EV charging points 2020

[Midwest]

Hmmm, having watched a Sparki Nija vid and a listened to a podcast (Oct 19) from e5 Group, seems the Amendment 1 gives 4 options for ev charging so apply them in simple terms for domestic property;

1) 3 phase, unlikely
2) Local earth rod, connected to MET. Again unlikely to achieve the required resistance
3) TT the ev charger
4) This new device for single phase, where voltage between Line & neutral is monitor and disconnected if it goes above 253V or below 207V.

The forth option in the Amendment, seems to be completely handed over to the manufacturer, to make it comply.

Then there's this thing about certain ev cars, and DC currents, requiring Type B or F RCD. And by the time Amendment 1 is approved, Amendment 2 will already be in draft!

Seems like this thing is going to be constantly changing/evolving. And a digital subscription with the IET.

 

[snowhead]

The simple solution is to make all E.V Class 2.

 

[Julie.]

Actually it shouldn't be our Job! This shouldn't be in the wiring regs, it's a piece of equipment that we install/specify, just like any other piece of kit!

we don't look to the wiring regs to check and obtain the specifications for a 13A plug or socket outlet, and sit there coming up with a solution to provide shuttering when the plug is removed etc. there is a different standard, and this specifies all the technical details!, so it should be with EV points - just the same.

For us, we should just have something like "EV charge points shall be to BSEN12345678 parts 1, 2 or 3, Any charge point to part 1 shall be installed with a TT arrangement having ….. bla bla."

The whole self-contained charge point should have all it's required protection etc. built in; and just be like wiring in a cooker or similar, sure you need to provide protection to the cooker, but not beyond it!

 

[snowhead]

When, that's when not if, the grants for charge points stop and E.V's get lower into the second hand market more people are likely to just use an extension lead, potentially out of a non rcd socket, from inside a house.
Any the protection a charge point offers will then be pointless.

 

[Midwest]

Actually it shouldn't be our Job! This shouldn't be in the wiring regs, it's a piece of equipment that we install/specify, just like any other piece of kit!

we don't look to the wiring regs to check and obtain the specifications for a 13A plug or socket outlet, and sit there coming up with a solution to provide shuttering when the plug is removed etc. there is a different standard, and this specifies all the technical details!, so it should be with EV points - just the same.

For us, we should just have something like "EV charge points shall be to BSEN12345678 parts 1, 2 or 3, Any charge point to part 1 shall be installed with a TT arrangement having ….. bla bla."

The whole self-contained charge point should have all it's required protection etc. built in; and just be like wiring in a cooker or similar, sure you need to provide protection to the cooker, but not beyond it!

Thats a fair point, but the installer will be signing the certificate to say the ev install complies with bs7671. And if it does go wrong, the manufacture will just say it wasn’t installed correctly.

And when a sparks comes along at a later date, he/she will also have to make comment on this box of tricks and/or earth rod, cabling to it etc has been installed with correctly. And also whether the correct RCD has been installed, in relation to the characteristics of the particular ev vehicle.

With all these car manufacturers producing slightly different types of charging systems in their products, I don’t think there’s one ‘cap’ that’s gonna fix all. But then I’m no expert, just listening to what others more learned than me are talking about.

 

[snowhead]

And also whether the correct RCD has been installed, in relation to the characteristics of the particular ev vehicle.

That's going way beyond the realms of fixed wire testing, at best an E.V is a portable appliance.

If the RCD is specific, it may have been correct for the original car but not the current one or the next one or the visiting one.

It's just the same for testing whether the fault detection built into the charger is actually working, if it's all electronics then only the manufacturer could do that.
Fixed wiring tests would stop before the charger,same a cooker or boiler etc.

 

[Midwest]

That's going way beyond the realms of fixed wire testing, at best an E.V is a portable appliance.

If the RCD is specific, it may have been correct for the original car but not the current one or the next one or the visiting one.

It's just the same for testing whether the fault detection built into the charger is actually working, if it's all electronics then only the manufacturer could do that.
Fixed wiring tests would stop before the charger,same a cooker or boiler etc.

I don’t know, you guys do the EICR’s. But it’s mentioned in the draft, 722.531.3.101

 

[Julie.]

I don’t know, you guys do the EICR’s. But it’s mentioned in the draft, 722.531.3.101

Do you mean amendment 1 - that isn't a draft anymore, and my point isn't what is in the spec now, but what it should be.

When we sign off a design, we only cover those aspects of our design, we don't by signing off a design accept or certify the equipment manufacturer's responsibilities, when a socket outlet for example is installed we don't certify it for all the type tests etc. just that it was installed correctly and usual on-site tests.

It should be just the same with a charge point

 

[Midwest]

Do you mean amendment 1 - that isn't a draft anymore, and my point isn't what is in the spec now, but what it should be.

When we sign off a design, we only cover those aspects of our design, we don't by signing off a design accept or certify the equipment manufacturer's responsibilities, when a socket outlet for example is installed we don't certify it for all the type tests etc. just that it was installed correctly and usual on-site tests.

It should be just the same with a charge point

I not sure. Never done the EV course, but as a sole trader your installing a product that needs to comply with BS7671 and BSEN's etc, like a CU for example. You've not designed or manufactured the product, but confident its fit for purpose. Amendment 1, from what I've read seems a bit vague about where tis responsibility lies. Might be wrong, thats whey I'm curious.

 

[Julie.]

I not sure. Never done the EV course, but as a sole trader your installing a product that needs to comply with BS7671 and BSEN's etc, like a CU for example. You've not designed or manufactured the product, but confident its fit for purpose. Amendment 1, from what I've read seems a bit vague about where tis responsibility lies. Might be wrong, thats whey I'm curious.

Yeah, at the moment with so much of the design/requirement aspects in '7671 it does lean toward the installer being more responsible than the actual manufacturer !

That's why I think it shouldn't be any more than any other kit, a MCB is en 60898, providing the rating and installation is fine the distinction is clear, it's the manufacturers' responsibility beyond this. It should be the same for Charge points.

They are quite techy bits of kit (although actually all they do is present mains voltage to the vehicle - along with communications on available rating etc) - it's specialist stuff and shouldn't be up to the installer.