Capping installation methods

[gazdkw82]

I know it's the basic of questions but I'm starting to question how I install capping.

I do much work with it as most work that involes domestic work is usually just for friends or family.

However, Everytime I do it I always think there must be an easier way. I've tried mortar nails through the capping and in the mortar, screws through the capping into plugs and screws just to the side into plugs. All seem to have benefits and negatives.

Any other methods?

 

[-Matt]

Get one of these, it makes capping a piece of ---- and good fun

Spit Pulsa 800E Cordless Gas Nailer - https://www.its.co.uk/pd/800E-Spit-Pulsa-800E-Cordless-Gas-Nailer-_SPI800E.htm?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIz93W-6Pe3QIV77DtCh3x-wMzEAQYAyABEgKxYfD_BwE

 

[SparkyChick]

Screws to the side with penny washers.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Capping nails/micky pins?

 

[gazdkw82]

Screws to the side with penny washers.

That's what I did on my last job. Held well but just seemed over the top

 

[SparkySy]

I favour screws either side with small washers or I have been using orbix screws that have a wide flat head and grip the capping well as they are not countersink. At least with screws you can do one side up nearly all the way and slide the capping behind them checking the cables are sat nice before you do the other side screws up. Aannd if the customer wants an extra you can just undo the screws and add another cable! + I hate capping nails with a passion!! the mortar round here is either rock hard so they just bend or fly out at you, or like sand and you can guarantee they will fall out as you hit the next one in!
Sy

 

[Dave OCD]

I haven't used capping for years but used to fix it with galv 'clout' or plasterboard nails into the mortar joints, how times have changed, plasterboard always seems to be fixed with those black screws now- with horrible Philips heads.

 

[JAWS]

I haven't used capping for years but used to fix it with galv 'clout' or plasterboard nails into the mortar joints, how times have changed, plasterboard always seems to be fixed with those black screws now- with horrible Philips heads.

Much preferred using the old clout nails whilst tacking plasterboard, then the screws came in, then everyone bought 9.6v Makita screw gun with the long handle, then they really went for it and got 110v Makita screw gun and now they have the Drywall screw gun.

 

[Jamie']

In new builds I use the metal band strap with a spit nail either side goes up super quick, in older stuff I put a screw either side and abit of copper cable that wraps around the screws and as you tighten the screws up it pulls the copper right to the capping.

 

[davesparks]

Galvanised clout nails or capping nails or whatever the chippies have left laying around.

 

[Midwest]

I use clout nails either side also.

I did get a sample of plastic capping from a company, whose name escapes me at the mo. It was more like very thin trunking, which was hinged on one side. You just screw the back to your wall, put your cables into, then closed the lid. Few years ago now, never used it as wholesalers never stocked it. Seem quick way of doing it, but probably a bit of a faff in chases.

 

[telectrix]

prefer the oval tube, screw and plug fixed with it's dedicated clips.

 

[Midwest]

I'm waiting for our NI (& Ireland) colleagues, who tell us all off and insist on conduit.

 

[telectrix]

I'm waiting for our NI (& Ireland) colleagues, who tell us all off and insist on conduit.

fixed with robertson square drive screw heads no doubt. i've got some of them just to pi$$ off young sparks after i'm dead and departed this earth. .

 

[123]

I'm waiting for our NI (& Ireland) colleagues, who tell us all off and insist on conduit.

Yep, 20mm light gauge round conduit. Builders etc would be horror stricken if you used capping here. On the plus side I bought a bundle of capping 8 years ago, I still have about 20 lengths of it left

 

[Midwest]

Yep, 20mm light gauge round conduit. Builders etc would be horror stricken if you used capping here. On the plus side I bought a bundle of capping 8 years ago, I still have about 20 lengths of it left

Out of curiosity 123, do you run tw&e down those conduits?

 

[telectrix]

nah. he's irish, he runs the cable up, not down..

 

[123]

fixed with robertson square drive screw heads no doubt. i've got some of them just to pi$$ off young sparks after i'm dead and departed this earth. .

We call them screwlux screws, and have been using them for the best part of 20 years.

 

[Midwest]

We call them screwlux screws, and have been using them for the best part of 20 years.

Come off it, you lot are still digging up wet coal for fuel

 

[Midwest]

PPS still interested how you guys use conduit in domestic work?

 

[123]

Out of curiosity 123, do you run tw&e down those conduits?

PVC/PVC yes, could be twin and earth, Single Brown or Blue, Blue or Brown & Earth, 3 Core and earth. All available on the shelf at any wholesalers, but good luck finding anywhere with 1.0mm T&E.

Dot and Dab is also next to never seen on brick walls in new builds, it's all floated out with sand and cement.

 

[Midwest]

Oh okay. Was just thinking of getting a few cables down a 20mm, suppose you go up to 25mm etc. Apart from the obvious protection from DIY'ers putting up their shelves on a Sunday, why do you do it? Must put the price up.

PS we don't have brick walls over her', block work mostly and the inevitable timber frames.

 

[123]

Oh okay. Was just thinking of getting a few cables down a 20mm, suppose you go up to 25mm etc. Apart from the obvious protection from DIY'ers putting up their shelves on a Sunday, why do you do it? Must put the price up.

PS we don't have brick walls over her', block work mostly and the inevitable timber frames.

We have plenty of timber framed builds as well, conduit not used for that.

If needed we add a 2nd 20mm conduit.

If it's a new build I'd bring in a company to track the walls. If it's a revamp or a kitchen etc it's most likely conduits will already be there, so can often be reused. If it's a kitchen install putting a socket in the adjoining unit is frowned upon (generally), either isolators above worktop or all isolators into a larder unit.

For a small amount of water, theirs quite a difference in how we do things and in Northern Ireland we work to BS7671.

 

[Midwest]

We have plenty of timber framed builds as well, conduit not used for that.

If needed we add a 2nd 20mm conduit.

If it's a new build I'd bring in a company to track the walls. If it's a revamp or a kitchen etc it's most likely conduits will already be there, so can often be reused. If it's a kitchen install putting a socket in the adjoining unit is frowned upon (generally), either isolators above worktop or all isolators into a larder unit.

For a small amount of water, theirs quite a difference in how we do things and in Northern Ireland we work to BS7671.

So why the conduit?

 

[123]

So why the conduit?

Why the capping?

 

[Midwest]

Why the capping?

You know you tinker; only to protect from a plasterers trowel, bit plastic capping can do that. And imo, any ingredients in the wall covering.

So why metal conduit?

 

[a-z electrics]

Spanish plaster.. it goes off in 90 seconds. And that's the retardant stuff! Rapido sets on your trowel just as about to push it on..

 

[rapparee]

I'm waiting for our NI (& Ireland) colleagues, who tell us all off and insist on conduit.

fixed with robertson square drive screw heads no doubt. i've got some of them just to pi$$ off young sparks after i'm dead and departed this earth. .

Nice to know you guys read my posts

 

[DPG]

Not sure if this is relevant but I'm at the local club and I need 14 for a full house. Not sure if the regs cover this but appreciate any help guys. And galls sparkychops. Ta.

 

[Midwest]

Nice to know you guys read my posts

Do please more expand.

 

[rapparee]

Do please more expand.

I was on a rant a few weeks ago proclaiming the greatness of screwlux/Robertson screws and I've mentioned it before a year or so ago.

 

[Midwest]

I was on a rant a few weeks ago proclaiming the greatness of screwlux/Robertson screws and I've mentioned it before a year or so ago.

Ohhh, thought you were going to answer my question about the isle of Ireland using metal conduit, in preference to other products.

 

[rapparee]

Ohhh, thought you were going to answer my question about the isle of Ireland using metal conduit, in preference to other products.

That's not true

We have no problem using pvc conduit in tracked walls.

We just don't use capping. I think it is seen as cowboyish (rightly or wrongly)

 

[davesparks]

You know you tinker; only to protect from a plasterers trowel, bit plastic capping can do that. And imo, any ingredients in the wall covering.

So why metal conduit?

I think they use PVC not metal

 

[Midwest]

I think they use PVC not metal

My memory is a bit hazy, but I'm sure metal conduit has been mentioned before.

 

[Midwest]

That's not true

We have no problem using pvc conduit in tracked walls.

We just don't use capping. I think it is seen as cowboyish (rightly or wrongly)

I'm not convinced myself, but hey hoe, who am I to say.

Must get slightly difficult at switch drops, with a few multi ganged switches?

 

[123]

My memory is a bit hazy, but I'm sure metal conduit has been mentioned before.

Not sure where? PVC Light Gauge Conduit tracked into walls is generally what we use.

I'm not convinced myself, but hey hoe, who am I to say.

Must get slightly difficult at switch drops, with a few multi ganged switches?

Not really, a 3 gang switch could have as little as 1 Twin & Earth and 2 PVC/PVC Single Browns at it.

 

[Midwest]

Ok I misconstrued you.

Still wouldn't faff around using plastic conduit in dwelling

 

[123]

Ok I misconstrued you.

Still wouldn't faff around using plastic conduit in dwelling

And I wouldn't faff around filling the chases after a rewire, that's what a plasterer is for lol.

I don't see how it takes any longer - on a new build I'll have subbed in a wall tracking company to do the donkey work. The wall's are floated out then skimmed no dot and dab here really. On a rewire, refurb or kitchen etc, the wall's would need tracked wider for capping and there is no faffing in trying to get screws or nails in for conduit

 

[davesparks]

The way I was taught is capping for unplastered walls and oval conduit for chases.

 

[davesparks]

On a rewire, refurb or kitchen etc, the wall's would need tracked wider for capping and there is no faffing in trying to get screws or nails in for conduit

That’s where we’d normally use oval conduit.

 

[Midwest]

And I wouldn't faff around filling the chases after a rewire, that's what a plasterer is for lol.

I don't see how it takes any longer - on a new build I'll have subbed in a wall tracking company to do the donkey work. The wall's are floated out then skimmed no dot and dab here really. On a rewire, refurb or kitchen etc, the wall's would need tracked wider for capping and there is no faffing in trying to get screws or nails in for conduit

The chases have to be deeper, fixings for the conduit (instead of bag of nails), accessories are required for the back boxes & conduit is more expensive than capping.

Seems to me it takes more time & is more expensive.

 

[123]

The chases have to be deeper, fixings for the conduit (instead of bag of nails), accessories are required for the back boxes & conduit is more expensive than capping.

Seems to me it takes more time & is more expensive.

A bundle (30 lengths @3m) of PVC Light gauge conduit is approx £17+VAT. Looking at Screwfix capping is more expensive. (£12.50+VAT for 20 lengths @2m)
Securing conduit into the wall materials - I don't spend anything lol.

One run with the grinder set deeper would take seconds longer, same with chipping it out.

 

[Midwest]

A bundle (30 lengths @3m) of PVC Light gauge conduit is approx £17+VAT. Looking at Screwfix capping is more expensive. (£12.50+VAT for 20 lengths @2m)
Securing conduit into the wall materials - I don't spend anything lol.

One run with the grinder set deeper would take seconds longer, same with chipping it out.

I don't buy much stuff from Screwfix, but I know that metal capping is cheaper than plastic conduit and male/female adaptors etc from my wholesalers.

123 I don't think your argument about costs, holds any water. You could argue it provides a better finish (I don't agree, have to say), but its certainly more expensive way to do it. But thats what you do there, so we'll have to agree to disagree. I was just interested as to why it was done.

PS In a new build, the walls will need deeper plaster, or chasing in, so more expense

 

[123]

I don't buy much stuff from Screwfix, but I know that metal capping is cheaper than plastic conduit and male/female adaptors etc from my wholesalers.

123 I don't think your argument about costs, holds any water. You could argue it provides a better finish (I don't agree, have to say), but its certainly more expensive way to do it. But thats what you do there, so we'll have to agree to disagree. I was just interested as to why it was done.

PS In a new build, the walls will need deeper plaster, or chasing in, so more expense

It's you that's arguing about costs lol. I think it's all much of a muchness cost wise. You don't need adaptors, you can get bang in clips for it if you wish but I don't.

The biggest cost is labour, and if a spark does the tracking, what a waste of money. I can get a decent sized new build 4 bed property tracked by a tracking firm for around £200.

 

[Midwest]

It's you that's arguing about costs lol. I think it's all much of a muchness cost wise. You don't need adaptors, you can get bang in clips for it if you wish but I don't.

The biggest cost is labour, and if a spark does the tracking, what a waste of money. I can get a decent sized new build 4 bed property tracked by a tracking firm for around £200.

Come on, then I will drop it, why do you think we use capping over here, its down to being cheaper from materials & labour. Thats why as you've previously mentioned about not having dry lining over yours, here its about cost & less short term maintenance.

 

[bailes1992]

I've always said if I had a plot if land to build a house on it would be a bungalow with galv trunking run through the loft and galv conduit drops everywhere. No CPC cables, just the containment used as CPC.

But then again, I've always been a bit bloody odd.

 

[123]

Come on, then I will drop it, why do you think we use capping over here, its down to being cheaper from materials & labour. Thats why as you've previously mentioned about not having dry lining over yours, here its about cost & less short term maintenance.

Settle petal. I'm equally as curious as to why you guys use capping as to you are as to why we don't.

I'm not sold on cost being the reason. You can get 4 bed new build turnkey houses around here for around £150k. Perhaps on new builds what is cheaper - capping or conduit - the answer is a timber framed new build thus neither?

 

[rapparee]

Settle petal. I'm equally as curious as to why you guys use capping as to you are as to why we don't.

I'm not sold on cost being the reason. You can get 4 bed new build turnkey houses around here for around £150k. Perhaps on new builds what is cheaper - capping or conduit - the answer is a timber framed new build thus neither?

No you definitely can't


Closer to £250,000

 

[123]

No you definitely can't


Closer to £250,000

Up this way yeah you can, well usually. All the turnkey stuff sells pretty quickly. Was in the estate agents I do work for a few weeks and 4 bed semi turnkey was listed (and sold) at £149,950.
Just had a quick look on property pal, 3 bed semi £109k, 4 bed detached £175k.