HELP! 2 way 2G dimmer with downlight!

[salmanhamid]

Hi All

Apologies if it is a basic question and has been discussed here before.

We are putting new spot lights in our bedroom and I am in the middle of buying all the stuff we need, we are putting 9 lights for the bedroom, GU10 240V with 50W lamps, outer 6 will work on 1 dimmer and inner 3 will work on one. My question is, is this dimmer suitable for what we are trying to do cause Im unable to find 2G 2W decorative dimmer in 400W all I can find is 250W one

Crabtree 2G 2W 250W Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

Any help and suggestion highly appreciated.

Thanks in advance and help

S

 

[jpm646]

No u have 300w on one dimmer and 150w on the other u should at least 1.5x the dimmer wattage I always double it 250w won't last long

 

[Des 56]

2 Gang 2 Way 400 Watt Dimmer
(10 seconds of Google time)

 

[topquark]

In a word no 6x50W = min 300W. You don't need it to be 2Way unless you are also incorporating a standard switch as well.

Something like this should do for the "outer 6": 1 Gang 2 Way 500w iQ Dimmer Switch

Don't forget this will need notifying to building control at your local council, that will add to your cost.

 

[salmanhamid]

Thank you! BUt what Im after is this finish

Crabtree 2G 2W 250W Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

2 Gang 2 Way 400 Watt Dimmer
(10 seconds of Google time)

 

[salmanhamid]

We are planning to having 2 dimmers in the room one above the bed and one at the entrance thats why wanted 2 way, is that not possible?

Do we need to tell building council that we are having spot lights?

In a word no 6x50W = min 300W. You don't need it to be 2Way unless you are also incorporating a standard switch as well.

Something like this should do for the "outer 6": 1 Gang 2 Way 500w iQ Dimmer Switch

Don't forget this will need notifying to building control at your local council, that will add to your cost.

 

[topquark]

Try screwfix:

GET 1-Gang 2-Way 400W Dimmer Neutral Ins Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

 

[Steve_P]

Found a few with the same search but adding black nickle on the end too.

 

[Des 56]

2 GANG 2 WAY DIMMER SWITCH, 400 WATT - BLACK NICKEL from The Door Handle Company
(another google moment)

Mine was dearer than topquarks because its better quality.

No,I am lying really,its just the profit margin is better

 

[topquark]

We are planning to having 2 dimmers in the room one above the bed and one at the entrance thats why wanted 2 way, is that not possible?

Do we need to tell building council that we are having spot lights?

Possible, yes. Will you get the result you desire, I doubt it! Put the simple on/off switch at the entrance to the room and the dimmers by the bed.

 

[JUD]

Don't forget this will need notifying to building control at your local council, that will add to your cost.

Not notifiable as it's an addition to a circuit NOT in a special location. Only non CE marked non pre-assembled ELV lighting is notifiable. The OP is using 240V GU10 lights.

 

[Plonker 3]

Do we need to tell building council that we are having spot lights?

No you don't have to tell them exactly what you are having. Part P only applies to new circuits, alterations in kitchens or special location in domestic dwelling premises

 

[salmanhamid]

Sounds like a plan but do you think 400W one will be enough then?

Possible, yes. Will you get the result you desire, I doubt it! Put the simple on/off switch at the entrance to the room and the dimmers by the bed.

 

[Des 56]

Black Nickel Dimmer 2 Gang 2 Way Push On/Off 1000W | eBay
( google No 3)

 

[topquark]

You have two controls to consider one governing 6x50W = 300W and one governing 3x50W=150. So 1x400W and 1x250W should do for the dimmers and then a 2g2w switch at the room entrance. The real question is which side of the bed do you place the dimmers

 

[salmanhamid]

You are a google man!!!

Black Nickel Dimmer 2 Gang 2 Way Push On/Off 1000W | eBay
( google No 3)

 

[salmanhamid]

And we certainly cannot have dimmers on both ends, has to be switch on one and dimmers on other?

You have two controls to consider one governing 6x50W = 300W and one governing 3x50W=150. So 1x400W and 1x250W should do for the dimmers and then a 2g2w switch at the room entrance. The real question is which side of the bed do you place the dimmers

 

[JUD]

Just a little warning.

When GU10 bulbs blow it creates a small surge that sometimes takes out the MCB/RCD and can also blow the dimmer switch at the same time.

This happened to a 1000W dimmer at my sister's house earlier this year.

 

[salmanhamid]

Ahhhhh....

Just a little warning.

When GU10 bulbs blow it creates a small surge that sometimes takes out the MCB/RCD and can also blow the dimmer switch at the same time.

This happened to a 1000W dimmer at my sister's house earlier this year.

- - - Updated - - -

It doesn't say anywhere in description if that is a one or 2 way dimmer!

http://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabtree-1g-400w-touch-dimmer-black-nickel/29850

 

[salmanhamid]

Crabtree 1G 400W Touch Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

It doesn't say anywhere in description if that is a one or 2 way dimmer!


Crabtree 1G 400W Touch Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

I have seen the above in screwfix this morning and it looks absolutely wonderful.

 

[salmanhamid]

Ahh I think I have found what I want,

Hamilton Sheer CFX Black Nickel Push On/Off 400W Dimmer 2 Gang 2 way with Black Nickel Insert, Dimmer Switches, UK Electrical Supplies

Screw less and black nickel it is 50W less then what exactly we want!

 

[Strima]

Crabtree 1G 400W Touch Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

It doesn't say anywhere in description if that is a one or 2 way dimmer!


Crabtree 1G 400W Touch Dimmer Black Nickel | NoLinkingToThis

I have seen the above in screwfix this morning and it looks absolutely wonderful.

According to the instructions, posted on the pages, they're one way switches.

 

[Taylortwocities]

No you don't have to tell them exactly what you are having. Part P only applies to new circuits, alterations in kitchens or special location in domestic dwelling premises

That is absolutely not true.
Building Regulations Part P relates to electrical safety. ALL electrical work done in domestic premises must comply with Part P.

By law, SOME of this electrical work is notifiable to the local authority.

The list of what is and isn't notifiable is contained in the Part P document. Some downlight installations are notifiable in any room of a house.

 

[JUD]

Some downlight installations are notifiable in any room of a house.

Only ELV lighting that isn't CE marked and pre-assembled is notifiable as i said above (post #11). The OP is using 240V GU10 downlights.

What Dillb was saying is that this particular job is NOT notifiable as it doesn't include the provision of a new circuit, isn't a special installation and isn't in a special location.

ALL electrical work done in domestic premises must comply with Part P.

All electrical work done in domestic dwellings must comply with BS 7671:2008. Complying with Part P means notifying to LABC when required to.

 

[jase]

look on tlc direct website, you can get Master and slave dimmers made by varilight in their IQ range
these also have a remote control option, also how about using LED's? bit pricier but you wont have to worry about the wattage, as you could use 9 or 11 watt lamps, just make sure you get compatible lamps and switches.

 

[telectrix]

i too would go with GU10 LEDs. ( 5watt 0r 7watt ) but make sure that they're dimmable and the dimmers are suitable for LEDs

 

[salmanhamid]

I don't mind LED but then I'll be back to square one to find compatible dimmers and bulbs in the finish I like

 

[Taylortwocities]

Only ELV lighting that isn't CE marked and pre-assembled is notifiable as i said above (post #11). The OP is using 240V GU10 downlights.

What Dillb was saying is that this particular job is NOT notifiable as it doesn't include the provision of a new circuit, isn't a special installation and isn't in a special location.



All electrical work done in domestic dwellings must comply with BS 7671:2008. Complying with Part P means notifying to LABC when required to.

I don't want to be pedantic, as I am new around here, but I run across this confusion a lot.

You and dillb should read what the regulation says. In particular P1.
P1 says
"Reasonable provision shall be made in the design and installation of electrical installations in order to protect persons operating, maintaining or altering the installations from fire or injury."

The main method adopted by the industry to comply with P1 is to work to BS7671, this calls for the electrical work to be inspected, tested and the relevent certifion issued.
BS7671 is mentioned in the legislation as one way of complying with electrical safety.
If you don't work to BS7671 (or another recognised standard) you may find it difficult to prove compliance with P1.
P1 is a requirement for all electrical work in domestic dwellings in England/Wales whether it is notifiable or not.


Notifiction of certain electrical work is also a requirement of Building Regulations Part P. Part P is not just about notification.

Read more: Part P: no need to notify same as no need to certify? - DIYnot.com - DIY and Home Improvement
​

 

[JUD]

I don't want to be pedantic, as I am new around here, but I run across this confusion a lot.

You and dillb should read what the regulation says. In particular P1.
P1 says
"Reasonable provision shall be made in the design and installation of electrical installations in order to protect persons operating, maintaining or altering the installations from fire or injury."

The main method adopted by the industry to comply with P1 is to work to BS7671, this calls for the electrical work to be inspected, tested and the relevent certifion issued.
BS7671 is mentioned in the legislation as one way of complying with electrical safety.
If you don't work to BS7671 (or another recognised standard) you may find it difficult to prove compliance with P1.
P1 is a requirement for all electrical work in domestic dwellings in England/Wales whether it is notifiable or not.


Notifiction of certain electrical work is also a requirement of Building Regulations Part P. Part P is not just about notification.

Read more: Part P: no need to notify same as no need to certify? - DIYnot.com - DIY and Home Improvement
​

As BS761 (along with other parts of the building regulations) is mentioned in nearly every paragraph of Part P, I say again. All electrical work in dwellings should comply with BS 7671:2008 and certain jobs should be notified to LABC under Part P.

Most of Part P is telling you that you must comply with other regulations. The only thing you must do with regards to Part P alone is notify relevant jobs to LABC IMO.

 

[telectrix]

agreed^^^^^^. and certification is optional if the job is replacing an accessory without altering a circuit.

 

[Tonkatoy27]

2 dimmers at either end of a 2way circuit will not work properly. If it's turned down at one end then how are you going to turn it back up at the other?

As said, you want a 2gang 2way switch at one end and a 2gang 2way 400 or 500watt dimmer at the other.

I'm always having to change brand new dimmer switches under warrentee when the halogen or tungsten lamp blows and knackers it which is a bit unfair on me and the wholesaler but not worth an argument with the customer.

I'd use LED, the dimmers won't have to be special, just get dimmable LED lamps and enjoy the energy saving.

I presume you are wiring this yourself, are you going to test and fill out the minor works certificates as well? Nobody else should be willing to test it and sign certificates for you.

By the way, testing is not rubbish, it makes sure your work is safe for energisation and safe for you and your family to use.

Good luck

 

[salmanhamid]

Any recommendation for dimmable LEDs, I don't want white light though?

 

[Tonkatoy27]

KTC4.5DIM Kosnic 4.5W dimmable in 3500K color, warm white I stock Kosnic and have had no problems. Stay away from any LED lamp costing less than £15 each reatil. I've changed loads of cheap ones inside of 12months. Non dimmable 5watt Kosnic cost £15-£17 each retail. Not sure on dimmable.

 

[JUD]

Any recommendation for dimmable LEDs, I don't want white light though?

HUGE DISCOUNTS on GU10 LED Bulb 220 Lumens 45W Equiv

 

[sedgy34]

So he's trying to 2way a dimmer across the room with another dimmer????

 

[Tonkatoy27]

So he's trying to 2way a dimmer across the room with another dimmer????

Thats what it sounds like, problems ahoy!

 

[Dave 85]

We are planning to having 2 dimmers in the room one above the bed and one at the entrance thats why wanted 2 way, is that not possible?

Do we need to tell building council that we are having spot lights?

No you dont need to tell bloody building control. Thats a goddamned lie! Its your house, do as you like.
You cant have two standard dimmers operating the same light, you want a 400w 2 gang dimmer at one end and a 2 gang switch at the other. If you cant get a 400w 2g dimmer in the style you want you can just buy a cheapo plastic one and swap the two modules onto the decorative plate (pull the knob off undo the nut, easy)

 

[Dave 85]

Any recommendation for dimmable LEDs, I don't want white light though?

I use JCC fireguard LED7 warm white dimmable downlights. You can get em about £45-£50 each but they are very good and you never have to change a bulb.

 

[Taylortwocities]

The Varilight (Crabtree brand them) dimmers are available as master/slave pairs so you can dim from either end.

Two notes though:
1. The circuit needs to be wired to enable the Varilight way of working - some 2-way lighting circuitry doesn't comply.
2. You cannot use the Varilight/Crabtree dimmer in a 2-way circuit with a standard 2-way switch at the other end.