Tools used when rewiring domestic property.

[BALDRICK]

Good Morning. Can anyone tell me what tools would be used when cutting channels into plaster when rewiring an occupied home?

House has solid walls, not plaster board and electricians used jackhammers to channel out, without extraction. I know rewiring is messy but the house was like a building site.

Is this usual practice? I have been told that electricions have cutting tools and use extraction and have had a previous house rewired (solid walls) and can’t remember this level of mess.

thank you.

 

[Dannyboybl00]

Ideally a wall chaser with extraction to create the channels then a breaker to knock out the plaster/brickwork. The latter can be done with hammer and bolster - it creates less dust but is slower.
Using a wall chaser instead of a breaker to create channels is far quicker, with cleaner cuts and less damage to the walls. Also means the filling afterwards should be easier with the same width and depth channels.

 

[SJD]

Can you show us a photo of some of the channels?

 

[Pete999]

Good Morning. Can anyone tell me what tools would be used when cutting channels into plaster when rewiring an occupied home?

House has solid walls, not plaster board and electricians used jackhammers to channel out, without extraction. I know rewiring is messy but the house was like a building site.

Is this usual practice? I have been told that electricions have cutting tools and use extraction and have had a previous house rewired (solid walls) and can’t remember this level of mess.

thank you.

Most Domestic Sparkies have wall chasers with dust extraction equipment along with plenty of dust sheets. what you need BALDRICK is one of your cunning plans, sorry couldn't resist.

 

[MJPD29]

Realistically it will always make a mess and using a kango or similar is very common yes.

 

[BALDRICK]

I don't have a photo of the channels with me, but I do have a short video of what I walked into and that sort of sets the scene for the whole rewire. The contractors sent 7 men into a 2 bed house and it was chaos.

If it common to use a jackhammer should some sort of extraction be used with it?

 

[Andy78]

Looks a familiar style of work. Are you in Glasgow area ?

 

[MJPD29]

I don't have a photo of the channels with me, but I do have a short video of what I walked into and that sort of sets the scene for the whole rewire. The contractors sent 7 men into a 2 bed house and it was chaos.

If it common to use a jackhammer should some sort of extraction be used with it?

There is no specific rule or regulation to say a dust extraction unit must be used. Yes it is a mess, it can however be cleaned. I do wonder what people expect when getting their house rewired. I certainly would not make that sort of mess but I have seen it many many times before.

 

[BALDRICK]

Thank you for your replies.

Not sure whether it was the same tool but the channels are no where near as neat as that.
Not in Glasgow.
Matthew, I was thinking is there any need to make that level of mess and dump tools on the carpet. I know rewiring is a disruptive and messy job and yes mess can be cleaned but its a hell of a job when only made more difficult by messy workers.

I think I was wondering whether this was usual practice or whether there is a more efficient way to do it. It seems that they could have used extraction, or made neater channels but feels as though they sent 7 people in to do it as fast as they could without any regard for the persons property.

 

[telectrix]

Thank you for your replies.

Not sure whether it was the same tool but the channels are no where near as neat as that.
Not in Glasgow.
Matthew, I was thinking is there any need to make that level of mess and dump tools on the carpet. I know rewiring is a disruptive and messy job and yes mess can be cleaned but its a hell of a job when only made more difficult by messy workers.

I think I was wondering whether this was usual practice or whether there is a more efficient way to do it. It seems that they could have used extraction, or made neater channels but feels as though they sent 7 people in to do it as fast as they could without any regard for the persons property.

every jobid different. e.g. empty house, just bought. customer is going to replace all the carpets anyway, so who cares if they get trashed? differemnt with occupied house. can't make a mess so that's reflected in the cost.
[automerge]1582016643[/automerge]
just wondering how you retire a house. do you put it out to grass, like a horse?

 

[Dustydazzler]

Twin disc cutter with Henry attached...
minimal dust minimal mess

 

[telectrix]

Twin disc cutter with Henry attached...
minimal dust minimal mess

that's what i use, unless it's just a small chase, like from floor up to a socket, then it's a multitool (cheap blades) or angle grinder and scutch chisel.

 

[BALDRICK]

every jobid different. e.g. empty house, just bought. customer is going to replace all the carpets anyway, so who cares if they get trashed? differemnt with occupied house. can't make a mess so that's reflected in the cost.
[automerge]1582016643[/automerge]
just wondering how you retire a house. do you put it out to grass, like a horse?

Ha yes and I didnt know how to edit it. And the house is occupied.

 

[telectrix]

Ha yes and I didnt know how to edit it.

only a mod. can edit a title.

 

[Wilko]

Hi - sorry to hear your house was a mess. I can’t view the video but I have seen wall chasing without extraction and usually dust is so thick that visibility is barely across the room. Yes they should’ve used a vacuum hooked up to the chaser. Maybe they just used angle grinders? Anyway, with a relatively cheap chaser and vacuum it is possible to do the job without tooo much mess and it’s always possible to keep the mess contained and clean up afterwards.

 

[Risteard]

only a mod. can edit a title.

Unless they're retired.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I did chase out a bathroom with a double disc electric chaser, with the windows open and a large industrial fan on in the room (extractor had broken down) after about an hour the fire brigade turned up saying that someone had reported the house was on fire, they did not laugh, local Pompier did not have a sense of humour.

 

[multimick]

unfortunately it all depends on how much you are paying ,i know it shouldn't, but it does

 

[Lister1987]

Even if thry were using angle grinders, you can get extraction cases that enclose the tool and hook to a vacuum.

 

[Midwest]

I can view the video. I would call a halt to the proceedings. Read through your quotation. There's an unfortunate side affect of chasing walls, but that looks like Armageddon.

Ask 'em for their CDM Reg risk assessment, and whether they own a dust pan & brush!

 

[Pete999]

every jobid different. e.g. empty house, just bought. customer is going to replace all the carpets anyway, so who cares if they get trashed? differemnt with occupied house. can't make a mess so that's reflected in the cost.
[automerge]1582016643[/automerge]
just wondering how you retire a house. do you put it out to grass, like a horse?

lYoum getting as bad as Buzz Tel wiv yer spelin

 

[multimick]

for7 men read 6 apprentices and maybe 1 3rd year apprentice, boss showing up now and seldom

 

[BALDRICK]

SJD these are some of the (allegedly) finished chases!

Midwest what is a CDM risk management?

The contracts manager is coming tomorrow to look at the mess. It is my daughters rented property so reading your replies I do think the Landlord has gone for the cheapest option and she was not given a choice.

 

[haptism]

SJD these are some of the (allegedly) finished chases!

Midwest what is a CDM risk management?

The contracts manager is coming tomorrow to look at the mess. It is my daughters rented property so reading your replies I do think the Landlord has gone for the cheapest option and she was not given a choice.

Its filled in, what else do you want electricians to do ? Wallpaper and paint it aswell

 

[BALDRICK]

Its filled in, what else do you want electricians to do ? Wallpaper and paint it aswell

No but I expect it to be finished to a standard where we can paint it. The plasterer hasn't even polished this off. The video posted earlier showed much neater channels. Even in these replies there are different standards. These fall below mine.

 

[Midwest]

Midwest what is a CDM risk management?

The contracts manager is coming tomorrow to look at the mess. It is my daughters rented property so reading your replies I do think the Landlord has gone for the cheapest option and she was not given a choice.

All that dust and detritus has to be managed correctly, google CDM. What did the quotation say about dealing with the chasing & debris?

I've done some work in a properties in single rooms, that created lots of dust etc, but it was managed appropiatetly. Seems here the whole house has been treated like a building site?
[automerge]1582056988[/automerge]

Its filled in, what else do you want electricians to do ? Wallpaper and paint it aswell

No but treat your clients with some respect. They are not there for your benefit, they are paying for your custom.

 

[Andy78]

No but I expect it to be finished to a standard where we can paint it. The plasterer hasn't even polished this off. The video posted earlier showed much neater channels. Even in these replies there are different standards. These fall below mine.

Your expectations may not match the quoted work though, especially if you have not ordered the work.
If the finish is not suitable to decorate you will have to take that up with the landlord not the electrician. It is quite normal for a rewire quote to not include for fine finished chases.

 

[BALDRICK]

All that dust and detritus has to be managed correctly, google CDM. What did the quotation say about dealing with the chasing & debris?

I've done some work in a properties in single rooms, that created lots of dust etc, but it was managed appropiatetly. Seems here the whole house has been treated like a building site?

Thanks I will ask to look at the quote and plan tomorrow. I suspect their plan was get in and get out quick, not all of the workers were even wearing masks!

 

[haptism]

No but I expect it to be finished to a standard where we can paint it. The plasterer hasn't even polished this off. The video posted earlier showed much neater channels. Even in these replies there are different standards. These fall below mine.

To get a finer finish you could go over with easy fill and sand down appropriately ! But tbh chasing a finished wall is always going to leave signs that its been chased unless its redecorated to a high standard. I dont even know why ive jumped on this bandwagon of a thread but anyways. I agree with the dust issue, the only way round that is using a wall chaser with attached vacuum, keeping area well ventilated, and covering up everything in sight with sheets (chasing can be v.dusty your lucky they used breakers and not grinders). In fact I turned down a job last week cause the chasing would create too much dust with the meagre equipment I have.

 

[Robson689]

The problem with brick dust in an occupied rewire is the silica released into the air. The homeowner is being put at unnecessary risk by the contractor not using suitable extraction systems.

I can't even cut concrete outside without water suppression so I don't know why anyone would find it acceptable to do it in someone's house especially when occupied.

 

[haptism]

No but treat your clients with some respect. They are not there for your benefit, they are paying for your custom.

not paying for my custom, hes paid for a load of E Europens by the looks of it, and they look v untidy in that video, you get what you pay for !

 

[multimick]

got a call this morning from a landlord (yes i know some are genuine) my heart sank when he mentioned rcd main swich,sank again when he said his sparks was busy ,sank again when he said intermmitent tripping,

 

[FatAlan]

Moved a socket for a client last week well after he’d started decorating. Minimal dust but it was just one back box. He texted me last night wanting another one done! I texted back saying that he was supposed to do the messy stuff first! His response was ... ‘tell me about it!’ Very understanding with expectations managed.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Ha yes and I didnt know how to edit it. And the house is occupied.

I don't think most small one man bands have wall chasers and dust extraction, I don't. I would make a lot of mess when re-wiring a house but I would have a tidy up each night with regards all the plaster/brickwork on the floor. I would cover all carpets with a dust sheet, but there would still be some dust that penetrates. Even if the house was not lived in during the rewire I would still clear up (to a degree) all the mess so that the next day I don't return to a bomb site as this is horrible to work in. If it was lived during the rewire (nightmare) I would have had a chat with the homeowner before hand about the degree of cleanliness that is required each night after finish of work.

Have a chat with the electricians and ask them to clear it up, I expect they will.

Ps.. That is extremely messy though!

 

[haptism]

To finish off (see the pun there) to the OP, dont feel so bad about this it can be decorated and made good again, and a chance for a good spring clean and fresh lick of paint !

 

[123]

I don't think most small one man bands have wall chasers and dust extraction, I don't. I would make a lot of mess when re-wiring a house but I would have a tidy up each night with regards all the plaster/brickwork on the floor. I would cover all carpets with a dust sheet, but there would still be some dust that penetrates. Even if the house was not lived in during the rewire I would still clear up (to a degree) all the mess so that the next day I don't return to a bomb site as this is horrible to work in. If it was lived during the rewire (nightmare) I would have had a chat with the homeowner before hand about the degree of cleanliness that is required each night after finish of work.

Have a chat with the electricians and ask them to clear it up, I expect they will.

Ps.. That is extremely messy though!

Really? I would expect most to have it, I know I certainly do and have had since I started up on my own many moons ago.

 

[Midwest]

Really? I would expect most to have it, I know I certainly do and have had since I started up on my own many moons ago.

Depends if you’re doing lots of rewires. I did mainly refurbishments, like kitchens. Most of which were gutted, so I used angle grinder, vac and opened the windows, and kept the doors shut. Sometimes I had to take a break to let the dust settle.
Mind you, if I was a younger man, I would of bought one of those Metabo ones.

 

[Dave OCD]

I just stitch drill carefully then use a 40-50mm SDS chisel when chasing, I think using any kind of disc cutter in an occupied home is just ridiculous, the dust is horrific.
We clean up after every chase by brushing up all the larger mess first then vacuuming and you can keep it well under control. It also helps to take as much as possible out of the room being worked in and cover everything else thoroughly. In some places it can end up cleaner than before you started.

 

[Andy78]

I just stitch drill carefully then use a 40-50mm SDS chisel when chasing, I think using any kind of disc cutter in an occupied home is just ridiculous, the dust is horrific.
We clean up after every chase by brushing up all the larger mess first then vacuuming and you can keep it well under control. It also helps to take as much as possible out of the room being worked in and cover everything else thoroughly. In some places it can end up cleaner than before you started.

You stitch drill every chase ? Would this apply to a full rewire and how long would it take you ?

 

[123]

I just stitch drill carefully then use a 40-50mm SDS chisel when chasing, I think using any kind of disc cutter in an occupied home is just ridiculous, the dust is horrific.
We clean up after every chase by brushing up all the larger mess first then vacuuming and you can keep it well under control. It also helps to take as much as possible out of the room being worked in and cover everything else thoroughly. In some places it can end up cleaner than before you started.

Using a twin disc grinder and a good dust extractor would create a lot less dust than stitch drilling.

 

[Dave OCD]

You stitch drill every chase ? Would this apply to a full rewire and how long would it take you ?

I do Andy , but we don't do enough of it to justify the full on kit really. A long chase from the ceiling down to a socket for example would take no more than half an hour with the box sitting dead flush and even with the twin disc chasing tools you still have to chop out the bit in between.
[automerge]1582138445[/automerge]

Using a twin disc grinder and a good dust extractor would create a lot less dust than stitch drilling.

But you still have to chop out the bit in the middle.

 

[Andy78]

I do Andy , but we don't do enough of it to justify the full on kit really. A long chase from the ceiling down to a socket for example would take no more than half an hour with the box sitting dead flush and even with the twin disc chasing tools you still have to chop out the bit in between.

Doesn't have to cost loads at all. My chaser was £99 from screwfix and works well enough with my Henry clone vacuum. Little bit of dust on the plunge and then almost dust free grinding. The middle flies out with a sds chisel after grinding. Probably 5 mins per chase.

Worth trying out for £99.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Really? I would expect most to have it, I know I certainly do and have had since I started up on my own many moons ago.

You may be right, I guess it depends on how many rewires you do per year. I do 1, sometimes 2.

 

[SparkySy]

I have a twin disk wall cutter that I bought from Aldi for £60 about 3 years ago, and a Henry. I do anywhere from 4-10 domestic rewire's a year and it's still going strong apart from New disks it owes me nothing and has saved me months of tedious work!

 

[7029 dave]

In this situation, using mechanical aids is a no no, hand chasing is less messy dust etc. Just MO.

 

[123]

Depends if you’re doing lots of rewires. I did mainly refurbishments, like kitchens. Most of which were gutted, so I used angle grinder, vac and opened the windows, and kept the doors shut. Sometimes I had to take a break to let the dust settle.
Mind you, if I was a younger man, I would of bought one of those Metabo ones.

I don't do occupied rewires, do a lot of refurbs and kitchens. The kitchen jobs generally the house is either occupied or fully furnished. I couldn't work in the place if an angle grinder was used to cut the chases, the dust would be colossal. Don't think it would take long for a cheap twin blade grinder and dust extractor to pay for itself on those types of jobs.

 

[Dave OCD]

I do Andy , but we don't do enough of it to justify the full on kit really. A long chase from the ceiling down to a socket for example would take no more than half an hour with the box sitting dead flush and even with the twin disc chasing tools you still have to chop out the bit in between.
[automerge]1582138445[/automerge]


But you still have to chop out the bit in the middle.

In this situation, using mechanical aids is a no no, hand chasing is less messy dust etc. Just MO.

That's way too much like hard work for the younger generation Dave.

 

[7029 dave]

That's way too much like hard work for the younger generation Dave.

Its all about rush and tear today Dave. lol Yeah and its to hard for the young ones. (sad)

 

[ipf]

As a direct answer to the thread Head......'house bashers'

 

[SparkySy]

Don't get me wrong I have done my fair share of chases by hand over the years but given the option I would use the wall chaser every time! Mine was cheap as chips and with a good Hoover it hardly causes any dust at all, mainly just on the first plunge! I would rather spend my time doing the more enjoyable parts of the job than doing donkey work. Just my 2 penith worth!