Splitting an Ariel signal 15 ways !!

[andy120]

I have to to second fix a job including the tv Ariel's, which I'm not normally involved in.
The lads who first fixed it were told by our boss to wire it as follows


- x 1 coax cable from the Ariel on the roof to the intake cupboard.
- Then from the intake x 1 cable to the living room of each flat ( 6 in total ) x 3 one beds and x 3 two beds
- Then from the living room point, star wire out to the bedrooms. ( so two points in the two beds and one in the 1 beds)
- meaning 15 points in total

It doesn't seem right to me that you can split an Ariel signal 15 ways with out some kind of amplifier Ect, my boss believes we can just use splitters where appropriate is this correct ? As I don't want to get caught out

 

[gavin.sibley]

Your definately going to need a booster of some description, and I think you may even struggle where the feeds have been 'starred' if it was me I would of wired everything back to the intake cupboard and then gone from there. There is know way you will get a splitter into a backbox with a aerial socket plate over the top aswell

 

[andy120]

I would have done as you said and wired back separately, then you can't go far wrong. I agree that it being star wired will probably be a problem, hence my post. It saved loads of labour time and cable doing it that way though :banghead:

 

[Geordie Spark]

I have to to second fix a job including the tv Ariel's, which I'm not normally involved in.
The lads who first fixed it were told by our boss to wire it as follows


- x 1 coax cable from the Ariel on the roof to the intake cupboard.
- Then from the intake x 1 cable to the living room of each flat ( 6 in total ) x 3 one beds and x 3 two beds
- Then from the living room point, star wire out to the bedrooms. ( so two points in the two beds and one in the 1 beds)
- meaning 15 points in total

It doesn't seem right to me that you can split an Ariel signal 15 ways with out some kind of amplifier Ect, my boss believes we can just use splitters where appropriate is this correct ? As I don't want to get caught out

I still remember setting-off for my very first day at work after leaving school four weeks previously and my Dad was at the door to see me off. He said; "Remember this: Always do exactly what you're told as long as it isn't dangerous and if you do think it is dangerous ask for it to be put in writing and signed".

So here I am, retired now and still have all my fingers,toes and both eyes in reasonable working order and still remember those very wise words.

I'm suggesting to the OP that he just gets on with what his boss tells him (as long as it isn't dangerous) and lets the boss take the flack if or when what he's proposing doesn't work.

It won't be you getting "caught out" if you just do what your boss tells you, but he might and that is not your problem.

 

[jaypp]

I still remember setting-off for my very first day at work after leaving school four weeks previously and my Dad was at the door to see me off. He said; "Remember this: Always do exactly what you're told as long as it isn't dangerous and if you do think it is dangerous ask for it to be put in writing and signed".

So here I am, retired now and still have all my fingers,toes and both eyes in reasonable working order and still remember those very wise words.

I'm suggesting to the OP that he just gets on with what his boss tells him (as long as it isn't dangerous) and lets the boss take the flack if or when what he's proposing doesn't work.

It won't be you getting "caught out" if you just do what your boss tells you, but he might and that is not your problem.

agree 100%. even if not dangerous, but you think 'alternatively' to your boss, when poo hits proverbial fan it's good to have a copy (wiring diagram, text etc) of instruction as sometimes 'selective memory' is encountered!

 

[Guest111]

I would have done as you said and wired back separately, then you can't go far wrong. I agree that it being star wired will probably be a problem, hence my post. It saved loads of labour time and cable doing it that way though :banghead:

The old saying "do it right,do it once" springs to mind here,definately going to be a failure on a grand scale.

 

[Octopus]

most blocks of flats have aerial amps at a single point (a contact less one) - that would be the best solution IMHO

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Im no expert but I think sharing it out in a daisy chain (the TV signal) doesn't go down too well, especially if all the teles are on. It might be okay for a couple of points but even then its not the way to do it.

but one or two might be okay, I would love to know from a knowledgeable individual a de facto statement on what happens when you create a 'radial' TV signal circuit

 

[UNG]

I have to to second fix a job including the tv Ariel's, which I'm not normally involved in.
The lads who first fixed it were told by our boss to wire it as follows


- x 1 coax cable from the Ariel on the roof to the intake cupboard.
- Then from the intake x 1 cable to the living room of each flat ( 6 in total ) x 3 one beds and x 3 two beds
- Then from the living room point, star wire out to the bedrooms. ( so two points in the two beds and one in the 1 beds)
- meaning 15 points in total

It doesn't seem right to me that you can split an Ariel signal 15 ways with out some kind of amplifier Ect, my boss believes we can just use splitters where appropriate is this correct ? As I don't want to get caught out

As you are second fixing the job what is done is done the fact that it won't work is down to whoever instructed the lads who did the first fix if this is you boss the buck stops with him and it's time for him to find a solution to the problem he has created

 

[tazz]

Two ways of doing this...fit a master amp at main aerial, then to a balance splitter unit, or find a 15way booster unit (which will be hard to come by) all cables must come back to the booster or splitter, no spuring off.

 

[MDJ]

Two ways of doing this...fit a master amp at main aerial, then to a balance splitter unit, or find a 15way booster unit (which will be hard to come by) all cables must come back to the booster or splitter, no spuring off.

Quite right, I do believe you can get a 12 way, I suppose it is possible to add another 6 way and link the 2 together, crap but it should work.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

So whats the scientific explanation if you daisy chain them? Will it work for 3 but not 10, is there a limit....?

 

[MDJ]

So whats the scientific explanation if you daisy chain them? Will it work for 3 but not 10, is there a limit....?

basically it should be one from each connection at the amp to the tv point. Now forget that bit, I have have several coax s in my house joined together in a 20 amp lighting jb in my loft and it works all over the house and the picture is great lmao, seriously it is great. I wouldn't consider that type of DIY job for my customers but I suspect the OP may get away with it if everything is connected properly even though it is a crappy DIY way of wiring, just like my house tv system lol

 

[Octopus]

So whats the scientific explanation if you daisy chain them? Will it work for 3 but not 10, is there a limit....?

If you use "old fashioned" hard wired splitters, each time you split the cable the signal is technically halved, and hence why the decent splitters now are "contactless".

I think the person who did the first fit needs to answer the question - or you may get the new residents ringing you up!

 

[andy120]

Thanks all, for your input. So to sum up I probably can get it to work, although it will be a bit of a DIY bodge.

 

[MDJ]

Thanks all, for your input. So to sum up I probably can get it to work, although it will be a bit of a DIY bodge.

exactly, a big bodge but it should work to some degree lol

 

[Octopus]

exactly, a big bodge but it should work to some degree lol

Me thinks when he sees how much decent contactless splitters are he'll be bodging even more! lol

 

[andy120]

I guess I'll do as he's said then and see how I get on. As others have said if it useless, the buck stops with him.

 

[Octopus]

I guess I'll do as he's said then and see how I get on. As others have said if it useless, the buck stops with him.

Is there a socket where the aerial lead comes into the loft from the aerial?

 

[andy120]

The Ariel cable comes into the intake cupboard, down from the roof, it's a block of flats. There is a landlords db installed , so could easily put one in.

 

[MDJ]

The Ariel cable comes into the intake cupboard, down from the roof, it's a block of flats. There is a landlords db installed , so could easily put one in.

Just do the best you can Andy, it is not your fault the first fix guy was a numptey mate is it?

 

[mhar]

Your losses will be 10dB for the 6 way split plus 3.5/6dB where you split in each flat, allow 4-6dB for cable losses (you have not given any idea of lengths so bit more if longish runs), 4-5dB if using wallplates and then add together totaling 27dB. You will need 77dB of good quality signal to achieve the recommended 50dB of signal given to each tv.
To run each cable to a single distribution point your splitter losses would be 15dB per leg plus the same for cable / wall plate losses so virtually no fifference.
However if you use a really good cable like ct125 from aerial to first split and then on to the split in the flat you can reduce your cable losses and introduce less noise, coupled with using an 'f' type wall plate and leaving a decent f to coax lead at each point to stop the customer using crap flyleads, you can lower your cable losses significantly whilst retaining quality. Most digital tv tuners will work on low signal levels as long as the quality is good.
Whilst not that common, it is achievable to have 16 points from an unamplified tv distribution system and the system.
Trouble is that in a single dwelling anything sending anything nasty down the cable is 'in house' so easy to sort. For flats it is best to use taps of the appropriate value to supply the required signal to each flats splitting point which really needs to done by an aerial installer