Wow glad to hear the expert Finaciers on here have such a great outlook on life in the UK, Where you guys moving to.... let me guess Australia...no US........ China perhaps wow how i envy your new brave life... in theses paradise worlds.
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average wage of a sparks in the current climate
Discuss average wage of a sparks in the current climate in the Business Related area at ElectriciansForums.net
Wow glad to hear the expert Finaciers on here have such a great outlook on life in the UK, Where you guys moving to.... let me guess Australia...no US........ China perhaps wow how i envy your new brave life... in theses paradise worlds.
OP
SMB
Laugh.
Im chuffed to bits that I live in England.
It aint perfect, but ive seen alot worse (I lived in India and Nepal for 11 months).
We are spoilt.
We are lucky.
I bet your not hungry.
Im chuffed to bits that I live in England.
It aint perfect, but ive seen alot worse (I lived in India and Nepal for 11 months).
We are spoilt.
We are lucky.
I bet your not hungry.
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OP
funkguppy
I used to work for Bloomberg. Learnt a lot in my time there about how finance works in this, and other countrys. Teaching has only depressed me as to the point of school. Been to Canada - a forward thinking country which saw all this coming and is now booming. To get in you had to be qualified and have money, or an investor, or entrepreneur - oh, and no criminal record. New Zealand - my sister and brother-in-law just moved out there. Better paid doing the same job, kids straight into school, small class sizes, much better standard of living, and i think you'll find electricians more respected out there. Australia - at least the bloody sun shines. I could go on. Yes this country could, and was, great, and could be again, but not without radical change in government thinking.
Take off your rose tinted glasses and see the reality.
Take off your rose tinted glasses and see the reality.
OP
SMB
okay o blind one.
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Well said SMB. We all moan but if we look at the bigger picture? Without getting into politics, let's look at other countries first then think what we have at home? Yep I'd love to emigrate to Australia later on in life but I'd miss our green grass of home, the country side, fish and chips, the local run down cafe and pubs. We've got a lot wrong with these little islands of ours but we have also got a great deal we should be grateful for. After all who showed the countries listed above how to do business, speak a common language and which country built these other countries? People like us travelling the world on the building sites that are now almost overtaking us in commerce. The planet is a much easier place now to pick a country to live wherever you want. If you don't like it here, move on or get on with it. Rant over.
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SMB
Id better go collect some wood for the fire.
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SMB
It amazes me Paul...
So many people here think they are owed a living.
Moan Moan Moan Etc
Money Money Money Etc
Hat-off to the Polish people who make an effort.
Wake up people.
So many people here think they are owed a living.
Moan Moan Moan Etc
Money Money Money Etc
Hat-off to the Polish people who make an effort.
Wake up people.
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kyle12
Im currently studying Level 2 Electrical Installation, really enjoying the course, allot to take in at first but im gettin the hang of it. My original plan was to go on to an apprenticeship but from what iv heard, iv got no chance, still gonna give it a go though
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funkguppy
Read reply No 123 properly, and you will see that i said this country was, and could be great again, but needs change. Why do you think we are behind so many other country's now. Bad government for too long. Nothing to do with fish and chips, greasy cafe's, rolling pastures, etc. Personally, i prefer sitting in the shade outside a restaurant in Tenerife, eating a beautiful paella, sipping a cheeky Rioja. In case you say "why aren't you out there then"?, well, i'd miss my 5yr old son too much. Hence, if you're young, disillusioned, and have no ties.......voom!
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Ok funkguppy. I think we are saying the same thing but not in the same language. For personal reasons you are not living in another country, I take my hat off to you.
I had a good friend that spent 5 years in the states and all he could say at any opportunity was things like, in the US this was better, that is cheaper, wages are higher, schools are better etc etc etc. Thought you were going down the same road. Gave him the same reply as I did to you.
We do have problems here in the UK but I still think its a great place to live on our little planet of ours. Depends in what you want from your working life and where you would be happier to do it.
I had a good friend that spent 5 years in the states and all he could say at any opportunity was things like, in the US this was better, that is cheaper, wages are higher, schools are better etc etc etc. Thought you were going down the same road. Gave him the same reply as I did to you.
We do have problems here in the UK but I still think its a great place to live on our little planet of ours. Depends in what you want from your working life and where you would be happier to do it.
Why ever did you come back to this horrible place then as a sparky, after being in finance at Bloomberg then a teacher, and living in canada? answers on a postcard please..
OP
tonys
So its nothing to do with the fact there's an over supply of "Electricians" and people will shop around for the cheapest worker/quote.
Your situated in a very well to do/affluent area of the country and if you were to enter my area or the north of England your be very very lucky to get away with your rates, in fact you wouldn't.
I get the impression people like you who are in work earning a good living do not realize how hard it is for those out of work to get work. Everyone is good at giving advice to those who are either looking for work or working for rates they believe are poor they will ruin it for others who are getting a lot more.
At the end of the day, its not what you think your worth or what you need to earn, its what the punter wants to pay. So like I said its a race to the bottom on the wages front and no-ones indispensable.
Tony
I could not earn a living from just doing electrics. I am multi trade and specialize on restoration etc . But when i do I charge about 20% less than others . Biggest difference for me is i will work weekends and have a good reputation for trust and work amongst valuable interiors etc . I fully respect the situation around the Uk. But certain guys are cut out for certain jobs and clients.
I know that if i looked at 100 guys to work for me i might find less than 10 that i could work with. We have to fit in with our customers ways and habits . Just been a good electrician is a small part of getting work!
also we have to factor in costs, i would imagine that like for like i would need £200 a week more than if i was working in Derby etc
Costs in London are far higher
OP
tonys
Luke
I did not realize you was multi-trade, I was under the impression you was just an Electrician. That's why I posted what I did, but for you to say that you would not work for what some people have too, but unless you was in that situation, its easier said than done.
I was earning £200 to £250 a day a couple of years ago on my doorstop labour only, and now can't even get £120, I don't like it, but its that or sit in doors and rot.
Such is life and one as to do what one as to do.
I did not realize you was multi-trade, I was under the impression you was just an Electrician. That's why I posted what I did, but for you to say that you would not work for what some people have too, but unless you was in that situation, its easier said than done.
I was earning £200 to £250 a day a couple of years ago on my doorstop labour only, and now can't even get £120, I don't like it, but its that or sit in doors and rot.
Such is life and one as to do what one as to do.
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kyle12
OP
robmac86
Hi guys just though id add my bit! Work for a big M&E firm in scotland rate is JIB so is roughly £13.50ish I couldnt give you an exact figure as im now completely sick of looking at a bare week pay pack!! Looking back at previous P60 I have noticed a rather sicking trend!! I also managed to earn £6488 more in my 3rd year as a apprentice than I did in the first year my time was out! There seems to be no overtime or price work that is remotely worth sweating over>> anyways rant over thanks.. rob.
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funkguppy
Unfortunately Paul, so do i think it's a great country. I only spent a short time in Canada, had plans to emigrate to Nova Scotia, was ready to go, but personal reasons stopped me from taking the leap. I now live in a nice place, see my son regularly, surrounded by friends and family and am pretty content. Where i live now has been home for most of my life, so doubt if i'd move away now. Home really is where the heart is.I work for a company, and do a bit of work outside to top up the wages. I'm seriously considering becoming self employed, but realise after reading this thread and others that we don't live in the best of times, so may build up the business while still employed.
My employed rate is about £15 per hour, but no overtime, etc... just a salary. For that i have to look after 14 buildings, PAT testing, intranet and data switches, phone network, teach electronics, fire alarms, organise outside contractors, fire risk assessments, unblock toilets, etc... Feel like i'm being used a bit. I feel like i could do this for myself and earn a lot more, though i know it's going to be hard work, and it does frighten me a bit. I've always been used to a salary.
On an optimistic level, i can see (and have seen it before a few times) that when there's a recession, things don't get done, but still need doing, and when we come out of this there will be a lot of work for us. Take Kent schools for instance. A report has found that 520 state schools in our county are in need of urgent repairs and a lot of these need rebuilds. This work has been put on hold, but will have to be done at some point in the future. Same applies to housing and new business startups that will all need our skills when they open up.
I can see, and it always happens just before an election, good times ahead on the jobs front. We should all grit out teeth, get through the next two years as best we can, and be ready for the gold rush. The one thing that does need sorting out though, is the confusion that PART P has bought into our industry. I personally would like to see the government take control and issue some kind of professional card which would only be issued to fully qualified tradesmen, either through qualifications and experience combined, or training and exams. My appprenticeship back in the early eighties was in electronics servicing, and i have C&G and EITB qual's, but have been doing commercial electrics for 20 years now, 10 with the MOD. Have 2391, 2377, 16th and 17th edition. I like to think i'm fully qualified, but others may beg to differ as i'm not JIB and didn't serve an electricians apprenticeship. Don't know what you think?
Sorry, going on a bit here, but i love the forum. I love the debates, the opinions, disagreements, sarcasm, etc... I find it as useful a tool as any i have in my toolbox. Great bunch of lads.
Tony.
OP
funkguppy
Only spent a short time in Canada, checking the place out. Personal problems stopped me from going. As for Bloomberg, believe it or not, i found it immoral to work for and with such greed. You needed steel plate on you back to stop the knives. No loyalty amongst colleagues. Back in the real world, I find real friendship, laughter and loyalty amongst work colleagues. I feel more at ease with my true peers and i also prefer the physical stuff. Still teach where I work now, though only 4-8 hours per week. I enjoy the feeling of enlightening young lads with my knowledge. I've always had a big interest in electronics, the sciences, etc... and love to talk about it to students. No wonder i'm single!
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Tony I agree with all you have said. Work has been put off and it will need doing probably just in time for an election.
On the wages side of things looking at this thread things are not good atm. I know this full well because I'm looking for employment myself. Seeing what is being paid in my area on every job web site going the average is £11 ph, but they want 2391 for this amount. Should be getting paid £15-£18 ph. I don't have the 2391 so I swallowed my pride and for the first time ever I went to the jib center and signed on so I could apply for extra training to get me back into work. I've just got back now from the training interview,
On the wages side of things looking at this thread things are not good atm. I know this full well because I'm looking for employment myself. Seeing what is being paid in my area on every job web site going the average is £11 ph, but they want 2391 for this amount. Should be getting paid £15-£18 ph. I don't have the 2391 so I swallowed my pride and for the first time ever I went to the jib center and signed on so I could apply for extra training to get me back into work. I've just got back now from the training interview,
have witnessed sparks being offered 8 pounds an hour by an agency at a big meet up/recruitment open day, it was 8pounds take it or leave it, then the guy changed his mind and decided he didn't need any sparks after all as was going to shift people from elsewhere in the UK...
OP
flyingsausage
Back in the year 2000 when the SJIB rate wen up to £8.37 it was still a struggle to live, to run a house and a car especialy when we got shafted with expenses.
How can you be expected to live on that now?
You do wonder what the trade will be like in 10 years time as most sparks I know want out
How can you be expected to live on that now?
You do wonder what the trade will be like in 10 years time as most sparks I know want out
OP
MvP Electrics
£250 a day 10hours work.
OP
funkguppy
What we all need to do is stick together on this. I assume that the sparks in this forum are fair many in number and influence in this industry. I know it's easy to say when your family need feeding, but we should only use agencies that pay a fair rate i.e. minimum JIB rates or higher, and only use the pee-takers as a very last resort, have no loyalty to them, and avoid them like the plague when things get better, which they will. Word needs to be spread that agencies are not a cheap alternative, as they charge the customer a fortune and pay the worker peanuts. If this is spread around the industry, then eventually all will get to know that they (the aforementioned pee-takers) are bad news. They are gutter resources and will only attract the same species. This can happen if we stick together. People! (said standing on a soap box) - have more pride in yourselves and show everyone that ours is a highly professional and responsible industry and demands the wages and respect it deserves. I remember during the severe snowstorms of 1987 in the South-East, shopkeepers who were selling milk at £1 a pint were avoided when things got back to normal and went out of business.
"A downtrodden class...will never be able to make an effective protest until it achieves solidarity." H.G Wells.
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2 wheeled ant
Everything not just Diesel gone up by 30% im PartP et al sole trader my 2011 rates
North East
£40hr £280day
North East
£40hr £280day
OP
funkguppy
Good luck with the extra training Paul. Do the 2391. It's damn hard, but when you pass it you will be full of confidence and think of yourself just that little more highly. Also, the knowledge gained will be useful at interviews. If you take the approach that this exam is going to be difficult, you will work extra hard for it, and this will help you. Also, it may be a good idea in these competitive times to specialise, in, say... microgeneration, entertainment systems, lighting, etc... All it needs is for you to buy a couple of books, magazines, use the internet, do a course of two, and advertise your speciality. It will get you noticed, and the challenge in the early years will excite you. I know many people who have started in this way. They don't even know, initially, that much about the subject they specialise in. Just panic a bit when the work comes in and learn very quickly. Maybe this is unethical, but top entrepreneurs do it all the time. So why shouldn't we!
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Funk I like your way of thinking regards to the special fields, seen people on site for office lights then read the instructions and call the manufacturer for help.
As for the extra training to help me get back into work (ok I'm trying to get 2391 free) they don't have a clue themselves at the job center. "You've come in for the ermmmm 2391, is that the 17th?" Will it help you get a job? In my reply I asked her to look at their own job web site.90% of jobs require it. "Dont think you'll get it, costs to much". But they will spend £500 on someone's 17th but not the extra 150 quid for the 2391??? I don't like the system, its not realistic to peoples needs. Oh well I'll find an under paid job, save up and pay for it myself so when my wage increases therefore my tax contributions they win, you lose but what can I say without sounding................ (stop ranting before I say something that will land me into trouble)
As for the extra training to help me get back into work (ok I'm trying to get 2391 free) they don't have a clue themselves at the job center. "You've come in for the ermmmm 2391, is that the 17th?" Will it help you get a job? In my reply I asked her to look at their own job web site.90% of jobs require it. "Dont think you'll get it, costs to much". But they will spend £500 on someone's 17th but not the extra 150 quid for the 2391??? I don't like the system, its not realistic to peoples needs. Oh well I'll find an under paid job, save up and pay for it myself so when my wage increases therefore my tax contributions they win, you lose but what can I say without sounding................ (stop ranting before I say something that will land me into trouble)
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