from the DNO. It was a 3kW system and therefore no DNO prior approval sought, so why ask if it was on a 20amp?

 

[SolarCity]

Exactly my point. No reason why it couldn't be backed by a 16A.

If you'd have used a 20A breaker it would not suddenly become a G59 install.

 

[SunbeamSolar]

I think we're agreeing to the same thing...I think!

 

[GreggElectrical]

Generally hate any assessor i've come across. I have the opinion that anyone who spends all day looking for faults in peoples work should be faultless in their own work. They rarely are but expect you to be 100%.

I've never failed an assessment but find myself caring less and less about what the assessors think.

 

[screwdriver]

The best way of dealing with assessors is making sure there is always something fairly simple that they can pull you up on that makes them feel like their job was worth doing, you can find fault in anyones work no matter how good we all think we are there are many ways of achieving the same goal and that is where you will find differences between different assessors.
I have been with Napit since the inception of Part P and am on their MCS register now, I couldn't fault them compared to the others!

 

[PeteC]

DTI guide is a GUIDE only~ BS62446 covers the handover pack:

*4.6 Operation and Maintenance information (from 62446)

a) Procedures for verifying correct operation
b) a checklist of what to do in case of system failure
c) emergency shutdown procedures
d) maintenance and cleaning recommendations (if any)
e) considerations for any future building works related to the PV array (eg roof works)
f) warranty documentation modules and inverter inc start dates and periods (...I include these under separate "warranties" section)
g) documentation on any applicable workmanship or weather-tightness warranties

*re the 16A breaker~ this is to protect the cable from the ac mains not the SSEG supply. Most inverter manufacturers suggest the size of breaker to protect the unit in case of failure (ie 4Kw on 4mm csa = 20A mcb rather than 32A and more than 16A as the SSEG could peak over 16A (allowable by DNO)) which could allow short circuit current from the mains supply. Watch out for Soladin600's as the factory fitted cable is only 0.75mm

hope this helps

 

[moggy1968]

Surely the output of the SSEG is irrelevant as it isn't passing through the MCB in the operating direction, so the peak output of the inverter won't affect the MCB?

 

[Eco Deal]

I just wanted to ask ''how long did assessor examine the phsyical job itself NOT paper work''

last year mine pop his head in loft for 10 mins

 

[yellowvanman]

Surely the output of the SSEG is irrelevant as it isn't passing through the MCB in the operating direction, so the peak output of the inverter won't affect the MCB?

I maybe wrong but its my expectation that an MCB could trip with excessive current (non fault) from the inverter.

MCBs have 2 trip mechanisms, for fault situations there is a electro magnetic trip to give instantaneous protection, this maybe polarity dependent (don't really know) but an inverter will never produce enough current to affect this mechanism.

The other protection mechanism is a bi-metal strip for overload protection. As excessive current is passed the bi-metal strip heats up and at a certain point will trip the breaker - the larger the overload current the quicker the trip. I can't believe this mechanism would be polarity sensitive.

 

[grandfortune]

btw, doesnt matter if it is on a 20A