DIYers/Builders...when will it end

[alarm man]

Exactly. It was never intended to stop qualified employed electicians doing their own work, that was just a side effect. I can't see how you'd ever get in trouble for it. For a sparky who spends most of their time doing private domestic jobs its in their own interest to be registered to avoid the odd problem with building inspectors and because it looks more pro if you can put on yr letter head 'registered competent person'

If you're a qual'd spark whos not registered doing private domestic jobs the only thing you are doing is a minor breach of building regs, which any decent builder does on a regular basis.

ive never worried about it to be fair,and as far as i know no one as ever been up in front of the beak for not being part p as its known

 

[Geordie Spark]

To a point, we should be thankful for the existence of the DIYer and for the sheds that supply him/her. For example, today I have had two calls from people who have decided to put their own light fittings in. Red to red black to black turn on and bang Er I'd best phone a sparky.
Easy money for an easy job

............ blue to Hell.

 

[oldtimer]

I see that on page 13 of this months March edition of the Professional Electrician The NICEIC "The UK,s leading voluntery regulatory body" is encouraging free transfers from your current scheme providor because "they run several campaigns throughout the year that helps contractors get more jobs" because they are NICEIC badged.

Well Well thank God somebody is looking after standards in the industry so does that mean the rest of the Schemies are just dross then ?

 

[GLENNSPARK]

was doing some work at leighs (my boss) house today......lunchtime..telly on....and it was rogue traders...there he was going on about `well the electrics have been sorted out by an NIC part p qualified electrician`....nearly fell off the sofa laughing.....and theres more.....this presenter was rambling on about how a cable feeding a socket had been `extended`...by twisting the conductors together and taping up....bit of plaster over the joint...jobs a good un....but it was the way he went on and on about it....i mean we see this kind of crap all the time....so get over it ...just sort it out for the girl.....

 

[Golden_Boy]

Ok so its a bit silly that a fully trained experience sparky who works for a company isn't allowed to so his own notifiable private work but if it were me I'd just do it anyway instead os sitting on the net moaning about it day in day out.

I did all my own house and guess what ?? I'm still here !!!

 

[Helm-Electric]

I did all my own house and guess what ?? I'm still here !!!

Same here... I spent 3 Years at University and gained a degree in Electrical and Electronic Engineering. I think as long as you have some technical background and fully understand how AC power flows then fine for slight mods, extending circuits. Of course, any notifiable work should be overseen/carried out by an electrician that has his ticket.

 

[Guest111]

I reckon dentistry is where the money is at - OK you have to pay some fit bird to stand next to you and write stuff down, and a grumpy bird to sit behind a desk being rude to people, but £30 for a quick checkup? Dick Turpin, mask etc!
There seems to be a 'massive skills shortage' as well - most of the dentists around here are fully booked.
I wonder if I can do a 5 week distance learning dentistry course...

Hey Adam, dont take this the wrong way mate but would you class your wife as a fit bird? if so your on a winner think about this,ok here goes fit wife, grumpy m i l (most are) online order for dentistry eqpt read up how to do it online and away you go simples.after all it will probably go that way soon so you could be a pioneer after all didn,t blacksmiths pull teeth as a sideline in the old days.:smile5:

 

[diabalo]

Doctors don't withold contraceptive advice because their clients are underage. Generous and knowledgeable sparks share information because they know people are going to do it and it makes it safer.

 

[Adam W]

Doctors don't withold contraceptive advice because their clients are underage. Generous and knowledgeable sparks share information because they know people are going to do it and it makes it safer.

I think that's a bad example - doctors take the Hippocratic Oath and they'll help anyone even if they're on their way home and someone has fallen over in the street.

If you ask a piano tuner how to tune your own piano they'll tell you not to because you'll probably mess it up. They'll happily come and tune it for you (for a price) and they'll come and sort out the mess you've made of having a go yourself, but they'll probably charge you more for that, and they might even say "I told you so".

 

[diabalo]

I think that's a bad example - doctors take the Hippocratic Oath and they'll help anyone

Yes sorry very good point I forgot that doctors are obligated to help anyone regardless but electricians can choose not to but it still raises an important question about our obligation to use expert knowledge or status responsibly, and that witholding it may not always be the best option. The general point, made many times, holds, that in ignoring or opting out of a request for information there is a calculated risk that an unqualified person will put themselves or others in danger.
My general impression of the forum is that many contributors make a judgement based on the nature and wording of the request, offering appropriate technical and practical advice and also appropriate warnings. I wouldn't like them to be put off doing so.

 

[Strima]

At the end of the day it's a job although some feel the moral obligation to help others and ensure their safety.

As for advice on the internet, there's a very fine line. One phrase taken out of context could potentially lead to injury or death, very difficult choice to make. Give people the information they need to make an informed decision, normally that entails get a qualified professional in but then most forum users create an account to try and get the job done without spending too much money which sort of defeats the whole object... Swings and roundabouts...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

No I am not greedy 5 numbers and a bonus ball please

5 numbers......well, you can have week 1...week 2...week 3.....

 

[Mr.Ian]

It is tue though that a lot of DIYers will have a go at electrics and plumbing but not gas, they've bought their house with roof tiles doors windows floorboards and sockets/wiring and they own it all, at the end of the day it's their property.
Electrics they feel are fused and if there was a problem with what they do a fuse will blow/ breaker trip and they'll be ok.
Plumbing they'll have a go at as if there's a problem they'll see a trickle of water and it can be moped up and the stopcock turned off.
Gas on the other hand is a completely different beast, it doesn't have any protection as such (apart from thermocouples) and faults can't be seen. (on that note though I can't see why there isn't an auto cut off on the gas meter so when it senses a pressure drop and it's sensor says there's nothing lit it'd cut the supply / I must design this soon !!!!!!)
I feel this is why there are a lot of 'have a go' diy electrics in homes.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

It is tue though that a lot of DIYers will have a go at electrics and plumbing but not gas, they've bought their house with roof tiles doors windows floorboards and sockets/wiring and they own it all, at the end of the day it's their property.
Electrics they feel are fused and if there was a problem with what they do a fuse will blow/ breaker trip and they'll be ok.
Plumbing they'll have a go at as if there's a problem they'll see a trickle of water and it can be moped up and the stopcock turned off.
Gas on the other hand is a completely different beast, it doesn't have any protection as such (apart from thermocouples) and faults can't be seen. (on that note though I can't see why there isn't an auto cut off on the gas meter so when it senses a pressure drop and it's sensor says there's nothing lit it'd cut the supply / I must design this soon !!!!!!)
I feel this is why there are a lot of 'have a go' diy electrics in homes.

so electrics are fused and so should blow and they`l be ok....hmm.....a basic misunderstanding then about the job of a fuse/MCB in an electrical installation then by them...

 

[telectrix]

well, it's obvious. the fuse is only there to blow if mr. diy bodger gets it wrong. have to email IET and get them to rewrite the regs.

 

[Geordie Spark]

It is tue though that a lot of DIYers will have a go at electrics and plumbing but not gas, they've bought their house with roof tiles doors windows floorboards and sockets/wiring and they own it all, at the end of the day it's their property.
Electrics they feel are fused and if there was a problem with what they do a fuse will blow/ breaker trip and they'll be ok.
Plumbing they'll have a go at as if there's a problem they'll see a trickle of water and it can be moped up and the stopcock turned off.
Gas on the other hand is a completely different beast, it doesn't have any protection as such (apart from thermocouples) and faults can't be seen. (on that note though I can't see why there isn't an auto cut off on the gas meter so when it senses a pressure drop and it's sensor says there's nothing lit it'd cut the supply / I must design this soon !!!!!!)
I feel this is why there are a lot of 'have a go' diy electrics in homes.

You're too late ..... it already exists, but is used in Training Establishments & the like.

THIS Boiler recovered from Gateshead gas blast house - Chronicle News - News - ChronicleLive shows what can happen when things go wrong (and no ... it wasn't one of mine !!)

 

[Knobhead]

Can't see what all the fuss is about!

 

[Edd]

Doctors don't withold contraceptive advice because their clients are underage. Generous and knowledgeable sparks share information because they know people are going to do it and it makes it safer.

You wouldnt go on a doctors forum and ask them for advise on cutting open your friends arm because his having trouble with it.. same as people here asking what to look for inside their fuse board.. if you dont know what your doing dont bother looking..
Saying that im up for a bit of DIY surgery,, who wants to volenterer

 

[mickys86]

You wouldnt go on a doctors forum and ask them for advise you on cutting open your friends arm because his having trouble with it.. same as people here asking what to look for inside their fuse board.. if you dont know what your doing dont bother looking..
Saying that im up for a bit of DIY surgery,, who wants to volenterer

You should stay away from DIY surgery! Someone could get hurt or even worse killed!! Right then..... Who wants step by step instructions on how to change a cu??

 

[Golden_Boy]

You should stay away from DIY surgery! Someone could get hurt or even worse killed!! Right then..... Who wants step by step instructions on how to change a cu??

Come on guys.. Its hardly rocket science? Look at some of the things you come accross on your travels, Installed by a supposed qualified spark! DIYers are just people like everyone else and with a short course can be a PRO !!
Changing a CU is a step by step process. Just think about it??

 

[Dave 85]

Kinda makes me laugh all these people comparing wiring to surgery as if to be an electrician requires you to be as skilled educated and intellegent as a doctor is required to be. Stop flattering yourselves guys, its a fairly simple manual job that, as with many manual jobs, can in very rare circumstances, be potentially fatal.

 

[ipf]

Kinda makes me laugh all these people comparing wiring to surgery as if to be an electrician requires you to be as skilled educated and intellegent as a doctor is required to be. Stop flattering yourselves guys, its a fairly simple manual job that, as with many manual jobs, can in very rare circumstances, be potentially fatal.

Fatal - Rare, Potentially fatal - I would say quite common. Simple/manual ? Depends what field your in and how much thought is required.

 

[needasparks]

TBH changing a board is easy for a diy'er. No testing, no labeling and put the cover on quick before the spaggetti falls out.
see how quick they call for help though when the rcd won't stay in.

I had a great call few years back, someone changed the CU and said it will not stay live and trip straight away.
It was one that you cut the buss bar to split the ways you want, you guessed it. They left it joining both rcds together.

 

[kingeri]

I went to a DIY CU change fairly recently - they had actually done a reasonably tidy job - but obviously no pre-testing done on circuits. Guy called me out wondering why RCD won't stay on. After a few tests I found issues with 3 of the circuits. He said he had no idea of the implications or sensitivity of RCDs. He learned.

 

[Octopus]

TBH changing a board is easy for a diy'er. No testing, no labeling and put the cover on quick before the spaggetti falls out.
see how quick they call for help though when the rcd won't stay in.

I had a great call few years back, someone changed the CU and said it will not stay live and trip straight away.
It was one that you cut the buss bar to split the ways you want, you guessed it. They left it joining both rcds together.

From what I see around my patch there are registered sparkies installing boards, not labelling them, not doing certificates, not notifying them. The list goes on. Sometimes I wonder why I want to do it by the book.

 

[i=p/u]

go to fancy dress shop get moustache and wig and offer great deals for crap work....

From what I see around my patch there are registered sparkies installing boards, not labelling them, not doing certificates, not notifying them. The list goes on. Sometimes I wonder why I want to do it by the book.

- - - Updated - - -

it happens all over...

 

[Octopus]

go to fancy dress shop get moustache and wig and offer great deals for crap work....

- - - Updated - - -

it happens all over...

I'm sure it does, makes you wonder why some of us actually bother.

Actually I see more issues with electrics done as part of work done under planning permission here!

 

[needasparks]

From what I see around my patch there are registered sparkies installing boards, not labelling them, not doing certificates, not notifying them. The list goes on. Sometimes I wonder why I want to do it by the book.

Think most of us see that on a daily basis, after a while its hard to separate the diy stuff from billy sparks with the picture of a plug on the van.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Kinda makes me laugh all these people comparing wiring to surgery as if to be an electrician requires you to be as skilled educated and intellegent as a doctor is required to be. Stop flattering yourselves guys, its a fairly simple manual job that, as with many manual jobs, can in very rare circumstances, be potentially fatal.

yet another piece of bull from Dave 85....listen ...your starting to get a reputation in here for being the author of complete and useless crap kid so do yourself a favour....look in books or hit the road...lol...lol...
P.S. send us a copy of a recent schedule of inspections of yours fella....thats if you want to gain any credibility with me Mr.....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

i dont think anyones flattering themselves as to the job they have chosen....much easier now we have RCDs.....what you think Dave?...

 

[telectrix]

yeah, what's so complicated about surgery. it's only glorified plumbing at the end of the day. cut this artery, join that one to it, can't wait till the medical profession get round to using speedfix joints.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

yeah, what's so complicated about surgery. it's only glorified plumbing at the end of the day. cut this artery, join that one to it, can't wait till the medical profession get round to using speedfix joints.

still sweating em on at the mo` tel...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

come on Dave 85...be a Man....you come in here trying to dazzle us with your knowledge....
still wet behind the ears kid.....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

just noticed his names not on the list....i guess that means he`s not coming in?

 

[ipf]

Someone's excluded methinks!

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Someone's excluded methinks!

well it happened to the best of us....i guess it can now happen to the worst....

 

[ipf]

well it happened to the best of us....i guess it can now happen to the worst....

True........and I don't mean you.lol.

 

[i=p/u]

electric between yous two. reduce your resistance by hugging

 

[mickys86]

Come on guys.. Its hardly rocket science? Look at some of the things you come accross on your travels, Installed by a supposed qualified spark! DIYers are just people like everyone else and with a short course can be a PRO !!
Changing a CU is a step by step process. Just think about it??

Anything can be a step by step process. But doesn't mean if your not trained you should be doing it. I'm sure it states somewhere in the electricity at work act that you have to be trained and competent.

That and the testing the bonding the upgrading of tails and not to mention the borrowed neutral.

 

[i=p/u]

well sai mickey in mentioning trained and competent which is they key words to this subject.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

well sai mickey in mentioning trained and competent which is they key words to this subject.

its competent person/s trev....

 

[Strima]

Kinda makes me laugh all these people comparing wiring to surgery as if to be an electrician requires you to be as skilled educated and intellegent as a doctor is required to be. Stop flattering yourselves guys, its a fairly simple manual job that, as with many manual jobs, can in very rare circumstances, be potentially fatal.

I would respond but it appears he has been banned.

No one here claims to be as skilled, educated and as intelligent as a surgeon however when people have spent years and lots of hard earned cash to be qualified in a highly regulated working environment then they have a right to be protective over their jobs, skills and knowledge.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

even a throwback could do this job....what you think Dave?...
oh sorry....he aint allowed to comment at this particular time....

 

[mickys86]

What did he say to get banned??? I definitely missed somat

 

[GLENNSPARK]

What did he say to get banned??? I definitely missed somat

dont know mick dont care either....stop him embarassing himself though....for a bit like...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

contrary to what many may think about me....i aint out to get anyone.....i just dont like those that profess to know it all...without backing it up